997.2 GT3 RS vs F10 M5

[Chunkychucky]

Can't wait to see the full video on Friday, looks like the RS driver could go a bit quicker through the bends (no brainer there really), but even the slightest straight and the M5 is just stonking away, in the last 10 seconds it's ridiculous. Need to feel that power I think..

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/porsche-911-gt3...

[Mermaid]

Turbo M power.

[Destructo]

That sounds amazing. What are your guys thoughts on the new body style?

[seawise]

absolute nonsense - lets see the lap times . the GT3 would murder it under braking and entry, apex and exit speeds. on the pit straight yes of course the 580ps barge will pull out a lead, but it would be lost in the braking zone alone. weight and inertia are the M5's undoing, the laws of physics don't lie i'm afraid.

having said that i love the new M5, proper piece of kit (for a roadcar). when they shed 60 pcnt of their value i will no doubt replace my E60 M5 with an F10.

[Chunkychucky]

seawise said:

the laws of physics don't lie i'm afraid.

having said that i love the new M5, proper piece of kit (for a roadcar). when they shed 60 pcnt of their value i will no doubt replace my E60 M5 with an F10.

Not heard of a Nissan GT-R then?

And as for the rest of your point, it is merely a matter of how much slower the M5 will be, rather than will it/won't it. More interesting would be to see it up against the new twin turbo E63 and the facelift XFR - I think that would be a victory for the Bavarian rocket, if only in outright laptime.

[seawise]

Chunkychucky said:

Not heard of a Nissan GT-R then?

lets not go there, we all know that for one banzai lap the GT-R can do extraordinary things, but ask it to do it lap after lap and the car has a meltdown.

i really hope the M5 is not considered as a rival to that car, it's much better than that. i agree the Bavarian car should/will put the E63 and XF-R to the sword.

[130R]

I don't think anyone is realistically going to buy an M5 as a track car! I imagine the point of this video is to show how good the M5 is around a track, using what is probably the best track-focused road car you can buy as a benchmark.

[Mermaid]

130R said:

I don't think anyone is realistically going to buy an M5 as a track car! I imagine the point of this video is to show how good the M5 is around a track, using what is probably the best track-focused road car you can buy as a benchmark.

M5 ethos has been a family carriage (lots of luggage room etc) that travels virtually as fast as any 911 but in much greater comfort and can also be driven on track at around 5% of the best 911.

I'd have both - the 911 as a private car and the M5 paid for by a company.

[Chunkychucky]

Mermaid said:

M5 ethos has been a family carriage (lots of luggage room etc) that travels virtually as fast as any 911 but in much greater comfort and can also be driven on track at around 5% of the best 911.

Not necessarily as fast as any 911, just a 911, and i'm willing to bet it would beat one the tame side of a Carrera S, and I should think that will be around £10k dearer than the M5.

[W8PMC]

seawise said:

lets not go there, we all know that for one banzai lap the GT-R can do extraordinary things, but ask it to do it lap after lap and the car has a meltdown.

i really hope the M5 is not considered as a rival to that car, it's much better than that. i agree the Bavarian car should/will put the E63 and XF-R to the sword.

Really?? My GT-R's never had a meltdown & i've done lap after lap on a few tracks.

Also you can't deny the GT-R isn't the lightest car in the world, but it's quite a bit lighter than an M5 & is hardly the heaviest car on the road. That said it crucifys even it's anorexic competitors

[ecain63]

W8PMC said:

seawise said:

lets not go there, we all know that for one banzai lap the GT-R can do extraordinary things, but ask it to do it lap after lap and the car has a meltdown.

i really hope the M5 is not considered as a rival to that car, it's much better than that. i agree the Bavarian car should/will put the E63 and XF-R to the sword.

Really?? My GT-R's never had a meltdown & i've done lap after lap on a few tracks.

Also you can't deny the GT-R isn't the lightest car in the world, but it's quite a bit lighter than an M5 & is hardly the heaviest car on the road. That said it crucifys even it's anorexic competitors

As amazing as the GTR is, dont you get the feeling that its not really you thats doing the driving? All that electrowizardry and computer gubbins only makes for a car that a granny could drive fast. The point of the M car is to take the standard 1, 3, 5 or 6 series and turn it into a focussed drivers machine that needs to be studied and learned before ploughing round a track. You need to be awake to drive an M quickly (same goes for AMG), whereas you could lap the Ring in under 9 mins in your sleep in the GTR.

M5 = Sophisticated drivers car
GTR = Facts and figures nerds car

[StuB]

Not much to see in the video and not hearing any tyre noise means the corner speeds looked pretty tame IMO.

ecain63 said:

W8PMC said:

seawise said:

lets not go there, we all know that for one banzai lap the GT-R can do extraordinary things, but ask it to do it lap after lap and the car has a meltdown.

i really hope the M5 is not considered as a rival to that car, it's much better than that. i agree the Bavarian car should/will put the E63 and XF-R to the sword.

Really?? My GT-R's never had a meltdown & i've done lap after lap on a few tracks.

Also you can't deny the GT-R isn't the lightest car in the world, but it's quite a bit lighter than an M5 & is hardly the heaviest car on the road. That said it crucifys even it's anorexic competitors

As amazing as the GTR is, dont you get the feeling that its not really you thats doing the driving? All that electrowizardry and computer gubbins only makes for a car that a granny could drive fast. The point of the M car is to take the standard 1, 3, 5 or 6 series and turn it into a focussed drivers machine that needs to be studied and learned before ploughing round a track. You need to be awake to drive an M quickly (same goes for AMG), whereas you could lap the Ring in under 9 mins in your sleep in the GTR.

M5 = Sophisticated drivers car
GTR = Facts and figures nerds car

Personally, I'm not really that bothered how the new M5 stacks up against the GTR, or indeed
the GT3RS.

The M5 is a performance icon, but I seriously think Mr. ECain63 may have lost the plot.

Anyone can get in any car and drive it badly. A car with more 'driver aids' will provide a safety net and systems may help a complete nobber look half decent, so tend to flatter somewhat.

You cannot however extract a good or consistent set of lap times driving like a cock, driver aids or not. I do believe a competent driver can get in most any car and extract a laptime and usually one to shame drivers of supposedly superior machinery.

Why do people believe really the hyperbole and hyperbks talked about various cars by the media?

I love PH because it's usually real enthusiasts who love driving and like talking about it.

Shouldn't be long now till we can experience the legend that is M5

Let's make our own minds up when we have actually had some time behind the wheel, looking out of the side window (hope the side wipers are an option, also for the side camera).

Rant over

[ecain63]

StuB said:

Not much to see in the video and not hearing any tyre noise means the corner speeds looked pretty tame IMO.

ecain63 said:

W8PMC said:

seawise said:

lets not go there, we all know that for one banzai lap the GT-R can do extraordinary things, but ask it to do it lap after lap and the car has a meltdown.

i really hope the M5 is not considered as a rival to that car, it's much better than that. i agree the Bavarian car should/will put the E63 and XF-R to the sword.

Really?? My GT-R's never had a meltdown & i've done lap after lap on a few tracks.

Also you can't deny the GT-R isn't the lightest car in the world, but it's quite a bit lighter than an M5 & is hardly the heaviest car on the road. That said it crucifys even it's anorexic competitors

As amazing as the GTR is, dont you get the feeling that its not really you thats doing the driving? All that electrowizardry and computer gubbins only makes for a car that a granny could drive fast. The point of the M car is to take the standard 1, 3, 5 or 6 series and turn it into a focussed drivers machine that needs to be studied and learned before ploughing round a track. You need to be awake to drive an M quickly (same goes for AMG), whereas you could lap the Ring in under 9 mins in your sleep in the GTR.

M5 = Sophisticated drivers car
GTR = Facts and figures nerds car

Personally, I'm not really that bothered how the new M5 stacks up against the GTR, or indeed
the GT3RS.

The M5 is a performance icon, but I seriously think Mr. ECain63 may have lost the plot.

Anyone can get in any car and drive it badly. A car with more 'driver aids' will provide a safety net and systems may help a complete nobber look half decent, so tend to flatter somewhat.

You cannot however extract a good or consistent set of lap times driving like a cock, driver aids or not. I do believe a competent driver can get in most any car and extract a laptime and usually one to shame drivers of supposedly superior machinery.

Why do people believe really the hyperbole and hyperbks talked about various cars by the media?

I love PH because it's usually real enthusiasts who love driving and like talking about it.

Shouldn't be long now till we can experience the legend that is M5

Let's make our own minds up when we have actually had some time behind the wheel, looking out of the side window (hope the side wipers are an option, also for the side camera).

Rant over

If you find my 'plot' please let me know.

lol, i love a bit of banter.

[seawise]

W8PMC said:

Really?? My GT-R's never had a meltdown & i've done lap after lap on a few tracks.

clearly you weren't trying hard enough then....

gawd, why does it always have to come back to the GT-R - i know the GT-R is a first rate motorcar, i accept it certainly makes the 911 turbo look dubious value for money ! but it was not developed as a true competitor to the GT3 911, or for that matter an M5, they both appeal to very different profile of buyer / enthusiast. it's too heavy and numb to be classed as a drivers car like a GT3 and it's too compromised and unrefined to be compared with an M5.

my initial post point was the irritation of half baked journalism to come up with an article comparing the new M5 with the ultimate track / road legal 911. a totally pointless comparison, except i presume to make the point that the new M5 is jolly fast. on that basis fine, but it reminds me of an Autocar article in 2005 testing the then new M5 against a Ferrari F430 back and stating the M5 was the better sports car. what a load of sensationalised waffle that was too.

[Patrick Bateman]

Defining driver's car here sounds an awful lot like 'no true Scotsman...'

[Chunkychucky]

seawise said:

clearly you weren't trying hard enough then....

gawd, why does it always have to come back to the GT-R - i know the GT-R is a first rate motorcar, i accept it certainly makes the 911 turbo look dubious value for money ! but it was not developed as a true competitor to the GT3 911, or for that matter an M5, they both appeal to very different profile of buyer / enthusiast. it's too heavy and numb to be classed as a drivers car like a GT3 and it's too compromised and unrefined to be compared with an M5.

my initial post point was the irritation of half baked journalism to come up with an article comparing the new M5 with the ultimate track / road legal 911. a totally pointless comparison, except i presume to make the point that the new M5 is jolly fast. on that basis fine, but it reminds me of an Autocar article in 2005 testing the then new M5 against a Ferrari F430 back and stating the M5 was the better sports car. what a load of sensationalised waffle that was too.

I agree with what you say totally, but, now that the M5 has taken a jump in price to around £70k, i'm sure there'll be some motoring rag or another that will pit it against a GT-R, if only for what else you can get for similar money. IMO, and I do love GT-Rs, £70K is alot to pay for a Nissan badge, plus I think i'd prefer the more enthusiast-biased rear drove set up of the M5. Plus, the trouble is with any of these cars, it's so rare that you ever get to exploit any of their performance on the public roads due to traffic jams, potholes, speed cameras and whatever other reason, so it kind of makes all this irrelecant anyway... but I digress

[ermi]

Wrong topic title as it is actually Mclaren. http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/porsche-gt3-rs-...

[Mermaid]

ermi said:

Wrong topic title as it is actually Mclaren. http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-video/porsche-gt3-rs-...

so the GT3 RS is much better value

& I expect it will maintain residuals better.

Would have been nice to see these 2 at Silverstone

[Trommel]

ecain63 said:

M5 = Sophisticated drivers car
GTR = Facts and figures nerds car