Electric cars are a massive con.
Discussion
Article in the Sunday times today.
Professor Roger Kemp said:
Swapping gas guzzlers for electric vehicles will not solve our carbon emissions problem on it's own. When most electricity in Britain is still generated by burning gas and coal, the difference between an electric car and a small low-emission petrol or diesel car is negligible
Richard Pike said:
cars generate around 12% of the UK's carbon emissions.....If every car on the road were electric that would be reduced to about 10%
Ignoring the well worn arguments about whether CO2 is responsible for global warming, isn't it wrong that governments across Europe are funding schemes to encourage people to use electric cars ?Baffled Spoon said:
I'm more curious about how the government will deal with the billions in fuel duty and tax (on the fuel duty) that it will lose if it gets everyone to drive an electric car. It's actually amusing that they are subsidising the thing that will harm their tax take too.
Do not worry about this! They will find a way! Well, I suppose their thinking is that they'll move electricity generation over to "greener" means eg wind farms, solar farms.
Baffled Spoon said:
I'm more curious about how the government will deal with the billions in fuel duty and tax (on the fuel duty) that it will lose if it gets everyone to drive an electric car. It's actually amusing that they are subsidising the thing that will harm their tax take too.
Well, you know what will happen when everyone is driving electric cars...GroundEffect said:
But we are going to run out of oil within the next 100 years. It's good that we get a head-start on its replacement, no?
Of course, unless they invent a renewable source of fuel. It's funny you say 100 years. I don't know what they're teaching at school these days but back in 1985, we were taught oil had about 25 years. PANIC!!!In fact, 1985... oil 25 years, gas 60 years, coal 300 years.</teacher's pet> Any updates?
Interesting views.
It's well known (I thought?) that cars make up a v small proportion of the CO2 "problem", the trouble is that the motorist is an easy target for green taxes as (a) there are so many of us (b) in isolation there's little we can do about it. IMHO green taxes on cars is a huge great stitch up with the Govt strategy being simply to rob the motorist of as much cash as possible
A view from my crystal ball - when we eventually switch over to an alternative to petrol they'll just start taxing that
TX.
It's well known (I thought?) that cars make up a v small proportion of the CO2 "problem", the trouble is that the motorist is an easy target for green taxes as (a) there are so many of us (b) in isolation there's little we can do about it. IMHO green taxes on cars is a huge great stitch up with the Govt strategy being simply to rob the motorist of as much cash as possible
A view from my crystal ball - when we eventually switch over to an alternative to petrol they'll just start taxing that
TX.
Strawman said:
Ignoring the well worn arguments about whether CO2 is responsible for global warming, isn't it wrong that governments across Europe are funding schemes to encourage people to use electric cars ?
More to the point, the percentages they are giving is percentage of anthropogenic co2 emissions (man made), I think if they gave the figures for emissions from vehicles as a percentage of actual co2 emissions it would be divided by around 100!.It's like when they talk about co2s importance as a greenhouse gas, they only make it an important greenhouse gas by totally ignoring water vapour which has by far the greatest greenhouse gas effect, but again is an 'inconvenient truth'!
Terminator X said:
Interesting views.
It's well known (I thought?) that cars make up a v small proportion of the CO2 "problem", the trouble is that the motorist is an easy target for green taxes as (a) there are so many of us (b) in isolation there's little we can do about it. IMHO green taxes on cars is a huge great stitch up with the Govt strategy being simply to rob the motorist of as much cash as possible
A view from my crystal ball - when we eventually switch over to an alternative to petrol they'll just start taxing that
TX.
Drivers have always been the golden goose for squeezing a little extra cash out without upsetting anyone with any influence. Governments worry that one day drivers will organise themselves as a lobby group. But it won't happen.It's well known (I thought?) that cars make up a v small proportion of the CO2 "problem", the trouble is that the motorist is an easy target for green taxes as (a) there are so many of us (b) in isolation there's little we can do about it. IMHO green taxes on cars is a huge great stitch up with the Govt strategy being simply to rob the motorist of as much cash as possible
A view from my crystal ball - when we eventually switch over to an alternative to petrol they'll just start taxing that
TX.
GroundEffect said:
But we are going to run out of oil within the next 100 years. It's good that we get a head-start on its replacement, no?
Quite right, though i suspect that the replacement is not an issue remotely, it's already there, but being suppressed, for the very good reason that the world economies currently depend on oil revenues and taxation of oil, if a cheap alternative was released and made available too quickly it would lead to economic carnage.Interestingly there seems to be no real focus on the fact that we've been through all of this before, when we were dependent on whale fat for heating and lighting oil, capacity was running out, the fuel itself was not great, and then crude oil was discovered.
The solution is the easy part, and I'm sure we already have it, the economics are the only issue!
RemainAllHoof said:
Of course, unless they invent a renewable source of fuel. It's funny you say 100 years. I don't know what they're teaching at school these days but back in 1985, we were taught oil had about 25 years. PANIC!!!
In fact, 1985... oil 25 years, gas 60 years, coal 300 years.</teacher's pet> Any updates?
It's a no brainer that we'll run out one day of course! Hard to predict (see your estimates above) albeit technology is always improving meaning oil deposits that were hard to reach in 1985 are reasonably easy today.In fact, 1985... oil 25 years, gas 60 years, coal 300 years.</teacher's pet> Any updates?
Interesting article here that predicts we'll never run out due to supply vs demand:
http://economics.about.com/cs/macroeconomics/a/run...
TX.
It's a valid point currently. But there are ways to generate electricity that don't rely on fossil fuels and if we were to switch over to those then electric cars would start to make a lot of sense.
Even as it is, they take the emissions away from the smog-bound city centres and I'd hazard a guess that power stations are significantly more efficient than the average IC engine still, especially when you consider all the stop-start driving in town and losses this incurs with a piston engine.
Financially - and to a lesser extent environmentally - they are a bit of a false economy at the moment, yes. But they have the potential to dramatically improve on both points, while we're getting diminishing returns on what we can do with pure petrol engines.
Even as it is, they take the emissions away from the smog-bound city centres and I'd hazard a guess that power stations are significantly more efficient than the average IC engine still, especially when you consider all the stop-start driving in town and losses this incurs with a piston engine.
Financially - and to a lesser extent environmentally - they are a bit of a false economy at the moment, yes. But they have the potential to dramatically improve on both points, while we're getting diminishing returns on what we can do with pure petrol engines.
marcusRR said:
Nah , just build a few nuclear power plants...CO2 problem sorted.
This is probably what needs to happen - and soon (especially with a lot of current nuclear capacity coming to the end of its life). Politically unpopular with many though (but so are wind turbines and tidal barrages).Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff