True power outputs?
Discussion
Hi again,
Given TVR's well known err, optimistic quotes for bhp figures;) what in peoples experience could I expect my 450 to be kicking out? I know from experience and from driving the car that it is hopelessly short of the quoted 319bhp for a 450se, but i expected that. It's feels quicker than my previous 400se however. I know these cars vary a lot but I would estimate given the weight (1150kgs?) and it's performance (feels like a sub 6 second car to 60mph)that it was kicking out around 230/240bhp.
Would i be wrong? I suppose only a rolling road session would confirm or deny but i'm a bit nervous about revving the plums off it under those conditions.
I'm very keen to hear peoples views on this.
Ultimately of course it is what it is. And i love it!
Jim
Given TVR's well known err, optimistic quotes for bhp figures;) what in peoples experience could I expect my 450 to be kicking out? I know from experience and from driving the car that it is hopelessly short of the quoted 319bhp for a 450se, but i expected that. It's feels quicker than my previous 400se however. I know these cars vary a lot but I would estimate given the weight (1150kgs?) and it's performance (feels like a sub 6 second car to 60mph)that it was kicking out around 230/240bhp.
Would i be wrong? I suppose only a rolling road session would confirm or deny but i'm a bit nervous about revving the plums off it under those conditions.
I'm very keen to hear peoples views on this.
Ultimately of course it is what it is. And i love it!
Jim
Click on this link then click the W/T box for each car...couple of 450's one has 200, the other 235.
http://www.nt-r.com/dyno-wedges.html
Hope that helps a bit
Chedder
http://www.nt-r.com/dyno-wedges.html
Hope that helps a bit
Chedder
JMF894 said:
short of the quoted 319bhp for a 450se
Where did you get that figure from?I'd guess slightly higher than you-250 to 260 for a healthy engine.
In line with most other manufacturers the bhp figures appear optimistic but the acceleration figures were about right.
I spoke to TVR at the factory about power figures around ten years ago. They said 'How fast a car do you need? If it's not fast enough then we'll make it faster.'
I'd just take it to a good rolling road and pay the £40, keep an eye on the temp gauge and it should all be fine.
Saying that, the table half way down this page ( http://www.mez.co.uk/TuningTheRoverV8-pt4.html ) should give a fair impression of what to expect.
Saying that, the table half way down this page ( http://www.mez.co.uk/TuningTheRoverV8-pt4.html ) should give a fair impression of what to expect.
Cheddar,
No serious Wedges there. I'm sure there's a bunch with better figures.
Wombat,
That seems about right for my car.
the previous owner I know changed the cam and followers. The SEAC's have the big valve heads.
On Austec's RR (http://www.austec.co.uk/Rolling-Road.asp) the previous owner had measured 276 at the wheels and I have the dyno sheet here.
However, saying that I don't think my cars that quick.
Hopefully with the correctly set-up Megasquirt it will at least feel quicker if not develop a couple of extra horses.
Phil
420 SEAC
No serious Wedges there. I'm sure there's a bunch with better figures.
Wombat,
That seems about right for my car.
the previous owner I know changed the cam and followers. The SEAC's have the big valve heads.
On Austec's RR (http://www.austec.co.uk/Rolling-Road.asp) the previous owner had measured 276 at the wheels and I have the dyno sheet here.
However, saying that I don't think my cars that quick.
Hopefully with the correctly set-up Megasquirt it will at least feel quicker if not develop a couple of extra horses.
Phil
420 SEAC
Kind of addictive this power thing, the more you have......the more you want!
And I have been slightly guilty of hunting for more power
TVR where well known for fitting 'massaged' engines into the demo cars and then quoting those figures for the production models, mostly flywheel figures too....not at the wheels where it counts.
Dyno would be the way to go, as long as your engine and cooling system is in good order then you shouldnt have a problem, most dyno guys know what they are doing and will abort the run at once if a problem rears it's head.
The Dyno isn't just about outright power, it can show up many areas where something is occuring that isnt quite right and help to resolve it.
Novatech have been at the wedgefest quite a few times and are really good guy's, if they are there this year....give them a try.
Chedder
And I have been slightly guilty of hunting for more power
TVR where well known for fitting 'massaged' engines into the demo cars and then quoting those figures for the production models, mostly flywheel figures too....not at the wheels where it counts.
Dyno would be the way to go, as long as your engine and cooling system is in good order then you shouldnt have a problem, most dyno guys know what they are doing and will abort the run at once if a problem rears it's head.
The Dyno isn't just about outright power, it can show up many areas where something is occuring that isnt quite right and help to resolve it.
Novatech have been at the wedgefest quite a few times and are really good guy's, if they are there this year....give them a try.
Chedder
Yep the 319bhp figure is simply what I sourced as the tvr quoted figure. If it gave anything like that it would be a death trap given the standard brakes!!
My car was featured in Autocar back in 1991 for a 0-100-0 run.
It did 0-60 in 5.8 and 0-100 in 14.0
Quarter mile in 14.0 secs terminal speed 110mph
Those figure were achieved by the owner aka 'Englishman' I don't doubt David's driving skills but perhaps a professional driver may have shaved a few tenths off??
Mind you.................there's 100k on the clock now and 20yrs have passed;)
Whatever its kicking out at the moment is plenty for me........until i do the brakes
Jim
My car was featured in Autocar back in 1991 for a 0-100-0 run.
It did 0-60 in 5.8 and 0-100 in 14.0
Quarter mile in 14.0 secs terminal speed 110mph
Those figure were achieved by the owner aka 'Englishman' I don't doubt David's driving skills but perhaps a professional driver may have shaved a few tenths off??
Mind you.................there's 100k on the clock now and 20yrs have passed;)
Whatever its kicking out at the moment is plenty for me........until i do the brakes
Jim
My 400SE figures: 194.5 @ wheels, 251 lbs torque.
The distributor needed replacing at the time though.
I did the standing qtr mile at the drag strip in 14.9 secs, half asleep and with wheelspin for the first couple of hundred yards. 0-60 sub 6 seconds.
My red 390SE was a faster car, but never tested.
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6qHJ-2Fe2M
The distributor needed replacing at the time though.
I did the standing qtr mile at the drag strip in 14.9 secs, half asleep and with wheelspin for the first couple of hundred yards. 0-60 sub 6 seconds.
My red 390SE was a faster car, but never tested.
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6qHJ-2Fe2M
The more i drive the car i think maybe nearer 200 @ the flywheel. As said b4 it is what it is. This car is a long term proposition for me so in years to come when hopefully more readies are available i will probably entertain the idea of engine mods. When circumstances permit i think i will defo get it on a rolling road as i am just too curious as to what it's putting out. A friend of mine has a 1.8t Audi TT 225 with a 260bhp DMS remap. He thinks my car is quick...........................
Car had a replacement Kent cam(don't know the profile) and refurbed heads around 30k ago.
Should be in reasonable fettle.
I know it's running a bit rich at the moment tho. Getting it booked in soon to set it up/diagnose any probs re sensors etc
Jim
Car had a replacement Kent cam(don't know the profile) and refurbed heads around 30k ago.
Should be in reasonable fettle.
I know it's running a bit rich at the moment tho. Getting it booked in soon to set it up/diagnose any probs re sensors etc
Jim
chedder said:
Novatech have been at the wedgefest quite a few times and are really good guy's, if they are there this year....give them a try.
Chedder
I had a power run on the Novatech dyno last BBWF; my 390SE (actually more of a 400SE engine now but with a few of my own mods) made 256bhp(flywheel) and 280 lb.ft.. Max power was about 5400 and max torque about 4100 rpm, with a minimum of 250lb.ft from 2400-5400rpm.Chedder
Some way short of TVR's claimed 275bhp but I expected that; I'd have been happy with 240. Best part was the almost-flat air:fuel ratio, adjusted by the seat of me backside
Well, just to give you some idea of the difference it can make:
Yesterday I accompanied a young friend of mine to the rolling road where I had my 400SE set up.
He has a 2.9 TVR S2, which he's spent the past 9 months re-building...body-off etc.
I had suggested that it would be money well-spent.
According to TVR, these engines were supposed to produce 168bhp at the flywheel in an S2.
First run....99.8 bhp....and this in a car that he thought had been performing reasonably well.
You can imagine his disappointment.
Anyway, much tinkering, including fixing throttle cable to give FULL throttle
, cutting out the protruding gasket in the AFM, replacing the fuel pipe that was LEAKING fuel onto the hot manifold 
and generally setting things to where they're supposed to be,
AND...172.5 bhp at the flywheel, plus about 180ftlbs torque.
Cost £130 inc vat.
Job done.
Yesterday I accompanied a young friend of mine to the rolling road where I had my 400SE set up.
He has a 2.9 TVR S2, which he's spent the past 9 months re-building...body-off etc.
I had suggested that it would be money well-spent.
According to TVR, these engines were supposed to produce 168bhp at the flywheel in an S2.
First run....99.8 bhp.
...and this in a car that he thought had been performing reasonably well.You can imagine his disappointment.
Anyway, much tinkering, including fixing throttle cable to give FULL throttle
, cutting out the protruding gasket in the AFM, replacing the fuel pipe that was LEAKING fuel onto the hot manifold and generally setting things to where they're supposed to be,AND...172.5 bhp at the flywheel, plus about 180ftlbs torque.
Cost £130 inc vat.
Job done.
Good luck. 
The best thing about going to a GOOD operator is that he will tell you what does or doesn't need replacing, so saving all that head-scratching and buying parts that weren't needed anyway.
Hopefully the result will be a car that's giving of its best with minimum damage to your wallet.
As a very tight-fisted Yorkshireman this has always made a lot of sense to me.
Nice Griff 500 in the queue:
.
The best thing about going to a GOOD operator is that he will tell you what does or doesn't need replacing, so saving all that head-scratching and buying parts that weren't needed anyway.
Hopefully the result will be a car that's giving of its best with minimum damage to your wallet.
As a very tight-fisted Yorkshireman this has always made a lot of sense to me.
Nice Griff 500 in the queue:
.
Edited by grahamw48 on Saturday 18th June 14:16
Gassing Station | Wedges | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff