Cayman R experience...
Discussion
Had the pleasure of 24hr with a Cayman R demo, courtesy of OPC Silverstone (who along with Glasgow have restored my faith in OPCs...and have been FANTASTIC in the customer service and product knowledge stakes)
Dropped my Cayman S Gen1 off, transferred (minimal) luggage, settled into the excellent leather/alcantara bucket, hooked up the Bluetooth, mirrors/seats/wheel in the right place, fired it up, smiled at the snarling PSE (and hit the loud button...lol), and away I went.
Really interesting comparison...I expected to be wowed by a much more hardcore car than the Gen 1...but was not quite like that...I was surprised in several ways:
1. Maybe I'm just a die-hard petrolhead, but the car felt VERY civilised and VERY comfortable. I drove it on a mix of back-roads, motorway, and into Central London. It's not quiet with the PSE, but the noise is deeper than my Gen 1 (which sounds more harsh and has more road noise, which may be my Contis vs the PS2s on the R). It's SO damn easy to drive...everything is feather-light, controls are so well placed...very civilised on the motorway...super flexible engine...almost TOO EASY! (make a really hardcore RS version, guys!)
2. Steering, gearshift feel a LOT lighter than my car (steering most noticeable), could be critical and say it's a bit too light for my taste...but it's mighty accurate and there's plenty of feel so I can't really complain. I have a short-shift fitted (which makes it a bit more firm) on the Gen 1, but the shift definitely felt lighter in the R than the Gen 1 cars I've driven (with & without short shift). Very light, very accurate, pleasure to shift (did I mention indulging the PSE noise?? lol)
3. LSD - peachy. God I've missed it since the GT3 and CSLs. Should be standard! Wish I could retrofit without knackering OPC warranty (I don't trust my IMS enough to risk it...lol)
4. PSE - OMG the noise is wonderful...never intrusive, loud enough to make me change down for the hell of it lots of times...only downside is all those stupid CATS! (I'd have a Remus Titanium on a Gen 2 and have the best of both...)
5. Handling - wonderful balance, very easy to drive very quickly indeed...obviously I have huge respect for our speed limits so I didn't push it in any way in the real world...but it was easy to dream that evening about indulging the soundtrack and chassis and LSD and balance and acres of grip and excellent brakes in all the combinations of roads that I drove it on...especially the slightly damp back-roads and roundabouts
These cars really are EPIC in the balance and handling stakes. Very pleased that my Gen 1 stacks up fantastically well in this area (apart from the LSD it needs so badly) The R had more grip and composure (due to the slightly lower suspension) but actually felt more compliant (I run non PASM with 19" Carrera classics, and it's pretty firm). Near the limit it's peachy...easy to slide & control on the throttle...LOT of fun & never ever felt intimidating. Slight gripe that the steering was a touch light (but that's personal taste)
6. Engine - this was what stuck with me most (diff aside...you can tell I love LSDs...and NOT hte pill variety...lol). The tuned-up-slightly Gen 2 motor is a LOT more flexible and noticeably freer-revving. Picks up more easily, pulls a bit harder (though not ballistic). The noise from the PSE (oral pleasure...lol) added to the experience. My only complaint is that the car can so obviously handle more power it's just a CRIME not to give it another 50hp or so. Perfect car might = Cayman R with a GT3 motor...being harshly objective, it's just not got enough grunt to be 'supercar'...and I did have that nagging suspicion that it wasn't quick enough and I'd want 'more' soon enough...but that's just marketing on Porsche's part. This is a better handling car than ANY 911 I've had or driven (2x turbos, Manthey GT3 included). Am sure that base R + decent sport exhaust (ie 2 cats only) + GT3 throttle body/plenum + remap + filter (giving 360hp odd?) would be pretty special...400 would be better
7. Interior - lovely leather/alcantara bucket seats...but why bother with the folding back...surely the even lighter fixed back buckets are the way to go in a 2 seater? As it was they felt mighty comfortable (more so than the recaros I had in my GT3.1) and I'd have absolutely NO problem driving an awful long way in one (lol). It had aircon - that's a must for me. Bluetooth is STREETS ahead of the PCM with it's separate SIM and hassle of diverting calls...worked quickly and the handsfree sound was really clear...though not to other callers when I entertained myself by dropping down a few gears and indulging the PSE...one fairly significant gripe - the lack of shielding on the instrument binnacle is a pain in the butt...there was a LOT of glare off it, and the idea of weight saving on that level is absurd imo. The cover should be matt black (or carbon) to avoid the glare
8. On the motorway - quick and planted and secure. Wonderful
9. Back roads - surprisingly compliant, wonderful damping, TONS of grip, fantastic brakes. Wonderful
10. City - much easier to drive than my Gen 1 (surprisingly!) lighter steering, lighter clutch, more flexible, and the PSE to warn cyclists of my presence handled speed bumps brilliantly (& didn't ground even once). Very, very impressed with it's versatility
Best handling car I've ever driven? Yes (CSL and 996 Turbo S included). Turbo S much quicker & more clinical point to point...but far less fun. GT3 obviously more intimidating and less forgiving (which I loved...but the R is a far better all-round car given I lost 3 splitters and had to plan my routes to avoid hills & multi-storey car parks & speed bumps)
Best car I've ever driven? Not quite...(lol). Second best to my loved and missed GT3 (especially post Manthey and Alcon) but that's mainly due to THAT engine and the intoxicating sense of speed and involvement and being in tune with the thing...and having to respect it and be 'on my game' the whole time...and the way it put the devil in me every time I drove it, and every drive was an 'occasion'. However for most people the R is going to be a better car, more fun, more versatile, friendlier, cheaper to run/maintain and therefore better...and I'm pretty sure I'd have been quicker on most tracks in the R than the GT3 pre-Alcons (lol...not after though). An R with more grunt and PCCB would be epic
Porsche - give the damn thing more power, and an RS/clubsport option (single mass flywheel & sport clutch & more power & even less weight)
I'm hearing that the next gen Boxster/Caymans will have 4pot turbo motors (a la 1 Series M), which would be NUTS imo (and here's a big, personal, scornful, F-OFF to the environmental lobby out there that makes this sort of depressing thing happen...)
So do I buy one?? This is complicated...lol...I am tempted...but I am also liking the idea of a Boxster Spyder with same chassis etc a LOT (to hear it is to love it I think...and they are usefully cheaper used), and (finance difficulties on older cars aside) I know that deep down I'd love another GT3 (mk 2 996 probably in that price range) even more
Would I buy any 997 (bar a GT3 which I haven't and won't allow myself to drive and be seduced by...lol) instead of an R? NOT A CHANCE!
So now I've bored some of you and I can hear the yawns/snores...lol...am just going to say a really BIG and genuine thanks to OPC Silverstone for the offer, and for the excellent level of technical knowledge the guys there had. I've been in quite a few OPCs, and am regularly disappointed by the product-savvy (even for service managers and technicians!) like the guys that insisted the Gen 2 Boxster Spyder did NOT have an LSD, only the Cayman R, or that the PDK + Chrono plus didn't alter shift speed in any way, just the response to the throttle...as well as various pricing 'issues' between comparable cars...) That sort of experience makes me wonder if I can trust them to maintain the damn cars...but the whole experience in OPC Silverstone was really good and I will DEFINITELY be back (any Boxster Spyders in the Group guys??) and I would recommend them to anyone looking for a 'better OPC' experience (plus Glasgow who were fab when I got my Gen1)
Anyone tempted by a Cayman S or R? Don't hesitate...go drive one (for an hour or more preferably) and be convinced.
Final note - my Gen 1 S is also a fantastic car (just needs more grunt & LSD and the IMS to last...lol) and it wasn't a major anticlimax to drive it home (wish I could have swapped that PSE ver though...lol)
Dropped my Cayman S Gen1 off, transferred (minimal) luggage, settled into the excellent leather/alcantara bucket, hooked up the Bluetooth, mirrors/seats/wheel in the right place, fired it up, smiled at the snarling PSE (and hit the loud button...lol), and away I went.
Really interesting comparison...I expected to be wowed by a much more hardcore car than the Gen 1...but was not quite like that...I was surprised in several ways:
1. Maybe I'm just a die-hard petrolhead, but the car felt VERY civilised and VERY comfortable. I drove it on a mix of back-roads, motorway, and into Central London. It's not quiet with the PSE, but the noise is deeper than my Gen 1 (which sounds more harsh and has more road noise, which may be my Contis vs the PS2s on the R). It's SO damn easy to drive...everything is feather-light, controls are so well placed...very civilised on the motorway...super flexible engine...almost TOO EASY! (make a really hardcore RS version, guys!)
2. Steering, gearshift feel a LOT lighter than my car (steering most noticeable), could be critical and say it's a bit too light for my taste...but it's mighty accurate and there's plenty of feel so I can't really complain. I have a short-shift fitted (which makes it a bit more firm) on the Gen 1, but the shift definitely felt lighter in the R than the Gen 1 cars I've driven (with & without short shift). Very light, very accurate, pleasure to shift (did I mention indulging the PSE noise?? lol)
3. LSD - peachy. God I've missed it since the GT3 and CSLs. Should be standard! Wish I could retrofit without knackering OPC warranty (I don't trust my IMS enough to risk it...lol)
4. PSE - OMG the noise is wonderful...never intrusive, loud enough to make me change down for the hell of it lots of times...only downside is all those stupid CATS! (I'd have a Remus Titanium on a Gen 2 and have the best of both...)
5. Handling - wonderful balance, very easy to drive very quickly indeed...obviously I have huge respect for our speed limits so I didn't push it in any way in the real world...but it was easy to dream that evening about indulging the soundtrack and chassis and LSD and balance and acres of grip and excellent brakes in all the combinations of roads that I drove it on...especially the slightly damp back-roads and roundabouts
These cars really are EPIC in the balance and handling stakes. Very pleased that my Gen 1 stacks up fantastically well in this area (apart from the LSD it needs so badly) The R had more grip and composure (due to the slightly lower suspension) but actually felt more compliant (I run non PASM with 19" Carrera classics, and it's pretty firm). Near the limit it's peachy...easy to slide & control on the throttle...LOT of fun & never ever felt intimidating. Slight gripe that the steering was a touch light (but that's personal taste)6. Engine - this was what stuck with me most (diff aside...you can tell I love LSDs...and NOT hte pill variety...lol). The tuned-up-slightly Gen 2 motor is a LOT more flexible and noticeably freer-revving. Picks up more easily, pulls a bit harder (though not ballistic). The noise from the PSE (oral pleasure...lol) added to the experience. My only complaint is that the car can so obviously handle more power it's just a CRIME not to give it another 50hp or so. Perfect car might = Cayman R with a GT3 motor...being harshly objective, it's just not got enough grunt to be 'supercar'...and I did have that nagging suspicion that it wasn't quick enough and I'd want 'more' soon enough...but that's just marketing on Porsche's part. This is a better handling car than ANY 911 I've had or driven (2x turbos, Manthey GT3 included). Am sure that base R + decent sport exhaust (ie 2 cats only) + GT3 throttle body/plenum + remap + filter (giving 360hp odd?) would be pretty special...400 would be better
7. Interior - lovely leather/alcantara bucket seats...but why bother with the folding back...surely the even lighter fixed back buckets are the way to go in a 2 seater? As it was they felt mighty comfortable (more so than the recaros I had in my GT3.1) and I'd have absolutely NO problem driving an awful long way in one (lol). It had aircon - that's a must for me. Bluetooth is STREETS ahead of the PCM with it's separate SIM and hassle of diverting calls...worked quickly and the handsfree sound was really clear...though not to other callers when I entertained myself by dropping down a few gears and indulging the PSE...one fairly significant gripe - the lack of shielding on the instrument binnacle is a pain in the butt...there was a LOT of glare off it, and the idea of weight saving on that level is absurd imo. The cover should be matt black (or carbon
) to avoid the glare8. On the motorway - quick and planted and secure. Wonderful
9. Back roads - surprisingly compliant, wonderful damping, TONS of grip, fantastic brakes. Wonderful
10. City - much easier to drive than my Gen 1 (surprisingly!) lighter steering, lighter clutch, more flexible, and the PSE to warn cyclists of my presence
handled speed bumps brilliantly (& didn't ground even once). Very, very impressed with it's versatilityBest handling car I've ever driven? Yes (CSL and 996 Turbo S included). Turbo S much quicker & more clinical point to point...but far less fun. GT3 obviously more intimidating and less forgiving (which I loved...but the R is a far better all-round car given I lost 3 splitters and had to plan my routes to avoid hills & multi-storey car parks & speed bumps)
Best car I've ever driven? Not quite...(lol). Second best to my loved and missed GT3 (especially post Manthey and Alcon) but that's mainly due to THAT engine and the intoxicating sense of speed and involvement and being in tune with the thing...and having to respect it and be 'on my game' the whole time...and the way it put the devil in me every time I drove it, and every drive was an 'occasion'. However for most people the R is going to be a better car, more fun, more versatile, friendlier, cheaper to run/maintain and therefore better...and I'm pretty sure I'd have been quicker on most tracks in the R than the GT3 pre-Alcons (lol...not after though). An R with more grunt and PCCB would be epic
Porsche - give the damn thing more power, and an RS/clubsport option (single mass flywheel & sport clutch & more power & even less weight)
I'm hearing that the next gen Boxster/Caymans will have 4pot turbo motors (a la 1 Series M), which would be NUTS imo (and here's a big, personal, scornful, F-OFF to the environmental lobby out there that makes this sort of depressing thing happen...)
So do I buy one?? This is complicated...lol...I am tempted...but I am also liking the idea of a Boxster Spyder with same chassis etc a LOT (to hear it is to love it I think...and they are usefully cheaper used), and (finance difficulties on older cars aside) I know that deep down I'd love another GT3 (mk 2 996 probably in that price range) even more
Would I buy any 997 (bar a GT3 which I haven't and won't allow myself to drive and be seduced by...lol) instead of an R? NOT A CHANCE!
So now I've bored some of you and I can hear the yawns/snores...lol...am just going to say a really BIG and genuine thanks to OPC Silverstone for the offer, and for the excellent level of technical knowledge the guys there had. I've been in quite a few OPCs, and am regularly disappointed by the product-savvy (even for service managers and technicians!) like the guys that insisted the Gen 2 Boxster Spyder did NOT have an LSD, only the Cayman R, or that the PDK + Chrono plus didn't alter shift speed in any way, just the response to the throttle...as well as various pricing 'issues' between comparable cars...) That sort of experience makes me wonder if I can trust them to maintain the damn cars...but the whole experience in OPC Silverstone was really good and I will DEFINITELY be back (any Boxster Spyders in the Group guys??) and I would recommend them to anyone looking for a 'better OPC' experience (plus Glasgow who were fab when I got my Gen1)
Anyone tempted by a Cayman S or R? Don't hesitate...go drive one (for an hour or more preferably) and be convinced.
Final note - my Gen 1 S is also a fantastic car (just needs more grunt & LSD and the IMS to last...lol) and it wasn't a major anticlimax to drive it home (wish I could have swapped that PSE ver though...lol)
Interesting reading thanks for that. As an aside, i have just bought a Spyder and think bar the gen2 GT3, it's the best Porsche i have ever driven. Even one chappie at the Porsche Experience Centre said it's his fave Porsche. I considered the Cayman R for about 10 minutes but just couldn't bring myself to part with the cash for it - maybe if it had been given more hp? The 3.4 engine imho is just superb. Very responsive. Feels quicker than the figures suggest too. I've had it two weeks now and i haven't even looked at what car to buy next yet 
I did find myself looking at the 991 specs wondering what Porsche are going to do with the next Boxster/Cayman engine. Will they grasp the nettle and drop the 350bhp 3.4l motor in and trust that there's sufficient clear water between the (now) >£70k 911 and the ~£45k middies? Or will we get small bore versions, back to 2.7/3.2l?
BTW its my understanding from what's been published that the 4-pot turbo won't replace the six, but will be a supplimentary drive train.
And if it means a cheaper, lighter car, that's just fine by me. We don't all see the future in 400bhp sports cars - certainly not on the roads I drive every day.
SS7
BTW its my understanding from what's been published that the 4-pot turbo won't replace the six, but will be a supplimentary drive train.
And if it means a cheaper, lighter car, that's just fine by me. We don't all see the future in 400bhp sports cars - certainly not on the roads I drive every day.
SS7
I'm in a Gen I Cayman and completely agree with the original poster. I had a similar day, got back into my car and was so pleased that my car still felt great, doesnt stop me sniffing about though. Can anyone shed light on a test between a mk2 996 GT3 and a Boxster Spyder or even a 993 Turbo!!! I know, bit of a random bunch, but love them all.
March2008 said:
Can anyone shed light on a test between a mk2 996 GT3 and a Boxster Spyder or even a 993 Turbo!!! I know, bit of a random bunch, but love them all.
An impossible discussion with no right answer, its just too subjective! They are so different. Actually, there is a right answer, all of them!
MTR
MTR - can't afford a 997 GT3 (but you're right - that's what I want...GT2RS or RUF RT12R aside...lol)
Control weight is a bit of an issue (down to personal preference...mine being that the Gen 2 cars seem a touch too light). Not a major issue as I'm confident I'd get used to it. I do slightly prefer the heavier steering in my Gen 1, but it definitely wouldn't turn me off a Gen 2
There won't be a test between 6 GT3.2 vs Spyder vs 993 Turbo...but my money would be on the 6 GT3 in that list (personal preference). I'm definitely going to look at & drive a Spyder though...looks great and should be close to the Cayman R, plus a useful saving. All depends what you want...they are pretty different cars! Decent 993 Turbos are rare and expensive (to buy & maintain from what I hear), GT3 is pretty 'full on' compared to 997 & 987 cars (with PSM etc)
I did seriously consider tuning my Gen1 CS...but the IMS issues worry me (I have OPC warranty), and I have an urge to go Gen 2 plus Remus Titanium etc (think that combo would be epic...)
But if I could find/finance a decent 6 GT3.2 that's what I'd have for sure...it's just that financing older cars is a major hassle these days and rates etc far less competitive
Boxster Spyder is a SERIOUSLY tempting car at 40k odd if it drives as well as I expect!
Yes...the PSE was a truly wonderful sound (wouldn't buy one though...too expensive comparatively and you can't delete the secondary cats...will never happen but they'd make a ton of money if they offered that as an aftermarket option...lol)
I DO NOT like the idea of 4 pot Turbo in a Boxster/Cayman. The adjustability of the car is a big feature/plus for me, and I think a blown engine would be to detriment of handling. N/A is the way to go in a car like that IMO (though I wouldn't say no to a RUF 3400...lol), guess Turbo tech has come a long way too since my 996 Turbos, so it would seem less drastic (though I'm still not keen on the turbo BMWs)
Light weight is definitely desirable, but doesn't change the fact that I found the Cayman R underpowered at 330hp - that's testimony to how good the chassis is...and my love of grunt (lol) I never felt that disappointment in my GT3.1 (post Manthey K400) so there is a happy compromise (it's 400hp or more & still lightweight...lol)
Control weight is a bit of an issue (down to personal preference...mine being that the Gen 2 cars seem a touch too light). Not a major issue as I'm confident I'd get used to it. I do slightly prefer the heavier steering in my Gen 1, but it definitely wouldn't turn me off a Gen 2
There won't be a test between 6 GT3.2 vs Spyder vs 993 Turbo...but my money would be on the 6 GT3 in that list (personal preference). I'm definitely going to look at & drive a Spyder though...looks great and should be close to the Cayman R, plus a useful saving. All depends what you want...they are pretty different cars! Decent 993 Turbos are rare and expensive (to buy & maintain from what I hear), GT3 is pretty 'full on' compared to 997 & 987 cars (with PSM etc)
I did seriously consider tuning my Gen1 CS...but the IMS issues worry me (I have OPC warranty), and I have an urge to go Gen 2 plus Remus Titanium etc (think that combo would be epic...)
But if I could find/finance a decent 6 GT3.2 that's what I'd have for sure...it's just that financing older cars is a major hassle these days and rates etc far less competitive
Boxster Spyder is a SERIOUSLY tempting car at 40k odd if it drives as well as I expect!
Yes...the PSE was a truly wonderful sound
(wouldn't buy one though...too expensive comparatively and you can't delete the secondary cats...will never happen but they'd make a ton of money if they offered that as an aftermarket option...lol)I DO NOT like the idea of 4 pot Turbo in a Boxster/Cayman. The adjustability of the car is a big feature/plus for me, and I think a blown engine would be to detriment of handling. N/A is the way to go in a car like that IMO (though I wouldn't say no to a RUF 3400...lol), guess Turbo tech has come a long way too since my 996 Turbos, so it would seem less drastic (though I'm still not keen on the turbo BMWs)
Light weight is definitely desirable, but doesn't change the fact that I found the Cayman R underpowered at 330hp - that's testimony to how good the chassis is...and my love of grunt (lol) I never felt that disappointment in my GT3.1 (post Manthey K400) so there is a happy compromise (it's 400hp or more & still lightweight...lol)
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