Spa time-table

[panic458]

Just found this:

http://www.race-rally.be/images//SER%2011%20%20-%2...

Says our race is only 100 minutes long. 6pm finish.
Combined practice with DSC should be fun, good job its a big circuit.

[gtdc]

100 mins? The regs say 2 hours and now we've got proper regs I don't think it can just be changed like that.

[Racing Rod]

What if the circuit impose a shorter race time and then give a touch more practice,( albeit joint with DSC) and qualifying time to make up the difference, this is just the type of thing that can happen with Spa so may not have Britcar agreement if indeed they even know about the "suggested" timetable changes.

I'm sure that Britcar still regard this as a 120min race as this is what they signed up for and will be charging us for but Spa will look at it as "time bought" and not necessarily as race time bought !!!!! If this is a confirmed timetable, I'm quite sure James will be having words for as stated, they, like us, are working on the original agreement for a full 2 hour race.

Lets see how this one plays out

[gtdc]

A while to go yet.

[S C Head]

Britcar now have the race listed as 100min on the website.... That's a long way to go for a relatively short time in the car, along with huge costs..... One hour each (two drivers) was kinda tight let alone cutting the race shorter! WTF
See y'all at Thruxton
Sam

[Britcar David]

Information update on the Spa timetable will be coming out to everyone today. I'll also post a link here to the item when it goes onto the website.

[gtdc]

It would be very nice to get the info from Britcar BEFORE someone finds out from the internet.

[Britcar David]

As ever we were waiting for signed contracts from the circuit to confirm anything before we made any announcements.

[Britcar David]

The official notification from Britcar regarding the change of timetabled race length can be found on the Britcar website here: http://www.britcar24hr.co.uk/cms/news.php?item.1098.1

Copied below for your information:

As many people have seen, the Spa timetable has been released by Race-Rally.be and shows the Britcar race as 100mins rather than 120mins as was originally advertised in our regulations.

Whilst we appreciate it is of no real consolation we have been given a longer test session than we were originally to be offered and Spa have taken the view that the purchased track time is the same for Britcar as originally requested.

Spa have not given us the splits of track time as we ordered from them despite assurances we would get what we asked for. When the timetable was released we were surprised as well as to the splits of the race time and we have discussed the situation with Spa themselves. Whilst in the past we have been given a good slot on the Saturday evening to be able to run into the early evening the recent noise issues that Spa have experienced have resulted in an earlier curfew for the track on many weekends of the year, unfortunately the Spa Euro Race weekend is one of those weekends with a 6pm curfew. The format of the race weekend is, to a certain extent, dictated by the TV requirements of some of the other series that are racing that weekend which has led to our rather unfortunate slot at the end of the day on Saturday and Sunday.

We have been advised that if there are any issues with other races before the event we will be the beneficiary of any additional track time that becomes available and we will advise you before the event if this situation arises.

Regarding the race lengths being different from the published regulations, the Championship Clerk has advised that the race length can be altered at any time before the event or on the race day itself with the agreement of the Championship Stewards.

If you haven’t already done so please contact [e-mail] to book your garage. We are based in the Endurance Pits for the weekend however you will need to book your garage with Emilie to be able to use one. Spa will charge you for the use of the garage. Once you have booked your garage we will allocate it to you. If you have any special request as to your position in the pitlane or who you want to be near please advise Bianca via [e-mail].

The paddock is open for access from 20:00 – 24:00 on Thursday 23rd June, 07:30 – 19:00 on Friday to Sunday.

Tickets and passes are available from the Welcome Centre as per the link below: http://www.race-rally.be/images//SER011%20welcome%...

Other useful information can be found at the organisers website http://www.race-rally.be/2011/ser2011/page.aspx?pa...

In addition the Britcar site also has all the timetables and maps for the event available here: http://britcar24hr.co.uk/cms/e107_plugins/content/...

[phildryburgh]

I assume if there are any delays during the day resulting in a later start to the Britcar race it will still be flagged at 6?

[Britcar David]

Unfortunately I suspect that is the case however they have inserted 20 mins between each race instead of the usual 15 for clear up to assist plus many of the races during the day have specific start times to coincide with TV commitments in Europe. I believe we would only face this situation if there are significant delays in the Maserati or F2 races immediately ahead of us.

[Racing Rod]

phildryburgh said:

I assume if there are any delays during the day resulting in a later start to the Britcar race it will still be flagged at 6?

I think that just about sums it up, for being the last series on the listings, any problems during the day will fall on us, it's called the stty end of the stick. Spa have reduced our race time by 16.67%, forget the so called add on's elsewhere as the practice is shared with DSC and qualifying is too short anyway to get 3 drivers in and out.

Will they now reduce our entry fee by this percentage, will they hell. We will probably lose more of our time if as suggested above there are incidents that cause delays, and with DSC racing, that's bound to happen. Last time I was there, DSC managed to write off the safety car by someone landing on top of it having used another car as a launch ramp and during SC /yellows.

One of the things that I have learnt on many occasions during my business life is that given a bad position early in any process, things can only get worse despite all efforts to remain positive, for when someone else holds the stick, they are hardly going to surprise you by holding it upright and allowing their hands to get covered in crap, life just isn't like that.

The odds are that if Britcar take this lying down and accept the Spa complied compromise as it now stands, then things will only get worse, for without insisting that having taken a cut in race time, we should at least be moved up the timetable so that we don't get hit again by a track time out. Let some other series take that risk as they are not having to amend their race time, yet anyway !!!.

By insisting on this now, Britcar could place us in the position of not being penalised again, and although not guaranteed,It would be a lot fairer then keeping us where we are on the race timetable and risking another hit and something of a revolt amongst the Britcar competitors who may like me, feel that the reasons for going to Spa are fast evaporating.

A 4 hour race makes the cost worthwhile and is a proper Endurance challenge, a Two hour race is already a major compromise, 100 mins is getting damn silly and what we could end up with if not further protected will go down as a foreseeable farce that should and could have been avoided. If Spa won't agree, tell them to go suck a lemon and re-schedule elsewhere for as an MSA top level endurance race series, they need to show us some respect.

Edited by Racing Rod on Tuesday 7th June 14:03

[gtdc]

Racing Rod said:

I think that just about sums it up, for being the last series on the listings, any problems during the day will fall on us, it's called the stty end of the stick. Spa have reduced our race time by 16.67%, forget the so called add on's elsewhere as the practice is shared with DSC and qualifying is too short anyway to get 3 drivers in and out.

Without knowing both sides of the story I'm amazed that this stuff isn't contracted. The following from BritCar would suggest not.

Britcar David said:

Spa have not given us the splits of track time as we ordered from them despite assurances we would get what we asked for. When the timetable was released we were surprised as well as to the splits of the race time and we have discussed the situation with Spa themselves.

Racing Rod said:

Last time I was there, DSC managed to write off the safety car by someone landing on top of it having used another car as a launch ramp and during SC /yellows.
!!!.

Ah yes, I had forgotten that - it was truly majestic.

Racing Rod said:

A 4 hour race makes the cost worthwhile and is a proper Endurance challenge, a Two hour race is already a major compromise, 100 mins is getting damn silly and what we could end up with if not further protected will go down as a foreseeable farce that should and could have been avoided. If Spa won't agree, tell them to go suck a lemon and re-schedule elsewhere for as an MSA top level endurance race series, they need to show us some respect.

Edited by Racing Rod on Tuesday 7th June 14:03

Bit late for that though. Teams have already paid out for a lot of stuff that isn't refundable.

[Racing Rod]

I agree, it's probably a bit late to tell them to get stuffed, but I needed a rousing way of finishing off my rant

The point is still valid however, bar threatening the above, lets have a fairer deal that has a chance of not making us a target twice.

Edited by Racing Rod on Tuesday 7th June 16:05

[Graham]

gtdc said:

Racing Rod said:

I think that just about sums it up, for being the last series on the listings, any problems during the day will fall on us, it's called the stty end of the stick. Spa have reduced our race time by 16.67%, forget the so called add on's elsewhere as the practice is shared with DSC and qualifying is too short anyway to get 3 drivers in and out.

Without knowing both sides of the story I'm amazed that this stuff isn't contracted. The following from BritCar would suggest not.

Dealing with R&R for the 1hour race im running there in october this seems to be the way they operate. I've been dealing with them since december, everything is agreed verbaly and no sign of a contract yet... If Britcar are on the same payment schedule as us they will have already paid in full by now as well too

[courageous]

Britcar really does get shafted by the whims of others don't it?
I make this 4 times already this year (Rockingham race length, Production min driver license & Donington half time Safety Car + now this).

How James et al manage to remain semi sane I do not know.

Edited by courageous on Tuesday 7th June 19:09

[Britcar David]

Beer

[Britcar David]

Information on the Spa timetable is being emailed out to all competitors today, a copy of this information can also be found on the Britcar website http://britcar24hr.co.uk/cms/news.php?item.1099.1

[Britcar David]

During the Spa Euro Race, you may access to the following services :

Live timing : http://spa.alkamelsystems.com/

All the results online & possibility to subscribe to our mailing list : [url]http://www.race-rally.be/2011/ser2011/liveresults.aspx?t=1&sm=12
|http://www.race-rally.be/2011/ser2011/liveresults.aspx?t=1&sm=12
[/url]

Virtual official notice board : http://www.race-rally.be/2011/ser2011/page.aspx?pa...

Live streaming video : http://www.race-rally.be/2011/ser2011/page.aspx?pa...

[Racing Rod]

David, do you have an up to date entry list as the Sunaco site is reporting that last years GT champions are now not racing until the 24hr race.

How many are actually down to do the Spa round which I seem to remember as being mandatory or have I got that wrong.