Magnetorheological Damping - How long?
Discussion
After reading glowing reviews of how the MP4-12C rides over rough surfaces, yet remains taught enough on the race track, it got me wondering about the fancy dampers it uses and how long it'll be until the technology filters to the aftermarket community.
Making a car better at the track has, for years, meant cars have been too stiff to enjoy on a backroad blast. I'm at the point where I no longer enjoy throwing my car down a B road anymore, which is a real shame.
So PH'ers - how long until a realistically priced aftermarket Magnetorheological damper system will become available for popular cars?
Making a car better at the track has, for years, meant cars have been too stiff to enjoy on a backroad blast. I'm at the point where I no longer enjoy throwing my car down a B road anymore, which is a real shame.
So PH'ers - how long until a realistically priced aftermarket Magnetorheological damper system will become available for popular cars?
Automotive and aerospaceIf the shock absorbers of a vehicle's suspension are filled with magnetorheological fluid instead of plain oil, and the whole device surrounded with an electromagnet, the viscosity of the fluid, and hence the amount of damping provided by the shock absorber, can be varied depending on driver preference or the weight being carried by the vehicle - or it may be dynamically varied in order to provide stability control. This is in effect a magnetorheological damper. For example, the MagneRide active suspension system permits the damping factor to be adjusted once every millisecond in response to conditions. General Motors (in a partnership with Delphi Corporation) has developed this technology for automotive applications. It made its debut in both Cadillac (Seville STS build date on or after 1/15/2002 with RPO F55) as "Magneride" (or "MR") and Chevrolet passenger vehicles (All Corvettes made since 2003 with the F55 option code) as part of the driver selectable "Magnetic Selective Ride Control (MSRC)" system) in model year 2003. Other manufacturers have paid for the use of it in their own vehicles. As of 2007, BMW manufactures cars using their own proprietary version of this device, while Audi and Ferrari offer the MagneRide on various models.
General Motors and other automotive companies are seeking to develop a magnetorheological fluid based clutch system for push-button four wheel drive systems. This clutch system would use electromagnets to solidify the fluid which would lock the driveshaft into the drive train.
Porsche has introduced magnetorheological engine mounts in the 2010 Porsche GT3 and GT2. At high engine revolutions, the magnetorheological engine mounts get stiffer to provide a more precise gearbox shifter feel by reducing the relative motion between the power train and chassis/body.
As of September 2010, Acura (Honda) has begun an advertising campaign highlighting its use of MR technology in passenger vehicles manufactured for the 2011 model year.
Magnetorheological dampers are under development for use in military and commercial helicopter cockpit seats, as safety devices in the event of a crash. They would be used to decrease the shock delivered to a passenger's spinal column, thereby decreasing the rate of permanent injury during a crash.
General Motors and other automotive companies are seeking to develop a magnetorheological fluid based clutch system for push-button four wheel drive systems. This clutch system would use electromagnets to solidify the fluid which would lock the driveshaft into the drive train.
Porsche has introduced magnetorheological engine mounts in the 2010 Porsche GT3 and GT2. At high engine revolutions, the magnetorheological engine mounts get stiffer to provide a more precise gearbox shifter feel by reducing the relative motion between the power train and chassis/body.
As of September 2010, Acura (Honda) has begun an advertising campaign highlighting its use of MR technology in passenger vehicles manufactured for the 2011 model year.
Magnetorheological dampers are under development for use in military and commercial helicopter cockpit seats, as safety devices in the event of a crash. They would be used to decrease the shock delivered to a passenger's spinal column, thereby decreasing the rate of permanent injury during a crash.
sorry re read original post and now have to say that an aftermarket version is going to be very complexed but must not be ruled out, Computers seem very complexed to the average car owner/tuner but in this day and age they are very simple to those in the know. And a specialist should be able to build an ecu to control these dampers. Personaly i feel if the technology is out there and the demand then it will happen.
Strikes me as just something else to horrendously expensively wrong after a few years. C'mon, we who use cars for road and track are pretty few and far between, the average person owning a car as transport and shopping trolley, that's all. Do we actually need it in real life? I don't think so, but reckon that the repair or replacement cost of such a suspension would probably pay for a cheap track tool.
mk1salami said:
Making a car better at the track has, for years, meant cars have been too stiff to enjoy on a backroad blast. I'm at the point where I no longer enjoy throwing my car down a B road anymore, which is a real shame.
I suspect that's more to do with cheap aftermarket equipment and a misinformed opinion that rock hard = better handling. That's not aimed at you, just in general.Out of interest, and assuming you are talking about your MX5, what suspension do you use?
Edited by Kozy on Monday 15th August 09:42
A lot of people in here really have missed the aftermarket bit of this!
Yes, I'd go along with that. A high-quality set of progressive coilovers works perfectly acceptably on the road too. Doesn't mean I'd say no to magnetorheological kit, but the amount of data the suspension needs to behave correctly is huge, and particularly on older cars I can't see it being even remotely doable without thousands of pounds' worth of sensors and so on.
Kozy said:
mk1salami said:
Making a car better at the track has, for years, meant cars have been too stiff to enjoy on a backroad blast. I'm at the point where I no longer enjoy throwing my car down a B road anymore, which is a real shame.
I suspect that's more to do with cheap aftermarket equipment and a misinformed opinion that rock hard = better handling. That's not aimed at you, just in general.TEIN have been selling an EDFC kit for a few years now. Allows electronic damping force control from the cabin.
This is different tech from that of the OP, but it does go to show that manufacturers of aftermarket kit are not averse to using new technology.
Lets also remember that aftermarket ECU's are available for a number of cars. (Note, I'm not talking about tuning boxes or remaps, I'm talking about removing the factory ECU and replacing with an aftermarket ECU.)
This is different tech from that of the OP, but it does go to show that manufacturers of aftermarket kit are not averse to using new technology.
Lets also remember that aftermarket ECU's are available for a number of cars. (Note, I'm not talking about tuning boxes or remaps, I'm talking about removing the factory ECU and replacing with an aftermarket ECU.)
lowdrag said:
Strikes me as just something else to horrendously expensively wrong after a few years. C'mon, we who use cars for road and track are pretty few and far between, the average person owning a car as transport and shopping trolley, that's all. Do we actually need it in real life? I don't think so, but reckon that the repair or replacement cost of such a suspension would probably pay for a cheap track tool.
I don't think the real benefit of these dampers is track work.It is on roads and the ability to adapt to conditions and a drivers wishes.
mrmr96 said:
TEIN have been selling an EDFC kit for a few years now. Allows electronic damping force control from the cabin.
This is different tech from that of the OP, but it does go to show that manufacturers of aftermarket kit are not averse to using new technology.
Lets also remember that aftermarket ECU's are available for a number of cars. (Note, I'm not talking about tuning boxes or remaps, I'm talking about removing the factory ECU and replacing with an aftermarket ECU.)
To say it's "different" tech is like suggesting that a tomato is a different kind of cow.. They're both used a food, but are slightly different to one another!This is different tech from that of the OP, but it does go to show that manufacturers of aftermarket kit are not averse to using new technology.
Lets also remember that aftermarket ECU's are available for a number of cars. (Note, I'm not talking about tuning boxes or remaps, I'm talking about removing the factory ECU and replacing with an aftermarket ECU.)
EDFC is simply a stepper motor connected to the adjuster "screws" on a damper.. (with a control box attached of course).. Magnetorheological Damping is slightly more complex/advanced..
The Nur said:
BlueMR2 said:
Toyota put active suspension in cars 20 years ago.
Why is it taking everyone else so long?
fanboi troll or serious?Why is it taking everyone else so long?
It kinda fizzled out in the 90s never to be seen again.
Unless it changes its name I doubt it will ever catch on with the after market tuning community.
"Excuse me bruv do you sell dem....err...magnetothingies mate."
"Eh?"
"You's knows, dem....errr.....magnetic-w
e-logical shocks mate."
"Eh? Look just please leave my shop now before I call the police"
"Excuse me bruv do you sell dem....err...magnetothingies mate."
"Eh?"
"You's knows, dem....errr.....magnetic-w
e-logical shocks mate.""Eh? Look just please leave my shop now before I call the police"
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