Buying a used 6 series - tips?
Discussion
Piston-Beemer-Gents,
(1st post so please go easy.) I have set my heart on a 6 series. I have approx 13k to play with. This puts me in the ballpark for '04 645ci's with around 50k miles or '05 630i's with around 65k miles. Car will be used as a daily, doing a commute into London each day. Lots of stop-start traffic equals auto for me I'm afraid.
My first question: 645 or 630?
645 - good: v8 burble. bad: low mpg (not sure I care too much about that), first run of a new model hence fears of expensive gremlins?
630 - good: lighter, cheaper, more reliable? BMW's are all about I6's no?. Bad: slower, not so lovely soundtrack, higher miles in my budget, plus nagging feeling that it's simply NOT a V8 which GT's just should be...
Second question: things to look out for?
My understanding is that some 645's had problems/leaks from autobox which required a part upgrade - is that right?
I know to check the service record on idrive and if anything major is red then probably best to walk away...
Anything else to verify?
thanks in advance
al
(1st post so please go easy.) I have set my heart on a 6 series. I have approx 13k to play with. This puts me in the ballpark for '04 645ci's with around 50k miles or '05 630i's with around 65k miles. Car will be used as a daily, doing a commute into London each day. Lots of stop-start traffic equals auto for me I'm afraid.
My first question: 645 or 630?
645 - good: v8 burble. bad: low mpg (not sure I care too much about that), first run of a new model hence fears of expensive gremlins?
630 - good: lighter, cheaper, more reliable? BMW's are all about I6's no?. Bad: slower, not so lovely soundtrack, higher miles in my budget, plus nagging feeling that it's simply NOT a V8 which GT's just should be...
Second question: things to look out for?
My understanding is that some 645's had problems/leaks from autobox which required a part upgrade - is that right?
I know to check the service record on idrive and if anything major is red then probably best to walk away...
Anything else to verify?
thanks in advance
al
Hi there,
Check all the usual stuff (Service, tax, tyres & discs).
Everything is reasonably expensive. Make sure that you have sufficient in reserve.
If you buy a car that needs a service, some discs amd pads and a couple of tyres, it is £1500 ++
Check for gearbox leaks, seems to be a common thread. I was advised to set aside £1500 for the un-expected.
Make sure that you get a good spec; Sat Nav, heated pews, logic 7 etc.
The V8 should carry a government health warning...........These cars are addictive. It is a monster! It feels very special on every trip.
Buy right and enjoy!
Check all the usual stuff (Service, tax, tyres & discs).
Everything is reasonably expensive. Make sure that you have sufficient in reserve.
If you buy a car that needs a service, some discs amd pads and a couple of tyres, it is £1500 ++
Check for gearbox leaks, seems to be a common thread. I was advised to set aside £1500 for the un-expected.
Make sure that you get a good spec; Sat Nav, heated pews, logic 7 etc.
The V8 should carry a government health warning...........These cars are addictive. It is a monster! It feels very special on every trip.
Buy right and enjoy!
Al Koholic said:
Piston-Beemer-Gents,
(1st post so please go easy.) I have set my heart on a 6 series. I have approx 13k to play with. This puts me in the ballpark for '04 645ci's with around 50k miles or '05 630i's with around 65k miles. Car will be used as a daily, doing a commute into London each day. Lots of stop-start traffic equals auto for me I'm afraid.
My first question: 645 or 630?
645 - good: v8 burble. bad: low mpg (not sure I care too much about that), first run of a new model hence fears of expensive gremlins?
630 - good: lighter, cheaper, more reliable? BMW's are all about I6's no?. Bad: slower, not so lovely soundtrack, higher miles in my budget, plus nagging feeling that it's simply NOT a V8 which GT's just should be...
Second question: things to look out for?
My understanding is that some 645's had problems/leaks from autobox which required a part upgrade - is that right?
I know to check the service record on idrive and if anything major is red then probably best to walk away...
Anything else to verify?
thanks in advance
al
Don't just check service on I drive but check documented history of service as well, the I-drive can be reset.(1st post so please go easy.) I have set my heart on a 6 series. I have approx 13k to play with. This puts me in the ballpark for '04 645ci's with around 50k miles or '05 630i's with around 65k miles. Car will be used as a daily, doing a commute into London each day. Lots of stop-start traffic equals auto for me I'm afraid.
My first question: 645 or 630?
645 - good: v8 burble. bad: low mpg (not sure I care too much about that), first run of a new model hence fears of expensive gremlins?
630 - good: lighter, cheaper, more reliable? BMW's are all about I6's no?. Bad: slower, not so lovely soundtrack, higher miles in my budget, plus nagging feeling that it's simply NOT a V8 which GT's just should be...
Second question: things to look out for?
My understanding is that some 645's had problems/leaks from autobox which required a part upgrade - is that right?
I know to check the service record on idrive and if anything major is red then probably best to walk away...
Anything else to verify?
thanks in advance
al
Roger645 said:
Don't just check service on I drive but check documented history of service as well, the I-drive can be reset.
Of course - with a 60k mile car I reckon it's fair to expect Main Dealer service history.Outside of normal servicing at correct intervals is there anything specific to look out for in the service history? recalls etc.?
Taking day off work next wednesday to tour the country looking at potential candidates - the aim is to return at the end of the day with a new (to me) 645. Excited.
Haggle hard as I think you should be able to do better than 04 for 13k at the moment.
I have the 4.5 in my 5 series, great engine and quite economical. Not much burble though unless you swap out the exhaust - it's a very quiet engine but a great one with plenty of low down torque. Enjoy.
I have the 4.5 in my 5 series, great engine and quite economical. Not much burble though unless you swap out the exhaust - it's a very quiet engine but a great one with plenty of low down torque. Enjoy.
Slurms said:
Olf said:
Haggle hard as I think you should be able to do better than 04 for 13k at the moment.
Not many buyers around at present for the big engined beasties so yeah i'd be tough on the price as I don't think many sellers will exactly have the phone ringing off the hook. What do you think would be a realistic haggle-success off a £14k car - £500 off, £1k?
Try and find specific points to haggle on - needs tyres, needs service, cracked foglight, dent in wing, air con doesn't blow cold, known fault/weakpoint not been done preventatively etc etc.
Other than that it depends entirely on seller and their realism/desperation. If you see a good one that is overpriced, keep an eye on it. I'm watching an a E46 330i touring that has been for sale for nearly a month, been reduced over £500 so far - still asking too much though.
I wouldn't personally be taking 1 day off and aiming to buy a car that day. Go and look at a couple that are near to you, even if you aren't that interested for other reasons (colourm, spec etc) to get your eye in. Then with that knowledge, be really clear on your min spec, mileage, price. When the right one comes up move fast. But you'll have to be patient to make this approach work.
Large petrol engine cars are in freefall, and its coming up to Christmas. There will be a desperate seller and a bargain to be had in the next 0-12 weeks depending on how hard you search and how long you are willing to wait.
Other than that it depends entirely on seller and their realism/desperation. If you see a good one that is overpriced, keep an eye on it. I'm watching an a E46 330i touring that has been for sale for nearly a month, been reduced over £500 so far - still asking too much though.
I wouldn't personally be taking 1 day off and aiming to buy a car that day. Go and look at a couple that are near to you, even if you aren't that interested for other reasons (colourm, spec etc) to get your eye in. Then with that knowledge, be really clear on your min spec, mileage, price. When the right one comes up move fast. But you'll have to be patient to make this approach work.
Large petrol engine cars are in freefall, and its coming up to Christmas. There will be a desperate seller and a bargain to be had in the next 0-12 weeks depending on how hard you search and how long you are willing to wait.
eastsider said:
Try and find specific points to haggle on - needs tyres, needs service, cracked foglight, dent in wing, air con doesn't blow cold, known fault/weakpoint not been done preventatively etc etc.
Other than that it depends entirely on seller and their realism/desperation. If you see a good one that is overpriced, keep an eye on it. I'm watching an a E46 330i touring that has been for sale for nearly a month, been reduced over £500 so far - still asking too much though.
I wouldn't personally be taking 1 day off and aiming to buy a car that day. Go and look at a couple that are near to you, even if you aren't that interested for other reasons (colourm, spec etc) to get your eye in. Then with that knowledge, be really clear on your min spec, mileage, price. When the right one comes up move fast. But you'll have to be patient to make this approach work.
Large petrol engine cars are in freefall, and its coming up to Christmas. There will be a desperate seller and a bargain to be had in the next 0-12 weeks depending on how hard you search and how long you are willing to wait.
Yes - good advice. I have actually done the "check local ones to get eye in" thing already (lots of gold ones for sale near me bizarrely - which I have test driven and kicked tyres etc.)Other than that it depends entirely on seller and their realism/desperation. If you see a good one that is overpriced, keep an eye on it. I'm watching an a E46 330i touring that has been for sale for nearly a month, been reduced over £500 so far - still asking too much though.
I wouldn't personally be taking 1 day off and aiming to buy a car that day. Go and look at a couple that are near to you, even if you aren't that interested for other reasons (colourm, spec etc) to get your eye in. Then with that knowledge, be really clear on your min spec, mileage, price. When the right one comes up move fast. But you'll have to be patient to make this approach work.
Large petrol engine cars are in freefall, and its coming up to Christmas. There will be a desperate seller and a bargain to be had in the next 0-12 weeks depending on how hard you search and how long you are willing to wait.
It's the "known fault/weakpoint" thing I'm after info on though.
Have you been here? http://www.bmwland.co.uk/forums/viewforum.php?f=22
And here? http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f16/
Also it might be worth seeing if you can find a copy of recent Evo, M6 guide but should help with general things to look out for:
http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f74/evo-magazi...
And here? http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f16/
Also it might be worth seeing if you can find a copy of recent Evo, M6 guide but should help with general things to look out for:
http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f74/evo-magazi...
Al Koholic said:
Of course - with a 60k mile car I reckon it's fair to expect Main Dealer service history.
Outside of normal servicing at correct intervals is there anything specific to look out for in the service history? recalls etc.?
Taking day off work next wednesday to tour the country looking at potential candidates - the aim is to return at the end of the day with a new (to me) 645. Excited.
There was a recall for something on the brakes but none apart from that, that I ever received. Outside of normal servicing at correct intervals is there anything specific to look out for in the service history? recalls etc.?
Taking day off work next wednesday to tour the country looking at potential candidates - the aim is to return at the end of the day with a new (to me) 645. Excited.
Have a sit in it and check absolutely everything by switching it on and off or vica versa, A lift of the boot carpet will reveal the tools, locking wheel nut key and a massive battery with pyrotechnic leads, have a good look around this area. Have a gentle wiggle of the steering as you can get a bit of play in the racks.
Most of the panels are plastic so don't tend to suffer too much. Wheels get kerbed very easily so check for bad repairs and tyres are expensive so check not just tread but also kerbing damage.
Sports seats are a nice option if you can find them. 60k is when they are due a spark plug change so bear that in mind if it hasn't been done as it's not cheap.
I think that you need to take your time of you don't want to pay over the odds. In May my 330d M Sport was written of by some idiot in a 7 ton wagon in may. It took Zurich about 7 weeks before they even inspected my car, never mind making me a settlement offer for it. In that time I watched the market closely for a replacement.
There are still cars for sale today that were for sale in June and I think it is because larger engined cars are not selling. Some cars have been reduced as much as £3000 in that time and still are not shifting.
What I have learned is that asking prices on Autotrader are NOT a good indication of values. You need to spend time watching and observing what cars are actually selling - i.e.: those that seem to disappear from Autotrader because they are sold. Then you will have a reasonable idea of the true market price.
Look at Autotrader for just a day, or even a couple of weeks and you only have a brief snapshot that does not really reflect actual market conditions.
There are still cars for sale today that were for sale in June and I think it is because larger engined cars are not selling. Some cars have been reduced as much as £3000 in that time and still are not shifting.
What I have learned is that asking prices on Autotrader are NOT a good indication of values. You need to spend time watching and observing what cars are actually selling - i.e.: those that seem to disappear from Autotrader because they are sold. Then you will have a reasonable idea of the true market price.
Look at Autotrader for just a day, or even a couple of weeks and you only have a brief snapshot that does not really reflect actual market conditions.
jdcampbell said:
I think that you need to take your time if you don't want to pay over the odds....
Look at Autotrader for just a day, or even a couple of weeks and you only have a brief snapshot that does not really reflect actual market conditions.
I hear you. Am off to look at 4 or 5 today but not with the intention of buying (unless one of them turns out to be "the one").Look at Autotrader for just a day, or even a couple of weeks and you only have a brief snapshot that does not really reflect actual market conditions.
I have a checklist of about ten things I want from the car (from colour to mileage) and am maybe prepared to compromise on one or two of them but not more.
Thanks for all the advice - will report back after today's search.
Update: went to see two yesterday.
1) 04 645ci convertible
Pros: service record was very good. Bodywork was good. just past 40k miles. Good spec (sport seats, bluetooth, sat nav, M-wheel etc.) all electrics working.
Cons: badly kerbed wheels (refurb required - not a real problem but a bit of a pain), interior was in a very bad state (looked like a single guy's car and had perhaps been used for Ikea trips - lots of scratches/holes in interior trim especially in the back) - roof had obviously been down in the rain too - lots of water stains on the interior of the roof (probably sort-able but a bit of a pain). Air con obviously not often used - it worked but smelt of wet dog (fixable with new filter or the boiling kettle trick). Laquer worn away on M-wheel (seen this a lot on cars with the M-Wheel - cheapo materials?)
It was close - but not close enough - so walked away.
2) 04 645ci coupe
Pros: interior was in great condition. Got a good vibe from the seller. Rims in good condition. Sat nav. Cheaper - £11.5k
Cons: 5 previous owners, +60k miles, runflats on their way out. Body work not great (parking scuff - easily fixable - big dink on side - not so easily fixed). Poverty spec seats - not heated and without the adjustable thigh support (useful for me at 6' 3")
It was close - but not close enough - so walked away.
Don't think I'm being too picky - I have a list of "must-haves" and a list of "would be nices" - I'm prepared to compromise on the latter but not the former.
Search continues....
1) 04 645ci convertible
Pros: service record was very good. Bodywork was good. just past 40k miles. Good spec (sport seats, bluetooth, sat nav, M-wheel etc.) all electrics working.
Cons: badly kerbed wheels (refurb required - not a real problem but a bit of a pain), interior was in a very bad state (looked like a single guy's car and had perhaps been used for Ikea trips - lots of scratches/holes in interior trim especially in the back) - roof had obviously been down in the rain too - lots of water stains on the interior of the roof (probably sort-able but a bit of a pain). Air con obviously not often used - it worked but smelt of wet dog (fixable with new filter or the boiling kettle trick). Laquer worn away on M-wheel (seen this a lot on cars with the M-Wheel - cheapo materials?)
It was close - but not close enough - so walked away.
2) 04 645ci coupe
Pros: interior was in great condition. Got a good vibe from the seller. Rims in good condition. Sat nav. Cheaper - £11.5k
Cons: 5 previous owners, +60k miles, runflats on their way out. Body work not great (parking scuff - easily fixable - big dink on side - not so easily fixed). Poverty spec seats - not heated and without the adjustable thigh support (useful for me at 6' 3")
It was close - but not close enough - so walked away.
Don't think I'm being too picky - I have a list of "must-haves" and a list of "would be nices" - I'm prepared to compromise on the latter but not the former.
Search continues....
This weekend I went for a few test drives in various machinery. I took out a 2004 645i manual from a BMW dealer @ £15.5k with 40,000 miles. Loved it. Really sweet gearbox, not notchy like the E46 330ci we used to have - really made the car IMHO. I was amazed how similar the overall package felt to my E39 540i sport, I could feel about 80% of the DNA in the 6 series.
Sounds odd?
Must be the engine but also the proportions inside made me feel right at home. I think the 6 is also very well damped and oozes class. The exhausts had a much nicer bark mind you and the extra HP didn't go unnoticed. My E39 is an auto and I haven't yet driven an auto 6 series but the manual really made it feel like a drivers car whilst still having the ability to cruise with all that torque.
Very nice.
Want
One
Soon!
Sounds odd?
Must be the engine but also the proportions inside made me feel right at home. I think the 6 is also very well damped and oozes class. The exhausts had a much nicer bark mind you and the extra HP didn't go unnoticed. My E39 is an auto and I haven't yet driven an auto 6 series but the manual really made it feel like a drivers car whilst still having the ability to cruise with all that torque.
Very nice.
Want
One
Soon!
Al Koholic said:
Don't think I'm being too picky - I have a list of "must-haves" and a list of "would be nices" - I'm prepared to compromise on the latter but not the former.
Search continues....
Agree, doesn't sound like you are being too picky, number of reasonable cosmectic issues on both of those considering you're around the £12k mark. Please keep us updated!Search continues....
The 630i is probably the better all rounder - superb engine, good on fuel and they feel a bit ligher of foot than the V8. The N52 straight six is a real peach.
I would buy from a BMW dealer. Prices are realistic, you get a superb warranty and the cars are generally well prepped - you can always haggle on price and gets little defects sorted.
Give it another 4-5 years and they could well be unwanted, just as happened to the XJS and the original 6 Series. So, buy the right one now - the 630i will be the easier car to sell in the future.
I would buy from a BMW dealer. Prices are realistic, you get a superb warranty and the cars are generally well prepped - you can always haggle on price and gets little defects sorted.
Give it another 4-5 years and they could well be unwanted, just as happened to the XJS and the original 6 Series. So, buy the right one now - the 630i will be the easier car to sell in the future.
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