Planning permission to extend kitchen into the garage?
Discussion
Just a quick query regarding planning permission on a pretty standard semi, approx 10 years old. The kitchen has a doorway leading into the garage, and we are having an extension done where the kitchen will be extended about 6 feet into the garage space.
there is a non load bearing breezeblock wall between kitchen and garage (confirmed by building regs inspector as non load bearing) which is coming down, and a new dividing wall built using fireboard (again agreed by building inspect).
All work is internal and no changes at all will be noticeable from the outside, no windows etc, just the extension into some of the garage, with the remaining garage space remaining as is, so not even a change to garage door.
The bulding regs inspector said we'll need to get planning permission as well, which seems a little strange to me, as it then has to go via neighbours etc, and costs more money, for something that has no visible difference to the house, and doesnt affect anything load bearing.
Does the need for planning permission sound right?
there is a non load bearing breezeblock wall between kitchen and garage (confirmed by building regs inspector as non load bearing) which is coming down, and a new dividing wall built using fireboard (again agreed by building inspect).
All work is internal and no changes at all will be noticeable from the outside, no windows etc, just the extension into some of the garage, with the remaining garage space remaining as is, so not even a change to garage door.
The bulding regs inspector said we'll need to get planning permission as well, which seems a little strange to me, as it then has to go via neighbours etc, and costs more money, for something that has no visible difference to the house, and doesnt affect anything load bearing.
Does the need for planning permission sound right?
Edited by Tokoloshe on Thursday 18th August 15:43
Some planing departments can be fussy over this. A friend brought a detached house to convert into two flats and permission was denied on not having two parking spaces (one for each flat).
Even though the current house had no parking (drive or garage)
I guess you are not creating more demand - so you should be ok. It will cost you to find out though!!
Even though the current house had no parking (drive or garage)
I guess you are not creating more demand - so you should be ok. It will cost you to find out though!!
Tokoloshe said:
Thanks, Ill have to check that, we have a space outside our garage for parking and I dont remember any specific clauses for the number of parking spaces, but might be the case.
You will need to look at the original approval for your house to be able to answer this one , it is not possible for anyone to advise you correctly without sight of that document.There is likely to be a condition that requires you to obtain the planners approval prior to converting any part of the garage to habitable accommodation.
You will need to have a minimum 2 off road parking spaces available to you , measuring 4800 x 2400 before they do grant permission , if required.
Cheers, we have the building regs, so will now need to get planning permission I suppose, though we wont have two parking spaces so might be a problem.
Prior to this work it had been turned into a study by the previous owners, so hasnt been used as a garage for probably 5 years, just the study wasnt doen with approvals so couldnt be advertised as such.
Any idea whether this will have a bearing on getting permission? And if the permission is refused, would we need to put it all back to how it was?
Prior to this work it had been turned into a study by the previous owners, so hasnt been used as a garage for probably 5 years, just the study wasnt doen with approvals so couldnt be advertised as such.
Any idea whether this will have a bearing on getting permission? And if the permission is refused, would we need to put it all back to how it was?
At the mercy of the planning office.
The extension to the kitchen went ahead without planning, the work had already started when the building regs officer came round the first time as the builder was confident of only needing building regs.
He completed it and got building regs signed off, and now we have had a letter from the planning office advising we need planning permission or we could be looking at putting everything back to how it was.
Obviously we should have done further research around planning, but we are where we are, and it is all related to the parking spaces, being a new build estate, as we now have a garage that is too small for use (it is now 3.8 meters in length), a Corsa sized car goes in there but nothing bigger.
We have a potential avenue as the previous owner had converted the same space into a study previously, so the available garage space hasnt changed, and the study was there for over 6 years before we bought the house. This didnt have planning, but due to it being there for that long can we advise the planning office of this and use this fact to help gain planning permission?
Otherwise, are there any other things we can use to try and get planning? The alternative is not good, and costly (and our fault I know), but really want to avoid having to demolish it at all costs.
The extension to the kitchen went ahead without planning, the work had already started when the building regs officer came round the first time as the builder was confident of only needing building regs.
He completed it and got building regs signed off, and now we have had a letter from the planning office advising we need planning permission or we could be looking at putting everything back to how it was.
Obviously we should have done further research around planning, but we are where we are, and it is all related to the parking spaces, being a new build estate, as we now have a garage that is too small for use (it is now 3.8 meters in length), a Corsa sized car goes in there but nothing bigger.
We have a potential avenue as the previous owner had converted the same space into a study previously, so the available garage space hasnt changed, and the study was there for over 6 years before we bought the house. This didnt have planning, but due to it being there for that long can we advise the planning office of this and use this fact to help gain planning permission?
Otherwise, are there any other things we can use to try and get planning? The alternative is not good, and costly (and our fault I know), but really want to avoid having to demolish it at all costs.
I presume there is a condition attached to the original permision that garages should be retained and that is why the Council are advising that you need permission.
If the area was converted more than 4 years ago and you can prove this (sales particulars or survey from when you bought??) then the Council can no longer enforce against the breach of the condition.
If under 4 years, how many bedrooms and how many parking spaces does the house have? It is a bit of a generalisation and things have changed slightly again, but policy has moved from providing a minimum number of spaces to a maximum number to encourage people to use public transport/walk/cycle since your house has been built (10 years ago if I remeber your OP correctly). So you could argue that since your house was granted permission policy and changed and you are providing enough spaces and encouraging alternative forms of transport. You could always show what is left of the garage as a cycle store if you have to submit an application.
If the area was converted more than 4 years ago and you can prove this (sales particulars or survey from when you bought??) then the Council can no longer enforce against the breach of the condition.
If under 4 years, how many bedrooms and how many parking spaces does the house have? It is a bit of a generalisation and things have changed slightly again, but policy has moved from providing a minimum number of spaces to a maximum number to encourage people to use public transport/walk/cycle since your house has been built (10 years ago if I remeber your OP correctly). So you could argue that since your house was granted permission policy and changed and you are providing enough spaces and encouraging alternative forms of transport. You could always show what is left of the garage as a cycle store if you have to submit an application.
Edited by covmutley on Tuesday 20th September 12:52
[quote=covmutley]
If the area was converted more than 4 years ago and you can prove this (sales particulars or survey from when you bought??) then the Council can no longer enforce against the breach of the condition.
[quote]
Thanks for this, it's what I was hoping, I have a letter from the person we bought from stating he put in the study area in 2005, so hopefully this will mean we can get the permission, the original wall he put up is still the one we're using.
If the area was converted more than 4 years ago and you can prove this (sales particulars or survey from when you bought??) then the Council can no longer enforce against the breach of the condition.
[quote]
Thanks for this, it's what I was hoping, I have a letter from the person we bought from stating he put in the study area in 2005, so hopefully this will mean we can get the permission, the original wall he put up is still the one we're using.
Tokoloshe]ovmutley said:
If the area was converted more than 4 years ago and you can prove this (sales particulars or survey from when you bought??) then the Council can no longer enforce against the breach of the condition.
[quote]
Thanks for this, it's what I was hoping, I have a letter from the person we bought from stating he put in the study area in 2005, so hopefully this will mean we can get the permission, the original wall he put up is still the one we're using.
It may not be enforceable but that doesn't make it legal so you may have fun and games with lawyers if you ever come to sell the property.[quote]
Thanks for this, it's what I was hoping, I have a letter from the person we bought from stating he put in the study area in 2005, so hopefully this will mean we can get the permission, the original wall he put up is still the one we're using.
RedWhiteMonkey said:
It may not be enforceable but that doesn't make it legal so you may have fun and games with lawyers if you ever come to sell the property.
Or rather the next buyers will have fun & games. As a seller I'd tell them to jog on if they are not happy & sell it to somebody else!Jimboka said:
RedWhiteMonkey said:
It may not be enforceable but that doesn't make it legal so you may have fun and games with lawyers if you ever come to sell the property.
Or rather the next buyers will have fun & games. As a seller I'd tell them to jog on if they are not happy & sell it to somebody else!In answer to original poster I would echo the advice of others on this thread.
Provided there are no planning conditions on the original planning permission for the property required the retention of X number of on-site car parking spaces you don’t planning permission for your kitchen extension. Internal works do not require planning permission and as the garage forms part of the planning unit its use as a kitchen, dining room, etc. does not constitute a material change of use.
Provided there are no planning conditions on the original planning permission for the property required the retention of X number of on-site car parking spaces you don’t planning permission for your kitchen extension. Internal works do not require planning permission and as the garage forms part of the planning unit its use as a kitchen, dining room, etc. does not constitute a material change of use.
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