New Car Hire company at the ring

[Hopko]

Hello Everyone

Im in the process of starting up a new car hire business at the ring and just wanted to ask yo guys what sort of cars you would be interested in. I want to start off with more affordable prices for everyone so all can enjoy. I was thingking of some modern classics but if i can get some input of what you would like t see that would be great

Thanks

Hopko

[williaa68]

Firstly, good luck in the venture. It'd be good to inject some competition into this market. For me it isnt so much the cars but the terms that matter. I'd like to take a GT3 around the ring but not risking a EUR15k excess. It doesnt need to be a spanking new 7.2GT3RS either - a 996 Mk1 would be fine...

[Evo]

If it's people's first time out to the Ring i would have thought that a belt and braces insurance package providing all the relevant cover will come high up on the list. I'd be more than happy driving even something like a Clio Cup as it's the experience i'm after not seeing how fast I can go, and we all have seen what can happen when people try too hard. I'm never going to break any lap records so having good cover and a decent handling car to enjoy the whole experience would be top of my priorities.

On GT5 i've done 2000+ laps of the Ring and go round it most nights, I will do the "real" experience as soon as funds allow and can't wait for it.

The best of luck to you and maybe i'll see you out there when your up and running.

[SpeedyDave]

williaa68 said:

Firstly, good luck in the venture. It'd be good to inject some competition into this market. For me it isnt so much the cars but the terms that matter. I'd like to take a GT3 around the ring but not risking a EUR15k excess. It doesnt need to be a spanking new 7.2GT3RS either - a 996 Mk1 would be fine...

Its not like there is a monopoly there (well, as long as N.GmbH doesn't decide to squeeze the independants out). The main players (Rent4Ring, RSR, Rent-Racecar) certainly aren't 'cosy' with each other, and there are a few other biz in the area that dabble with a couple of cars too.

€15k excess on a GT3 is too steep? Um, no one is even offering that. €15k is about MeganeR26.R money, GT3 excess start at €45k...

If you're a credible customer you might be able to buy extra insurance to get a GT3 excess down to something like €15k, expect to pay at least €400 on top of the rental costs though!

Edited by SpeedyDave on Monday 16th May 12:15

[DiscoColin]

Don't get anything that is too much of a classic - it will be that much more of a shame when someone crashes it...

The most conspicuous niche to my mind is for something RWD, not overly powerful and not overly difficult to drive (something like the Rent-Racecar 120i, which is practically unique in that niche but always seems to be out there). Good luck though - there is a reason why nobody offers an excess below €2500 and most are much more... It is admirable to be thinking about offering something different, but whenever people ask me about renting they want low cost, low excess and a safe car above all else.

[jimbobs]

For me, the FWD hatches at the budget end of the market just don't appeal but a small RWD coupe or sports car really would.

Now a Beemer z3 1.9 might not be everyone's dream car but must be cheap & plentiful in Germany. Failing that, the obvious PH choice of a MX5??

[Evo]

MX5 would be a very good choice at the budget end.

[GreigM]

How about westfield/caterham or other 7-style cars.....great fun at the ring.

[S1MMA]

Agree with MX5 suggestion for budget.

Also maybe E36 M3 for intermediate option. There's a few avail for hire on UK trackdays, run well, quick, well balanced and parts will be cheap in germany.

Good two cars to start with I think?

[SpeedyDave]

jimbobs said:

For me, the FWD hatches at the budget end of the market just don't appeal but a small RWD coupe or sports car really would.

Now a Beemer z3 1.9 might not be everyone's dream car but must be cheap & plentiful in Germany. Failing that, the obvious PH choice of a MX5??

Have you tried them though? I understand the sentiment, but when you feel how sharp they are on track suspension / semi slicks etc it's nothing like a plain road car.

BMW 120i is twice the price to rent, only 40bhp more pulling an extra 300kg. The z3 is going to similar

[tertius]

SpeedyDave said:

Have you tried them though? I understand the sentiment, but when you feel how sharp they are on track suspension / semi slicks etc it's nothing like a plain road car.
T
BMW 120i is twice the price to rent, only 40bhp more pulling an extra 300kg. The z3 is going to similar

Going from memory here so could be wrong but I seem to recall the 120i is 470/day and the Swifts are c. 300. I have rented both and personally I would take the 120i every time. Not because the Swift is a bad car, far from it they are brilliant little cars and great value, but I prefer RWD.

To the OP I think you need to look very carefully at the market and see where you are pitching yourself. I really doubt if you can address the excess issue - there are several companies in the market and they all run similar excesses. I don't that's because they are all in cahoots ...

I agree with DC, there is a gap for the affordable RWD car. I would think about a number of E46 coupes - similar parts/consumables, plenty about, etc.

[skodamanpat]

A well prepped original mini cooper would be a reasonable affordable place to start with good handling, stripped out and caged, of course you would have to stop it dumping the sump contents at random.

A 2cv could be hilarious but you would need to enhance the crash safety.

I would deffo go down the cheap is better and provide a comprehensive insurance option with a sensible excess.

[SpeedyDave]

tertius said:

Going from memory here so could be wrong but I seem to recall the 120i is 470/day and the Swifts are c. 300.

Nah, the 120i is 540/day, although I was comparing the half day (6 lap) rates, which are €200 vs €400 for Swift and 120i respectively.

tertius said:

but I prefer RWD.

I hear ya, but at 170bhp / 1300kg its not really enough to make the rwd arguement compelling to me, unless its wet

tertius said:

several companies in the market and they all run similar excesses.

Ayup, they are pretty even across the vendors for similar cars although the Swift stands out as a low water mark in this respect;

Swift €2500 & 21 min age.
120i €8000 & 25 min age.

tertius said:

I agree with DC, there is a gap for the affordable RWD car. I would think about a number of E46 coupes - similar parts/consumables, plenty about, etc.

Agreed. It will never be as cheap as simple FWD stuff as;

1. Vendors can buy little fwd boxes waaay cheaper and have heaps to choose from.
2. Running costs are much lower
3. Bit less crashable in the hands of average punters.

A fleet of E46 does seem like a good idea, would be nice to see them with mid size engines.

[tertius]

SpeedyDave said:

tertius said:

Going from memory here so could be wrong but I seem to recall the 120i is 470/day and the Swifts are c. 300.

Nah, the 120i is 540/day, although I was comparing the half day (6 lap) rates, which are €200 vs €400 for Swift and 120i respectively.

Its gone up then - I've rented it for 4 days in total and I'm 99% certain I paid 470/day. Was a couple of years ago mind, and so not at all surprising.

SpeedyDave said:

tertius said:

but I prefer RWD.

I hear ya, but at 170bhp / 1300kg its not really enough to make the rwd arguement compelling to me, unless its wet

However, it is a great car to drive, well balanced and very forgiving. Moreover last time I soke to Theo he thought it was making more than 170, and given it has very little interior and only two buckets it might be a smidge under 1300 kgs

SpeedyDave said:

tertius said:

several companies in the market and they all run similar excesses.

Ayup, they are pretty even across the vendors for similar cars although the Swift stands out as a low water mark in this respect;

Swift €2500 & 21 min age.
120i €8000 & 25 min age.

Does that vary with which Swift it is though? When I , err, ahem, crashed one, the excess was definitely 5k. Not something I'm likely to forget. Again a few years ago now.

SpeedyDave said:

tertius said:

I agree with DC, there is a gap for the affordable RWD car. I would think about a number of E46 coupes - similar parts/consumables, plenty about, etc.

Agreed. It will never be as cheap as simple FWD stuff as;

1. Vendors can buy little fwd boxes waaay cheaper and have heaps to choose from.
2. Running costs are much lower
3. Bit less crashable in the hands of average punters.

A fleet of E46 does seem like a good idea, would be nice to see them with mid size engines.

Agreed completely, but I really would be surprised if a newcomer can beat the rent4ring offering on the Swifts - they are astonishing value. So you need to be targeting a different sector/price point. In my opinion.

I would also highlight the other key point that needs to be delivered on is service. Having dealt with all the major players, they all really go out of their way to help people out - even those that aren't (currently) renting from them. Both rent4ring and RSR have been amazingly helpful when I've had problems with my own car whilst there.

[SpeedyDave]

tertius said:

Its gone up then - I've rented it for 4 days in total and I'm 99% certain I paid 470/day. Was a couple of years ago mind, and so not at all surprising.

Great value at €470, and still pretty good at €540. Good alternative to the Clios at about the same price.

tertius said:

Does that vary with which Swift it is though? When I , err, ahem, crashed one, the excess was definitely 5k. Not something I'm likely to forget. Again a few years ago now.

€2500 excess on all Swifts at Rent4Ring (stg1 & stg2).
€5k is the Swift excess at Rent-Racecar.

Dunno whats up with that other than R4R must have a spectacularly friendly underwriter

tertius said:

Agreed completely, but I really would be surprised if a newcomer can beat the rent4ring offering on the Swifts - they are astonishing value. So you need to be targeting a different sector/price point. In my opinion.

Yeah the inexpensive FWD part of the market is very well covered with Swift, Corsa, Clio, Golf, etc from all vendors. Definitely a gap in mid range RWD. Rent-Racecar seem to be the only ones really trying to cover that with E46 325 / Z4 3.0 / E90 330i. R4R don't do anything RWD and RSR fleet jumps straight to M3 & GT3 at circa €1.5k per day.

Actually that 330i is looking like a prime drive to me. €700 for 270bhp, an M3 at twice the price seems unnecessary.

tertius said:

I would also highlight the other key point that needs to be delivered on is service. Having dealt with all the major players, they all really go out of their way to help people out - even those that aren't (currently) renting from them. Both rent4ring and RSR have been amazingly helpful when I've had problems with my own car whilst there.

Yeah, and with most business in the region closed after Saturday lunchtime the rental companies have been a trip-saver for a lot of people.

[agtlaw]

you should get a fleet a mk1 Clio V6s.

[VTECMatt]

Cars I have enjoyed at The Ring:

MX5
Clio Cup (Latest Version)
R26.R
Subaru WRX for Wet days
S1 Elise 140bhp
S2 Elise 111S
S2 Elise 160bhp
S2 Exige 240PP
996RS
Honda Civic Type R (b16b)

Some things I would take into consideration is how reliable and expensive it is to replace parts, gearboxes, wings etc. I also think it is nice to rent something a little but different and then how much and how long consumables last.

On the cheap end of the scale you wouldnt go far wrong buying a couple of the EK4 VTI's or DC2's stripped, caged, coilovers and semis with a wet option really quick cars.
RWD an MX5, coilovers and caged a great little car but under powered for the Ring or another option a 330D, paxed in Matt Oz's many moons ago.

The Elise's are all brilliant but can be expensive to fix, consumables low and can be a little unreliable and to the inexperienced can catch them out.

[g40steve]

How about the mk3 2.o sport mx5's?
Rodders on here builds race cars for the Max5 series.
Very reliable, good drive & safe with cage etc.
Just a thought.

[g40steve]

How about the mk3 2.o sport mx5's?
Rodders on here builds race cars for the Max5 series.
Very reliable, good drive & safe with cage etc.
Just a thought.

[Antj]

Hopko said:

Hello Everyone

Im in the process of starting up a new car hire business at the ring and just wanted to ask yo guys what sort of cars you would be interested in. I want to start off with more affordable prices for everyone so all can enjoy. I was thingking of some modern classics but if i can get some input of what you would like t see that would be great

Thanks

Hopko

good luck,

I saw the politics involved in doing such a venture and the money required to do it. All i can say is unless you got deep pockets and very very good connections this venture won;t get far.

Saying that, good luck though if you do.