Porsche in USA - BAD results in JD Power survey!
Discussion
Hi - at the barbers yesterday (alright - unisex salon, I'll tell the truth!) and read in a french motoring mag that Porsche in the USA have had a catastrophic result in the latest JD Power Initial Quality survey (www.jdpa.com/presspass/pr/images/2004037cfull.gif). They are down in 34th position out of 36, because of quality problems stemming from the Cayenne (so the magazine said).
Time will tell - could be that the increased profitability at Porsche due to sales of these lorries will have a longer term negative affect on sales, due to quality problems?
Having said that, I don't know where they were placed in previous surveys. It is just my perception that with their reputation for reliability (at least with the 911) surely one would have expected them to better placed?
Nel
Edited to say well done Jaguar, even if they are selling Mondeos...
>>> Edited by nel on Thursday 20th May 10:27
Time will tell - could be that the increased profitability at Porsche due to sales of these lorries will have a longer term negative affect on sales, due to quality problems?
Having said that, I don't know where they were placed in previous surveys. It is just my perception that with their reputation for reliability (at least with the 911) surely one would have expected them to better placed?
Nel
Edited to say well done Jaguar, even if they are selling Mondeos...
>>> Edited by nel on Thursday 20th May 10:27
Being in the automotive industry I was one of the first to see these results. Jaguar came third from the top and Porsche did indeed come near the bottom-below Land Rover., I believe the bottom most was Hummer.
Now just a quick point, I just wanted to say that Jaguar don’t sell Mondeos, I hear this time and time again and think it is a little unfair. There is less the 20 % commonality with parts between the Jag X type and Mondeo even the engines are quite different (cyl head, ports, valves, cams, pistons, cranks EMS, intake manifold, exhaust), and the X type is four wheel drive which means it doesn’t even share the same suspension componentry with the Mondeo Saloon.
It is unfortunate but true that when a manufacturer launches a new vehicle it is normal for Things-Gone-Wrong or TGW to go up slightly and usually the level drops as time goes by. It’s probaby unfortunate that this JD Power survey occurred very close to the launch of the Cayenne and Porsche came very low as a result of this. There are good launchs and bad launchs-the latest Jaguar XJ series is an example of a good launch.
Perhaps Porsches quality levels have dropped, I have heard some criticisms from local specialists, but I’m trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.
The next point is how valid is the JD Power survey- I mean it looks at how satisfied a customer is with their car- so the expectations of the customer are a variable too. It could mean that people who purchase Porsches are a choosey and finneky bunch and those that buy Hyunndai only want an A to B machine and are usually pleasantly surpised as a result. The JD Power survey often looks at 3 MIS or 3 Months in Service –monitoring customer complaints, in this time span to my mind it may as well be 3 minutes in service! The connection between 3 MIS and a few years of good hard use is a tenuous one. The other point is weighting, a customer in the US may complain about the cup holders not being big enough on their car and another customer somewhere else may complain about an engine failure that leaves the car immobile for several months-do you think they should be equally weighted? I don’t!
And finally a little tip I use before buying a car, since engine problems are the things I fear most- If it happens to be say a Porsche 993 turbo Im buying , I’ll type into Google “Porsche 993 turbo M64/60 engine failure” – (M64/60 is the type name for the engine in this case) that way I’ll get a list of posts, perhaps in forums referencing issues on the above. Try the above and then repeat it with “BMW M3 S54 engine failures” and compare the results!
You get a feel for any issues out there and can learn quite a lot. Interestingly, people often won’t stop raving about the reliability of Japanese cars – and for good reason too I’m sure, but nothing is ever that clear cut, just type in “Toyota Engine failures” and see how many references you get to “sludging up”.
Just some thought provoking food for thought!
Now just a quick point, I just wanted to say that Jaguar don’t sell Mondeos, I hear this time and time again and think it is a little unfair. There is less the 20 % commonality with parts between the Jag X type and Mondeo even the engines are quite different (cyl head, ports, valves, cams, pistons, cranks EMS, intake manifold, exhaust), and the X type is four wheel drive which means it doesn’t even share the same suspension componentry with the Mondeo Saloon.
It is unfortunate but true that when a manufacturer launches a new vehicle it is normal for Things-Gone-Wrong or TGW to go up slightly and usually the level drops as time goes by. It’s probaby unfortunate that this JD Power survey occurred very close to the launch of the Cayenne and Porsche came very low as a result of this. There are good launchs and bad launchs-the latest Jaguar XJ series is an example of a good launch.
Perhaps Porsches quality levels have dropped, I have heard some criticisms from local specialists, but I’m trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.
The next point is how valid is the JD Power survey- I mean it looks at how satisfied a customer is with their car- so the expectations of the customer are a variable too. It could mean that people who purchase Porsches are a choosey and finneky bunch and those that buy Hyunndai only want an A to B machine and are usually pleasantly surpised as a result. The JD Power survey often looks at 3 MIS or 3 Months in Service –monitoring customer complaints, in this time span to my mind it may as well be 3 minutes in service! The connection between 3 MIS and a few years of good hard use is a tenuous one. The other point is weighting, a customer in the US may complain about the cup holders not being big enough on their car and another customer somewhere else may complain about an engine failure that leaves the car immobile for several months-do you think they should be equally weighted? I don’t!
And finally a little tip I use before buying a car, since engine problems are the things I fear most- If it happens to be say a Porsche 993 turbo Im buying , I’ll type into Google “Porsche 993 turbo M64/60 engine failure” – (M64/60 is the type name for the engine in this case) that way I’ll get a list of posts, perhaps in forums referencing issues on the above. Try the above and then repeat it with “BMW M3 S54 engine failures” and compare the results!
You get a feel for any issues out there and can learn quite a lot. Interestingly, people often won’t stop raving about the reliability of Japanese cars – and for good reason too I’m sure, but nothing is ever that clear cut, just type in “Toyota Engine failures” and see how many references you get to “sludging up”.
Just some thought provoking food for thought!
Touche Marquis Rex - 'twas indeed a cheap shot at Jaguar and I hope they go from strength to strength. As I understand it the platform for the X-type was common with the Mondeo - didn't stop a friend who bought one being pleased as punch!
I recognise the subjective nature of the JD power surveys - out of curiosity, how were Porsche placed in the US survey last year?
Nel
I recognise the subjective nature of the JD power surveys - out of curiosity, how were Porsche placed in the US survey last year?
Nel
I wasn't trying to come across as acidic or anything Nel-wasn't intended at a dig at your post at all,just that i've come across alot of folk rubbishing Porsches while praising Toyotas and things using the JD Power survey purely as evidence. I'll have a look around and find out how Porsche came out last year.
nel said:
Edited to say well done Jaguar, even if they are selling Mondeos...
easy tiger... mondeos are damn fine cars for the money. well balanced, well put together. jaguars (at least the xkr i had) was like driving a wallowy barge. yuk. steering all floppy and uninvolving. good in a striaght line though.
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