Stranded with non starting Griff!

[ruaricoles]

Hello peeps,
Currently trying to diagnose my non starting griff 500 with the help of mr.AA.

We have cranking, but no spark or fuel pump or injectors working. The fuel pump works when the relay is bypassed (but still engine won't start).

We've re-seated the ecu, swapped the two metal Bosch relays, still no joy.

Any thoughts?

Ta

Ruari

[Johno]

Inertia switch behind glovebox, worth a quick try?

[ruaricoles]

Thanks, we've tried but can't actually find it. Doesnt that just cut the fuel supply though? If not we'll definitely look harder!

The issue was intermittent though (engine cut out instantly, managed to restart it but soon cut out again and now won't start at all)

Thanks for your help!

[V8Bart]

Very long shot, disconnect battery for a min? Has worked in past.

[ruaricoles]

Thanks, tried disconnecting everything but still no joy. Got a lift home on a flatbed (was only a few miles from home), car is now back in garage awaiting some attention with a multimeter and a fresh brain. I think it must be a wiring fault in or behind the fuse box somewhere. The ignition was switching the relay, but no power at coil or ECU relay if I'm thinking straight. Poo

Anyone fancy doing me a new fuse box?

[spend]

No power at coil is the problem to sort, the ecu won't do squat without the tach signal.

It has been known for a rev counter fault to take out the coil signal ~ I don't know whether that affected the power circuit though?

Tracing back from coil to fusebox shouldn't be too hard ~ but do make sure it isn't just a fuse first. Being more familiar with the fusebox I'd personally check behind the fusebox first and work the other way down the circuit, but I understand many put their brains in their pants at the mention of the F-box

[Chimpafrolic]

I would be turning your attention to the immobiliser.

Notoriously unreliable, the Meta immobiliser controls three circuits.

1) Stater solenoid

2) Live feed to the coil

3) The fuel pump

Inside the immobiliser are three relays (one for each of the above circuits) .

Apparently TVR wired these relays back to front, leaving them living on borrowed time the moment the car left the factory.

The most common of the three relays to fail is the one that operates the starter solenoid as it carries the most amps.

It's such a common problem that an extra relay is often fitted retrospectively to take some of the load of this starter solenoid immobiliser relay.

This extra relay is sold as a kit by a company called ModWise, many Chims & Griffs have has this mod & you may well have one, others simply bypass the immobiliser on that circuit, that may be why your car cranks but you have no fuel pump & live feed to the coil.

Ultimately all three immobiliser relays are at risk.

If you can solve the problem by running temporary live feeds to the coil & fuel pump you have effectively bypassed the immobiliser.

Therefore your next step should be to turn your attention to the immobiliser to effect a permanent fix.

NB: Don't confuse the relays hidden inside the immobiliser with the relays that hang from the wiring loom in the passenger footwell.

Edited by Chimpafrolic on Friday 8th July 08:54

[red griff roger]

Have you done anyhting to the car in the recent past? I ask because I had a similar sounding fault, and it was a non-Lucas rotor arm that lets go after a few hundred miles.

[spend]

Have we suddenly been given a green light to post details of alarm/immobilizer on PH? I though it was always removed in the past as a sensitive subject along with emergency openings etc..

[Colin RedGriff]

Could be the ignition amplifier. Don't think there is a test you can do apart from swapping with a known good one

[Chimpafrolic]

spend said:

Have we suddenly been given a green light to post details of alarm/immobilizer on PH? I though it was always removed in the past as a sensitive subject along with emergency openings etc..

Spend, honestly!!

There is absolutely nothing here that would compromise the security of any of our cars.

A statement that the immobilizer may be at fault is not exactly going to cause a rash of Chim & Griffith thefts now is it?

If you had a problem opening your safe & I said the faulty component may be the combination lock, its not like I have just published the combination to the safe now is it?

I know some people feel this forum is theirs, and may also occasionally feel their self appointed status as undisputed expert in all things TVR is being challenged.

But they really shouldn't worry.

Personally I don’t believe the purpose of this forum is to edify ones own ego, it’s here to help people that are having problems.

If the OP chooses to investigate a faulty immobilizer he may just find the problem and be back on the road, if I have pointed him in the right direction we could say the forum has worked.

If the OP is a car thief or car thieves are lurking I have not improved their ability to steal a Chim or Griff one bit.

And lets be honest here, any trainee junior car thief starting out on a career of crime could enter and start a Chimaera of Griff in less than 10 minutes.

I really don’t think telling the OP to investigate a potential immobilizer fault will have any influence on this fact.

Lets keep the comments and suggestion positive & relevant shall we?

Pointless sniping doesn’t really help the OP get is car started now does it?

[ruaricoles]

Thanks for the further suggestions, I'll have a tinker this weekend.

A guy in the office here with a 4.0 Griff has also suggested the ignition amp as his led to a similar sounding issue. Apparently replacements are only about 12 quid so probably worth swapping.

I don't think it's a Meta alarm in my car but thanks for the info as mine may work in a similar way.

The dash was out about 3 months ago to fix a speedo issue, and a new battery fitted, so plenty of stuff was disturbed then but the car has done loads of faultless miles since.

Thanks

Ruari

[Chimpafrolic]

ruaricoles said:

Thanks for the further suggestions, I'll have a tinker this weekend.

A guy in the office here with a 4.0 Griff has also suggested the ignition amp as his led to a similar sounding issue. Apparently replacements are only about 12 quid so probably worth swapping.

I don't think it's a Meta alarm in my car but thanks for the info as mine may work in a similar way.

The dash was out about 3 months ago to fix a speedo issue, and a new battery fitted, so plenty of stuff was disturbed then but the car has done loads of faultless miles since.

Thanks

Ruari

Good luck with it Ruari, I hope you find the fault.

Nothing worse than having a TVR that doesn't start, I had the same problem myself recently and some nice people on here helped me get it fixed.

Dave.

[jacjac]

Had the same promlem with mine a couple of years ago. Fitted new immobiliser - never had the problem again.

[tig]

jacjac said:

Had the same promlem with mine a couple of years ago. Fitted new immobiliser - never had the problem again.

My old foxguard immobiliser stranded my griff at Silverstone yesterday. Would appear to be down to radio interference. Jacjac which new one did you get and are you happy with it ?

[FlipFlopGriff]

tig said:

My old foxguard immobiliser stranded my griff at Silverstone yesterday. Would appear to be down to radio interference. Jacjac which new one did you get and are you happy with it ?

Given your location Carl Baker would be the perfect option.
FFG

[vroom]

Not read the post properly, but have checked the ecu is getting the pulsed signal from the ignition amplifier on the distributor?

There is a series connected resistor strapped in the wiring loom between the hot wire AFM and the bulkhead.

This resistor corrodes and stops the 12v ignition pulse getting to the ECU.

Good luck

[TOV!E]

Pointless sniping doesn’t really help the OP get is car started now does it?



Here Here,well said that man..............

[ruaricoles]

Thanks for the info on the resistor - didn't know about that.

I've not had a chance to even touch the car yet, but from a good PH search and suggestions here I reckon the ignition amp or the immobiliser are definitely the likely suspects. There seem to be loads of threads on cars cutting out suddenly due to immobiliser failure.

Of course, that probably means it'll be something completely different

I'll let you know when it's fixed.

Ruari

[5.0ltr]

Do you have a hot start kit fitted?