Which Chimaera to own?!
Discussion
Evening guys,
I've been looking relentlessly through the TVR section for a few weeks now- trying to decide what TVR to buy and have finally settled on getting myself a Chimaera.
I have heard the Rover V8 is pretty reliable and easily repaired if problems arise. The engine note is fantastic based on many Youtube videos probably added by people on here.
I'm not new to forum etiquette, so I have tried searching over and over to try and find more information on my up and coming question, but cannot seem to find it by using the search function on PH- so I'm sorry if the query is easily accessible and asked many times previously.
My query is which engine size to go for? I'm aware that condition will be the deciding factor when viewing possible cars to buy- but I need to know what you guys would be suit my needs. I cannot afford a Chim 500 but the 400, 400HC and 450 (450 would be top of my budget) are my choices.
I like the idea of a 400HC- is it noticeably quicker than a 400 though?
My last reasonably rapid car was a 325bhp Fiat Coupe 20vt and I don't necessarily want to go back in terms of performance, but its not a massive problem- so long as I don't get bored with a standard 4.0, I want to be able to make a long term commitment to the TVR- not get bored within six months and want to move on...
Thanks for your time/input- its greatly appreciated.
On a side note- I would love to come to a meet and have a proper look at a Chimaera if someone wouldn't mind showing me around their pride and joy? My location is Bournemouth.
Sam
I've been looking relentlessly through the TVR section for a few weeks now- trying to decide what TVR to buy and have finally settled on getting myself a Chimaera.
I have heard the Rover V8 is pretty reliable and easily repaired if problems arise. The engine note is fantastic based on many Youtube videos probably added by people on here.
I'm not new to forum etiquette, so I have tried searching over and over to try and find more information on my up and coming question, but cannot seem to find it by using the search function on PH- so I'm sorry if the query is easily accessible and asked many times previously.
My query is which engine size to go for? I'm aware that condition will be the deciding factor when viewing possible cars to buy- but I need to know what you guys would be suit my needs. I cannot afford a Chim 500 but the 400, 400HC and 450 (450 would be top of my budget) are my choices.
I like the idea of a 400HC- is it noticeably quicker than a 400 though?
My last reasonably rapid car was a 325bhp Fiat Coupe 20vt and I don't necessarily want to go back in terms of performance, but its not a massive problem- so long as I don't get bored with a standard 4.0, I want to be able to make a long term commitment to the TVR- not get bored within six months and want to move on...
Thanks for your time/input- its greatly appreciated.
On a side note- I would love to come to a meet and have a proper look at a Chimaera if someone wouldn't mind showing me around their pride and joy? My location is Bournemouth.
Sam
Edited by sonicsam on Saturday 17th September 20:59
sonicsam said:
Evening guys,
My query is which engine size to go for? I'm aware that condition will be the deciding factor when viewing possible cars to buy- but I need to know what you guys would be suit my needs. I cannot afford a Chim 500 but the 400, 400HC and 450 (450 would be top of my budget) are my choices.
I like the idea of a 400HC- is it noticeably quicker than a 400 though?
My last reasonably rapid car was a 325bhp Fiat Coupe 20vt and I don't necessarily want to go back in terms of performance, but its not a massive problem- so long as I don't get bored with a standard 4.0, I want to be able to make a long term commitment to the TVR- not get bored within six months and want to move on...
Thanks for your time/input- its greatly appreciated.
On a side note- I would love to come to a meet and have a proper look at a Chimaera if someone wouldn't mind showing me around their pride and joy? My location is Bournemouth.
Sam
You'll now get loads of different opinions My query is which engine size to go for? I'm aware that condition will be the deciding factor when viewing possible cars to buy- but I need to know what you guys would be suit my needs. I cannot afford a Chim 500 but the 400, 400HC and 450 (450 would be top of my budget) are my choices.
I like the idea of a 400HC- is it noticeably quicker than a 400 though?
My last reasonably rapid car was a 325bhp Fiat Coupe 20vt and I don't necessarily want to go back in terms of performance, but its not a massive problem- so long as I don't get bored with a standard 4.0, I want to be able to make a long term commitment to the TVR- not get bored within six months and want to move on...
Thanks for your time/input- its greatly appreciated.
On a side note- I would love to come to a meet and have a proper look at a Chimaera if someone wouldn't mind showing me around their pride and joy? My location is Bournemouth.
Sam
Edited by sonicsam on Saturday 17th September 20:59
You've already mentioned condition and that is the criterion I would stick with as even the newest Chim is now 10 years old. Personally, I wasn't too fussed about whether I ended up with a Griff or Chim, or 400/450/500 etc., I looked at quite a few a all types and went for the best I could find, which happened to be a 400. Still quite happy with it after many years (but it isn't my daily car and as I have 4 others, it's still a bit different when I do drive it as it's the only soft top)
If you haven't already seen it, look at Chimaera pages , http://www.chimaerapages.com/ gives a few pointers.
I can't answer re 400HC as I haven't driven one, but I find the 400 'adequate' for normal use (I don't track mine). As a 500 is not an option, you'll almost certainly find more 400s around, simply because they are more common.
Are you a member of the TVRCC, they'll hold regular meets somewhere in your area, which would be a good starting point. http://www.tvr-car-club.co.uk/your_region.asp
If no joy on this forum, try a thread under your local PH area thread, see if anybody near you can assist with showing you around.
Good luck
not suggesting that I'm an expert, but "warn" you that if you've had a 325bhp fiat coupe, you probably will find performance is backwards for you.
forget the 400 (inc HC) in your circs. The 430 has a cult following and I can say from personal experience that my previous 430 felt just as urgent as my current 500 up to 90mph or so.
The 450 is widely regarded as the best balance of the RV8s and reputedly the x-bolted 450 block is the "safest" to customise.
I went 500 but felt it lacked guts over 100mph therefore supercharged it.
My opinion is strongly biased comparing the chimaera performance to previous "quick" cars - I was disappointed even with the 500 compared to my Boxster RS60 (303bhp).
You'll also be aware that the true average output of the RV8 is roughly 15% less than the quoted figures, even for a very "strong" one. For example, a very good 500 will be 280bhp - not the quoted 320 ! Doesn't matter if you haven't had 300bhp before, but if you have, you'll notice.
forget the 400 (inc HC) in your circs. The 430 has a cult following and I can say from personal experience that my previous 430 felt just as urgent as my current 500 up to 90mph or so.
The 450 is widely regarded as the best balance of the RV8s and reputedly the x-bolted 450 block is the "safest" to customise.
I went 500 but felt it lacked guts over 100mph therefore supercharged it.
My opinion is strongly biased comparing the chimaera performance to previous "quick" cars - I was disappointed even with the 500 compared to my Boxster RS60 (303bhp).
You'll also be aware that the true average output of the RV8 is roughly 15% less than the quoted figures, even for a very "strong" one. For example, a very good 500 will be 280bhp - not the quoted 320 ! Doesn't matter if you haven't had 300bhp before, but if you have, you'll notice.
Sam, The Bristol TVRCC are going to be at Wilverley Plain Picnic Area (in the New Forest) approx 12.30pm tomorrow (Sunday 18th Sept) please feel free to pop along and have a chat. There will be a few Chimaera's there (my wife's 450) also my 500 Griff. we'll happily take you through the finer points etc. Ask for Matt or Amanda.
Good luck with your search.
Matt
Good luck with your search.
Matt
This is a common question.
I always say 'You can drive a 500 like a 400 if you want to, but you can't drive a 400 like a 500'.
Condition is everything - chassis outriggers, wishbones, interior. Griff vs Chim - personal taste.
Speed 6 'T' car - quicker, more modern ride - expensive engine rebuild at 30 000 miles if not already done.
Best of luck - the car will find you and you'll know when that happens, just keep looking. Driving/owning a TVR is not just about the speed of it, it's the whole experience which gives you that TVR grin. I don't know if you can get that owning any other sub 20k car. I've had my Griff 500 3 years and I still get a buzz just seeing it sitting in the garage!
I always say 'You can drive a 500 like a 400 if you want to, but you can't drive a 400 like a 500'.
Condition is everything - chassis outriggers, wishbones, interior. Griff vs Chim - personal taste.
Speed 6 'T' car - quicker, more modern ride - expensive engine rebuild at 30 000 miles if not already done.
Best of luck - the car will find you and you'll know when that happens, just keep looking. Driving/owning a TVR is not just about the speed of it, it's the whole experience which gives you that TVR grin. I don't know if you can get that owning any other sub 20k car. I've had my Griff 500 3 years and I still get a buzz just seeing it sitting in the garage!
sonicsam said:
I don't necessarily want to go back in terms of performance, but its not a massive problem- so long as I don't get bored with a standard 4.0, I want to be able to make a long term commitment to the TVR- not get bored within six months and want to move on...
Without wishing to invite controversy Sam:Firstly - those with smaller engines swear that they're quick enough (yet often -not always- add as many relatively inexpensive upgrades as they can afford, ACT induction kits, chips, upgraded trumpets etc.etc. etc. etc.). Likewise those with 430/450s. Even those with 500s actually.
Also consider that, bearing in mind the low numbers of chims/griffs ever built, a relatively high %age have been seriously modified - stage 3+ heads, bigger blocks, turbos, superchargers, LS3 transplants and so on. Some 400s as standard barely break into the 200+ bhp mark. And it is totally pot luck whether your new engine will be 15% or 30% behind manufacturer's quoted figures - unless the seller is kind enough to let you dyno the car before you buy.
So - it depends where you set your benchmarks. 0-60 all RV8s are quick - fine if that's what you want. If you're concerned about power overcoming aerodynamics to give you (hypothetical) 3 figure speeds decisive overtaking advantage, then you'll be disappointed against modern benchmarks (including Tdi repmobiles)
If you want a nippy classic car, any of them will do. If you're looking for the "monster" performance that the press raved about in the 90s, then 20 years later the cars do fall short.
My opinion is geared specifically to your stated experience - compared to a 90's celica or supra, E30 M3, Gti or whatever - yes the RV8s are quick. But you've come from a 325bhp fiat coupe which is on a different level to that list.
I feel that with anything less than a 500 you WILL get bored quickly. You need to resolve firmly whether "going backwards in performance" is an issue or not.
Aside from speed/performance, you also need to consider that generally the standard cars handle like dogs - again compared to modern machinery. Buying second hand obviously means you might be offered a car that's been sorted with nitrons, gaz gold pros etc., but if not, you need to budget £1000-£1500 for this to get reasonable handling. Even then, most modern hot hatches and up will leave you wallowing on the twisties.
You'll find on these forums that opinions (generally) split into two camps : the subjective and blind "my choice of Classic Car is the best ever blah blah blah" and the alternative "My Classic Car is flawed but can get close to what i want, given enough time and money" - I personally feel the more objective latter is the stance you should take.
The T Cars are much quicker, but running costs are considerably higher even if an engine rebuild isn't required. Chances are, unless you're spending £18k+, it might be required before long.
Pursyluv said:
How much do Chim 450's sell for? i bought an 03 Tam for a tad over £13k, it has dyno'd 352bhp, i know it's no V8, but it will feel faster than the Fiat, whereas the Chim may not, and don't you think it's just the best looking TVR?
Yes they do look nice and handle very well,look more modern...think they are a generation in front of the Chimaera. Big problem you always have sweat on your eyebrow waiting for the engine to go BANG !
Offer me one with say 12000 mile warranty or a LS lump i may be interested .
is that 352hp a 3.6l
Edited by SILICONEKID340HP on Sunday 18th September 09:44
I've had a 400 and 400hc, wasn't much difference, if anything the 400 was smoother to drive. There were times where I wanted a bit more power, but still was far from slow to 100...
The thing to bear in mind is that they aren't the fastest things in the world, for me it was always the sense of occasion. Oh and the noise!!!
The thing to bear in mind is that they aren't the fastest things in the world, for me it was always the sense of occasion. Oh and the noise!!!
If you're after any kind of performance I would suggest that you might even find that a 500 isn't quite enough. Up to 50mph or so it's a very quick car (especially off the line), but I really do think that a powerful diesel would be more than a match at speeds above that. The performance seems to tail off quite badly and this is on a car that made 240 at the wheels.
I don't think you'd get bored with a 400 because there's far more to them than just speed, but if you're after out and out performance I wouldn't even entertain the idea of anything less than a proven 450 or a decent 500.
I don't think you'd get bored with a 400 because there's far more to them than just speed, but if you're after out and out performance I wouldn't even entertain the idea of anything less than a proven 450 or a decent 500.
simonej said:
If you're after any kind of performance I would suggest that you might even find that a 500 isn't quite enough. Up to 50mph or so it's a very quick car (especially off the line), but I really do think that a powerful diesel would be more than a match at speeds above that. The performance seems to tail off quite badly and this is on a car that made 240 at the wheels.
I don't think you'd get bored with a 400 because there's far more to them than just speed, but if you're after out and out performance I wouldn't even entertain the idea of anything less than a proven 450 or a decent 500.
Or a stripped down and rebuilt 400HCI don't think you'd get bored with a 400 because there's far more to them than just speed, but if you're after out and out performance I wouldn't even entertain the idea of anything less than a proven 450 or a decent 500.
Some very interesting replies- thanks for that guys, exactly the kind of informative response I was after.
I know the Chim may not be as quick now but still feel the car is right for me based on the aural pleasure it gives and it must be a car that people stop to stare at? (I personally love the feeling I'm driving something special, I know that some people hate attention that their cars can get)
I'm surprised there is not really any difference between a 400 and 400HC though? For some reason I assumed the 400HC would be similar performing to a 450? Im glad I'm asking these questions and getting the answers before I find out the hard way!
Regarding the TVRCC- I tried to view the forum but I think I have to pay to sign up? I Don't mind doing that once I have gotten a car but seems kind of a waste to do it now with all the discounts membership seems to entail.
I would love a Tamora but alas my budget doesnt stretch to that either- My budget is about £6-9k.
The thought of owning a TVR does scare me and excite me in equal measure- the thought of keeping it running is the risk factor but the other side of it is getting to drive a British sports car with a fantastic soundtrack.
I know the Chim may not be as quick now but still feel the car is right for me based on the aural pleasure it gives and it must be a car that people stop to stare at? (I personally love the feeling I'm driving something special, I know that some people hate attention that their cars can get)
I'm surprised there is not really any difference between a 400 and 400HC though? For some reason I assumed the 400HC would be similar performing to a 450? Im glad I'm asking these questions and getting the answers before I find out the hard way!
Regarding the TVRCC- I tried to view the forum but I think I have to pay to sign up? I Don't mind doing that once I have gotten a car but seems kind of a waste to do it now with all the discounts membership seems to entail.
I would love a Tamora but alas my budget doesnt stretch to that either- My budget is about £6-9k.
The thought of owning a TVR does scare me and excite me in equal measure- the thought of keeping it running is the risk factor but the other side of it is getting to drive a British sports car with a fantastic soundtrack.
Sam
My wife runs a very nice Fiat 20v turbo Coupe which is a low millage, strong and standard example. The output when left the factory is 220bhp @ 5750 and 310 Nm @ 2500 and weighs 1310 kgs
This is a very quick car, with turbine smoothness all the way to 7000rpm and will pull like a train to 150mph. Although a little slow off the line (front wheel drive ) it is more than a match for a 400 chimaera once under way.
If yours is modded to over 300bhp then you will be very dissapointed with a 400 chimaera in terms of on the road performance.
They are all quick off the line, but if you want to keep up with the hot hatch guys out on the road then only a 500 will do.
Comparison - My 500 Chimaera, with a few mods will leave most cars and a lot of bikes standing to 60mph, out on the open road it is just a little quicker than the top Hot Hatches, like MeganCups, CupraRs and Focus Rs
Behind the wheel of both cars, my Chimaera feels brutal with instant punch compared with the building power as revs increase of the Fiat
Andy
My wife runs a very nice Fiat 20v turbo Coupe which is a low millage, strong and standard example. The output when left the factory is 220bhp @ 5750 and 310 Nm @ 2500 and weighs 1310 kgs
This is a very quick car, with turbine smoothness all the way to 7000rpm and will pull like a train to 150mph. Although a little slow off the line (front wheel drive ) it is more than a match for a 400 chimaera once under way.
If yours is modded to over 300bhp then you will be very dissapointed with a 400 chimaera in terms of on the road performance.
They are all quick off the line, but if you want to keep up with the hot hatch guys out on the road then only a 500 will do.
Comparison - My 500 Chimaera, with a few mods will leave most cars and a lot of bikes standing to 60mph, out on the open road it is just a little quicker than the top Hot Hatches, like MeganCups, CupraRs and Focus Rs
Behind the wheel of both cars, my Chimaera feels brutal with instant punch compared with the building power as revs increase of the Fiat
Andy
sonicsam said:
I know the Chim may not be as quick now but still feel the car is right for me based on the aural pleasure it gives
I'm totally with you on that Sam, for the first few weeks while you feel your way into what the car is about..The frustration then slams home on the motorway when you realise the car is all mouth and no trousers and you can't shake off that audi 3.0 tdi / Merc 320cdi/ Mini Cooper S / Volvo / whatever it is that's tailgating you. All that noise, all that promise based on the 0-60.... and then you realise that noise is all it is.
This is doubly important when you consider (against for example a Boxster,Caterham or even MX-5) that chims/griffs can't even reclaim the advantage on the twisties - bloody (relatively) useless on anything other than near perfect surfaces.
If you think your budget might stretch to £10k in the next 3-5 months (that's only 12 to 20 weeks after all) and buy Jan/Feb, you might well bag a really good 500.
Please learn from my mistake - under no circumstances buy from a Main Dealer if budget is at all important. I wish I hadn't. Now you're on this forum you'll find out that the best maintained and improved examples are easy enough to trace from the forum and you'll find them in some cases £5k cheaper than a similar (but not as well sorted) Main Dealer car that simply looks right.
Gassing Station | Chimaera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff