Piston Oil Squirt Nozel - Engine cooling
Discussion
I was reading the book about the return of the silver arrows – Sauber C9 the other week and they made specific mention of the use of a piston that had an oil gallery cast into the underside of the head to allow for piston cooling. The benefit of this for the group c cars was that they could run a leaner mixture on the fuel setting as they did not need to use the fuel to keep the engine cool, result was more power and better fuel economy.
In reading the mini build diary thread there seems to be lots of concern over the question about lagging the side radiator pipes for fear of overheating the engine at the expense of passenger comfort.
Does anyone think that fitting some piston oil squirt nozzles -to the LS engine might be another option for keeping the car cool. The extra heat would need to be dissipated by the oil cooling system.
Another added benefit might be that an increase in power and fuel economy may result.
(i assume the LS engines don’t have these as standard)
http://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction/1001474...
Ryan
In reading the mini build diary thread there seems to be lots of concern over the question about lagging the side radiator pipes for fear of overheating the engine at the expense of passenger comfort.
Does anyone think that fitting some piston oil squirt nozzles -to the LS engine might be another option for keeping the car cool. The extra heat would need to be dissipated by the oil cooling system.
Another added benefit might be that an increase in power and fuel economy may result.
(i assume the LS engines don’t have these as standard)
http://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction/1001474...
Ryan
Piston oilers are very popular in blown motors... LS9 etc may have them as stock? The oil does pull some heat and allow finer tuning due more consistent piston crown temps/ wall clearance/ ring land etc etc.
Oiling is also used in top race N/A /endurance engines.. Normally the longest rod and lightest piston possible will be used so this combined with usual increased RPM/power output causes increased cylinder/piston temps similar to a blwon motor which can similalrly be controlled to some degree with piston oilers.
And on a real top motor the tune could be well be optimized too..
But it just might be hard to justify on a N/A V8 that only operates up to say 7K RPM..
An 8-9k screaming circuit engine maybe, and when you are talking of endurance racing 0.5 - 1.0 mile per gallon tune improvement might mean all the difference..
Not so sure for a N/A street engine though ..
However, spring oilers for a cammy, solid roller engine would be well worth it IMO..
Oiling is also used in top race N/A /endurance engines.. Normally the longest rod and lightest piston possible will be used so this combined with usual increased RPM/power output causes increased cylinder/piston temps similar to a blwon motor which can similalrly be controlled to some degree with piston oilers.
And on a real top motor the tune could be well be optimized too..
But it just might be hard to justify on a N/A V8 that only operates up to say 7K RPM..
An 8-9k screaming circuit engine maybe, and when you are talking of endurance racing 0.5 - 1.0 mile per gallon tune improvement might mean all the difference..
Not so sure for a N/A street engine though ..
However, spring oilers for a cammy, solid roller engine would be well worth it IMO..
Yeh, I understand why you would do it on a highly tuned race or forced induction motor, where it is more likely to be operating closer to the limit of the detonation threshold. A cooler piston crown will be less likely to detonate the combustion chamber than a hotter one. Maybe some research into the differences in the exhaust gas temperature of the various engine would give an indication to the relative combustion chamber / piston temperatures.
If the temps are not to different then it might be another viable method of increasing the cooling capacity of the system.
The LS9 appears to have the oil nozzles as standard - $30US per nozzle apparently.
The ones in the first link are an aftermarket version for the LS7 that clears the longer stroke - $50US per nozzle.
havent read the second link yet.
If it improves fuel economy at that price it might not take too long for them to pay for themselves on that metric alone.
If some heat could be taken out of the system via an oil cooler then there would also be less heat travelling down the side of the cockpit heating up the passenger compartment.
If the temps are not to different then it might be another viable method of increasing the cooling capacity of the system.
The LS9 appears to have the oil nozzles as standard - $30US per nozzle apparently.
The ones in the first link are an aftermarket version for the LS7 that clears the longer stroke - $50US per nozzle.
havent read the second link yet.
If it improves fuel economy at that price it might not take too long for them to pay for themselves on that metric alone.
If some heat could be taken out of the system via an oil cooler then there would also be less heat travelling down the side of the cockpit heating up the passenger compartment.
Edited by ezakimak on Wednesday 24th August 13:34
Most modern'ish petrol turbo engines have them as standard.
EG: Toyota JZ engines have them with a corresponding oil port on the piston with a "in" cast tubular ring cicular to the ringland. I have one sat on my desk in front of me now.
Oil temps will be notably higher with oil cooled pistons assuming the devised system is actually cooling them that is.
EG: Toyota JZ engines have them with a corresponding oil port on the piston with a "in" cast tubular ring cicular to the ringland. I have one sat on my desk in front of me now.
Oil temps will be notably higher with oil cooled pistons assuming the devised system is actually cooling them that is.
The possible temp reduction and tune improvement on say a stock LS7 is very marginal...GM did a lot of design work on their motors and they are pretty good. Even if you use an aftermarket ECU on a stock engine you will find it hard to match a factory controller/stock motor's performance.
A pair of rads in the sidepod vents would be an alternative.... a bit of creative moulding required to duct them efficiently..
A pair of rads in the sidepod vents would be an alternative.... a bit of creative moulding required to duct them efficiently..
http://gmhightechperformance.automotive.com/93729/...
found that link last night, looks like GM are using them in there factory supported stock class race car, not exactly what that means in terms of class requirments, but 500hp out of a stock stroke, stock crank LS2 that will hang together during race conditions sounds nice.
engine plate on the front looks interesting too.
found that link last night, looks like GM are using them in there factory supported stock class race car, not exactly what that means in terms of class requirments, but 500hp out of a stock stroke, stock crank LS2 that will hang together during race conditions sounds nice.
engine plate on the front looks interesting too.
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