Making someone redundant
Discussion
Hi there,
Need some advice. I work for an overseas firm and have just been told I need to make somebody redundant. These are the key facts.
Overall workforce reduction of X%, including the HQ office.
We represent the UK office (the only office outside the motherland)
The employee in question has been here 1 year and and a few months
They are twenty something years old, no dependants
Including me there are less than 5 of us in the UK.
Their position will not be replaced.
On their employment contract I only have to provide one months notice.
As we are such a small office and the other unaffected party (other than me) still has a position, how should I play this? Do I actually have to do some consultation period?
I want to keep it as clean as possible, but to act quickly.
Need some advice. I work for an overseas firm and have just been told I need to make somebody redundant. These are the key facts.
Overall workforce reduction of X%, including the HQ office.
We represent the UK office (the only office outside the motherland)
The employee in question has been here 1 year and and a few months
They are twenty something years old, no dependants
Including me there are less than 5 of us in the UK.
Their position will not be replaced.
On their employment contract I only have to provide one months notice.
As we are such a small office and the other unaffected party (other than me) still has a position, how should I play this? Do I actually have to do some consultation period?
I want to keep it as clean as possible, but to act quickly.
I *think* you can offer salary in lieu of notice (Plus actual redundancy pay on top of that of course!). So you effectively keep paying them for the 1 month notice period, but they don't have to come into work. Saves a heavy mood in the office and gives them a better chance at finding a new job.
I'm not a lawyer though, so could be wrong.
I'm not a lawyer though, so could be wrong.
There is a whole procedure to follow here, you need to study it in some depth or use someone who understands it. Basically you are making a post redundant, not a person, if there are multiple people doing the same role you need to advise them all that they are at risk and go through the procedure discussing it with them etc. There are lots of sources of info on this, but don't just tell them they are redundant, it doesn't work that way.
GeraldSmith said:
There is a whole procedure to follow here, you need to study it in some depth or use someone who understands it. Basically you are making a post redundant, not a person, if there are multiple people doing the same role you need to advise them all that they are at risk and go through the procedure discussing it with them etc. There are lots of sources of info on this, but don't just tell them they are redundant, it doesn't work that way.
Thanks for all the replies. Gerald- understood on post made redundant. It isn't a case of multiple people doing a job, only the one.I don't understand the proceedure when applied to this particular situation, hence asking!
From your question I presume that you're not an HR person. In which case:
(a) hunt out the HR people from your parent company and get them to provide you with the knowledge & process regarding the UK. Less than 2 years service and the number (ratio?) of people involved does make a different to what the correct process is. If they don't have anyone then tell them that you're going to get advice. For backgorund info the ACAS website is a useful starting point - but get proper advice.
(b) how a company and employee part company is just as important as how they team up in the first place, so impression, attitude and process count for much
(c) do the deed mid-week, that way the person departing has a couple of days to get their head round the situation, have a reasonable weekend and then get jobhunting on the Monday; likewise those remaining have a couple of days in the office which will keep them occupied and help you spot and handle any fallout, everyone gets back to work on Monday normally after having a decent weekend. Doing the deed on a Thursday/Friday just screws up everyone's weekend and dragging someone in on a Monday just to let them go is a bit of a poor show.
Personally, if the person's been doing well at their job and it's just bad luck that they're in the firing line then trying to organise some degree of compensation helps both sides - the person involved and the image of the comapny. As mentioned above "gardening leave" is a common way to do this.
ETA: if the person involved is on a work permit then that seriously complicates matters.
(a) hunt out the HR people from your parent company and get them to provide you with the knowledge & process regarding the UK. Less than 2 years service and the number (ratio?) of people involved does make a different to what the correct process is. If they don't have anyone then tell them that you're going to get advice. For backgorund info the ACAS website is a useful starting point - but get proper advice.
(b) how a company and employee part company is just as important as how they team up in the first place, so impression, attitude and process count for much
(c) do the deed mid-week, that way the person departing has a couple of days to get their head round the situation, have a reasonable weekend and then get jobhunting on the Monday; likewise those remaining have a couple of days in the office which will keep them occupied and help you spot and handle any fallout, everyone gets back to work on Monday normally after having a decent weekend. Doing the deed on a Thursday/Friday just screws up everyone's weekend and dragging someone in on a Monday just to let them go is a bit of a poor show.
Personally, if the person's been doing well at their job and it's just bad luck that they're in the firing line then trying to organise some degree of compensation helps both sides - the person involved and the image of the comapny. As mentioned above "gardening leave" is a common way to do this.
ETA: if the person involved is on a work permit then that seriously complicates matters.
Edited by 72EuropaTC on Thursday 22 September 16:31
As someone said you don't make a person redundant, but a position.
You then have to figure out a criteria for selecting which member(s) of staff are made redundant, there is a phrase they use but its something like "fair and quantifiable". This could be range of skills / experience etc..
The criteria then gets applied to each member of staff.. this will leave a list of who will be let go.
It really shouldn't be you that is doing all this - HR should be, although as the manager of the affected positions/staff you would obviously be involved in the process.
You then have to figure out a criteria for selecting which member(s) of staff are made redundant, there is a phrase they use but its something like "fair and quantifiable". This could be range of skills / experience etc..
The criteria then gets applied to each member of staff.. this will leave a list of who will be let go.
It really shouldn't be you that is doing all this - HR should be, although as the manager of the affected positions/staff you would obviously be involved in the process.
Or if you are part of a big Corporate do more than the minimum, push for a redundancy payout or similar, if they have a company phone or car etc. help them out on returning them losing your job is one thing having to then stand outside waiting for a taxi, or a lift makes it worse.
If you can't boost it over the minimum, and potentially even if you can then be prepared for some anger, and don't forget you'd be the same if you where in their shoes and they where in yours.
If you can't boost it over the minimum, and potentially even if you can then be prepared for some anger, and don't forget you'd be the same if you where in their shoes and they where in yours.
Simon Brooks said:
If you have never had go deal with this situation, call ACAS, they will you give the facts on what why when and how you need to handle the situation. They are are totally unbiased and very helpful
This.It's not such a minefield as perhaps you're being led to believe, but you do need to understand what you're doing and follow a process.
A while ago I was made redundant.
My employer was great. My notice period + holiday pay was ready for me, as was an excellent reference already written out. I just signed a statement saying that I had received the cheque and reference. They then said that it was pay in lieu of notice and that I could go when I wanted to go; i.e. there and then or at the end of the day. I was thanked for the things I'd done and they said they were sorry to let me go.
I stayed until the end of the day, did a couple of urgent tasks, did a few tasks for fellow employees who I liked but whose tasks were non urgent and passed a handover to my manager.
Overall I was pleased as the job wasn't great, was considering leaving anyway, and the way it was handled was nice. I was a bit worried as the job market wasn't great. That was the sole concern.
3 months later I walked into a new job on 50% higher salary and haven't looked back since.
My employer was great. My notice period + holiday pay was ready for me, as was an excellent reference already written out. I just signed a statement saying that I had received the cheque and reference. They then said that it was pay in lieu of notice and that I could go when I wanted to go; i.e. there and then or at the end of the day. I was thanked for the things I'd done and they said they were sorry to let me go.
I stayed until the end of the day, did a couple of urgent tasks, did a few tasks for fellow employees who I liked but whose tasks were non urgent and passed a handover to my manager.
Overall I was pleased as the job wasn't great, was considering leaving anyway, and the way it was handled was nice. I was a bit worried as the job market wasn't great. That was the sole concern.
3 months later I walked into a new job on 50% higher salary and haven't looked back since.
TomJS said:
A while ago I was made redundant.
My employer was great. My notice period + holiday pay was ready for me, as was an excellent reference already written out. I just signed a statement saying that I had received the cheque and reference. They then said that it was pay in lieu of notice and that I could go when I wanted to go; i.e. there and then or at the end of the day. I was thanked for the things I'd done and they said they were sorry to let me go.
I stayed until the end of the day, did a couple of urgent tasks, did a few tasks for fellow employees who I liked but whose tasks were non urgent and passed a handover to my manager.
Overall I was pleased as the job wasn't great, was considering leaving anyway, and the way it was handled was nice. I was a bit worried as the job market wasn't great. That was the sole concern.
3 months later I walked into a new job on 50% higher salary and haven't looked back since.
You were robbed blind.My employer was great. My notice period + holiday pay was ready for me, as was an excellent reference already written out. I just signed a statement saying that I had received the cheque and reference. They then said that it was pay in lieu of notice and that I could go when I wanted to go; i.e. there and then or at the end of the day. I was thanked for the things I'd done and they said they were sorry to let me go.
I stayed until the end of the day, did a couple of urgent tasks, did a few tasks for fellow employees who I liked but whose tasks were non urgent and passed a handover to my manager.
Overall I was pleased as the job wasn't great, was considering leaving anyway, and the way it was handled was nice. I was a bit worried as the job market wasn't great. That was the sole concern.
3 months later I walked into a new job on 50% higher salary and haven't looked back since.
You could have easily got three months ex gratia tax free on top. They bummed you.
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