David Millar - BBC HardTalk
Discussion
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b013pkwf/HARD...
Interesting frank & open personal insight into the world of professional doping. Reinforces how institutionalised drugs were in the sport. Never heard him speak before but comes across as a thoughtful and genuine individual. Danced around the Lance Armstrong question diplomatically. Worth watching.
Interesting frank & open personal insight into the world of professional doping. Reinforces how institutionalised drugs were in the sport. Never heard him speak before but comes across as a thoughtful and genuine individual. Danced around the Lance Armstrong question diplomatically. Worth watching.
His book is equally frank and disarming. Hard not to like him.
He generally avoids naming anyone that has not been convicted of doping. It is a obvious conclusion whether this continues to make him a part of the omerta, or just a human being who continues to earn his living in the sport. Lance is also his mate which complicates things further.
He generally avoids naming anyone that has not been convicted of doping. It is a obvious conclusion whether this continues to make him a part of the omerta, or just a human being who continues to earn his living in the sport. Lance is also his mate which complicates things further.
always had a lot of respect for millar and his book is excellent. its heart breaking when he wins clean early in his career against the dopers and then thought "how much better could i be if i doped"... ultimately it screwed his head up like it did with so many others....
following the cofidis affair, his confession and his return, i think he was disheartened that more high profile cyclists didnt take a strong anti-doping stand but i can see why some were reluctant, they must have thought "f
k that, we did it clean all along when you guys were whacked off your tits and no one gave a st, why should we get excited now you want to". it says a lot about the sport that these event were so recent
some great one-liners in the book, "rule of thumb for a pro cyclist: if you are scared to approach eddy merckx and lance armstrong in a restuarant because you think you are too drunk, you probably are" a night out with stuart o'grady sounds awesome!
following the cofidis affair, his confession and his return, i think he was disheartened that more high profile cyclists didnt take a strong anti-doping stand but i can see why some were reluctant, they must have thought "f
k that, we did it clean all along when you guys were whacked off your tits and no one gave a st, why should we get excited now you want to". it says a lot about the sport that these event were so recent some great one-liners in the book, "rule of thumb for a pro cyclist: if you are scared to approach eddy merckx and lance armstrong in a restuarant because you think you are too drunk, you probably are" a night out with stuart o'grady sounds awesome!
I've said it elsewhere. Bloke is a dick!
He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them.
Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.
By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the fk should they?
He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them.
Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the f
k should they? Rich_W said:
I've said it elsewhere. Bloke is a dick!
He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them. Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.
By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the fk should they?
Harsh. Not sure you've watched the interview. In it he said "the buck stops with me" (which is a pretty clear acceptance of responsibility), and he didn't admit that he would have taken drugs had he not been caught. Rather he was noncommittal, but to my mind at least wrestled with a hypothetical question, rather than giving the crowd pleasing "of course I would have come clean" answer. Read the book you might change your view of him with a better understanding of why he ended up doping, and the massive amount he has done above and below the radar to try and change the drug culture that was all pervasive in cycling. He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them.
Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the f
k should they? The IoC rules are what they are. I'm not suggesting that they should change them for David Millar, but if you want a reformed character then I can't see one who has done more to repent for past sins, in cycling or any other sport.
Rich_W said:
I've said it elsewhere. Bloke is a dick!
He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them. Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.
By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the fk should they?
he was about twenty when he joined cofidis, that he joined a dodgy french team and stayed clean for as long as he did is quite a urprise to be honest. luckily you have never been led astray by your peers, your elders or someone whom you worked for so you can talk as such.... He has NEVER taken responsibilty for his actions. It's always someone elses fault! To say that people should have been looking after him. he was 27 FFS! he states that "everyone else was therefore he had to" No, he should have blown the whistle on ALL of them.
Even Landis admitted it was his greed for victory that drove him to cheat.By his own admission if he hadn't have been caught, he would have continued to dope all through his career. I think it's even more stupid that he wants the IOC to reverse his lifetime ban. Why the f
k should they? he did try to blow the whistle, the tour kept it quiet though, they "investigated" his claims, yeah sure they did, thats going to look great infront of the sponsors isnt it.... sorry chaps, we're all a bunch of drug cheats, now about that sponsorship deal....
Can't help but notice the irony of one of the ads at the bottom of this page, given the subject of the thread:
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Popped in to post a link to a snippet of this interview.
I find the whole issue of drugs in sport, and cycling in particular, fascinating. I know a couple of semi-pro cyclists who have some eye opening accounts of drug abuse in the sport at the lower levels.
It's good to see someone be so open and candid about it, only through these kind of disclosures can this culture of the sport change.
I often wonder if there should be 2 leagues: "clean" and the "Glaxo-Smithkline Pro Unlimited Dope tour". One set of althletes see who can be the best through their own endeavour. The other choose to see how far you can push the human body through drugs....
I find the whole issue of drugs in sport, and cycling in particular, fascinating. I know a couple of semi-pro cyclists who have some eye opening accounts of drug abuse in the sport at the lower levels.
It's good to see someone be so open and candid about it, only through these kind of disclosures can this culture of the sport change.
I often wonder if there should be 2 leagues: "clean" and the "Glaxo-Smithkline Pro Unlimited Dope tour". One set of althletes see who can be the best through their own endeavour. The other choose to see how far you can push the human body through drugs....
No need to see how far the human body can be pushed by doping. Tom Simpson famously paid the ultimate price....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtAyGvZqiwk
better for all sport, and it's participants, if doping could be eliminated from sport completely. Even in the 2 tier scenario, you would end up with doped riders claiming to be clean to win the 'non-doped' championships while using high-tech methods to avoid the doping tests.
Great interview, seemed frank and open, and genuinely repentant. But, as mentioned earlier in the thread, which branch of British Heart Foundation did he resurrect that jacket from?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtAyGvZqiwk
better for all sport, and it's participants, if doping could be eliminated from sport completely. Even in the 2 tier scenario, you would end up with doped riders claiming to be clean to win the 'non-doped' championships while using high-tech methods to avoid the doping tests.
Great interview, seemed frank and open, and genuinely repentant. But, as mentioned earlier in the thread, which branch of British Heart Foundation did he resurrect that jacket from?
Edited by yellowjack on Thursday 25th August 00:36
Kieran said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b013pkwf/HARD...
Interesting frank & open personal insight into the world of professional doping. Reinforces how institutionalised drugs were in the sport. Never heard him speak before but comes across as a thoughtful and genuine individual. Danced around the Lance Armstrong question diplomatically. Worth watching.
Interesting frank & open personal insight into the world of professional doping. Reinforces how institutionalised drugs were in the sport. Never heard him speak before but comes across as a thoughtful and genuine individual. Danced around the Lance Armstrong question diplomatically. Worth watching.
If your anti doping this is worth a read , Paul Kimmage irish juniour champion who rode the tour in 86 87 88
and was ostracised by his peers in the Peloton for refusing to take drugs then openly writing about it ,
as an example he mentions doing a 60km time trial and almost throwing up after he finished ...he was 6 minutes behind stage winner Bernard Hinault !!........who was freshly giving interviews , while the author was staggering to his room " how do you compete with that he commented " ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rough_Ride
DBSV8 said:
If your anti doping this is worth a read , Paul Kimmage irish juniour champion who rode the tour in 86 87 88
and was ostracised by his peers in the Peloton for refusing to take drugs then openly writing about it ,
as an example he mentions doing a 60km time trial and almost throwing up after he finished ...he was 6 minutes behind stage winner Bernard Hinault !!........who was freshly giving interviews , while the author was staggering to his room " how do you compete with that he commented " ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rough_Ride
Rocksteadyeddie said:
Lance is also his mate which complicates things further.
Haven't had a chance to watch this interview yet so not sure if he talks about his 'relationship' with Lance or not. But having recently finished his book a couple of weeks ago, he mentions that Lance and him don't speak anymore. I think it was around 2005 or 2006 when Millar attended Lance's after Tour party in Paris and they had a difference of opinion about the future of cycling. Millar felt, after Lance retired, that he should be giving something back to Le Tour but Armstrong was more intent on taking it for what it was worth - in Millar's book at least; it was all about the money.The Stiglet said:
Haven't had a chance to watch this interview yet so not sure if he talks about his 'relationship' with Lance or not. But having recently finished his book a couple of weeks ago, he mentions that Lance and him don't speak anymore. I think it was around 2005 or 2006 when Millar attended Lance's after Tour party in Paris and they had a difference of opinion about the future of cycling. Millar felt, after Lance retired, that he should be giving something back to Le Tour but Armstrong was more intent on taking it for what it was worth - in Millar's book at least; it was all about the money.
having just watched the youtube exchange between Kimmage and Armstrong , Kimmage doesn't do himself any favours imoyellowjack said:
better for all sport, and it's participants, if doping could be eliminated from sport completely.
The ultimate question is - "what is doping?". What is legal and what is illegal forms of enhancing human performance is merely designated by a commitee. Whether it's natural or scientific, the line is blurred and so, while I agree with your sentiment entirely, I think it would be difficult to easily draw such a stark line.Many fine British cyclists never made it on the continent and I wonder if Barry Hoban when he said they couldn't adapt to the diet knew what he was saying.You dont see many old professionals form the 60's and 70's still going strong.
Tom Simpson and all his peers used drugs and it killed him.
Tom Simpson and all his peers used drugs and it killed him.
johnxjsc1985 said:
Many fine British cyclists never made it on the continent and I wonder if Barry Hoban when he said they couldn't adapt to the diet knew what he was saying.You dont see many old professionals form the 60's and 70's still going strong.
Tom Simpson and all his peers used drugs and it killed him.
For the sake of being completely pedantic, but I think a valid point, the drugs didn't kill him, it was the extreme dehydration caused by serious diarrhoea and his inability to absorb fluids. The amphetamines, alcohol (at the bottom of Ventoux) and his intense will to win pushed his body over the edge. A catalogue of mistakes led to his death, not just the drugs.Tom Simpson and all his peers used drugs and it killed him.
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