Rovers. Buying one.
Discussion
I'm in the market for a cheap car to get me through over the winter, and avoid putting any winter mileage on my other cars. Scouring the classifieds it looks like I'm going to end up in a Rover 45 - plenty about for sub £500 money with plenty of test on.
Now, I've seen 1.4s, 1.6s, 1.8s, 2.0s and 2.0 diesels. I'd like to stay away from the diesels (been there done that, prefer petrol) but just wondering about cambelt mileages on the other engines. Power doesn't worry me - it's going to be doing 50 local miles a week - if that.
And, I know this might cause some debate, but which engines would be more LIKELY (I'm not saying it WILL happen!) to suffer from HGF? I will be buying a car with probably over 100k on.
Cheers!
Now, I've seen 1.4s, 1.6s, 1.8s, 2.0s and 2.0 diesels. I'd like to stay away from the diesels (been there done that, prefer petrol) but just wondering about cambelt mileages on the other engines. Power doesn't worry me - it's going to be doing 50 local miles a week - if that.
And, I know this might cause some debate, but which engines would be more LIKELY (I'm not saying it WILL happen!) to suffer from HGF? I will be buying a car with probably over 100k on.
Cheers!
I've always heard that the larger K-series engines suffer HGF more than the smaller ones. TBH though, I would go for a 1.4 16v. 100hp or there abouts so not really slow but still economical for a run about and cheap to insure too. Plus, the 1.6 and 1.8 don't really offer much more power anyway unless you go for the 1.8vvc.
Even the 1.4 8v in the 200/25 is a good little engine.
Even the 1.4 8v in the 200/25 is a good little engine.
The K-series was originally designed as a 1400, so cylinder liners etc are optimised, and fewer Head gasket problems..
So 1400's will be better. Head gaskets failures are worse on earlier cars, post 2002 you should be fine.
They don't go quickly either; so if the temp is steady, and there's no loss of coolant, and no mayo in the oil or water, you'll easy last a winter so long as you don't thrash it from cold.
So 1400's will be better. Head gaskets failures are worse on earlier cars, post 2002 you should be fine.
They don't go quickly either; so if the temp is steady, and there's no loss of coolant, and no mayo in the oil or water, you'll easy last a winter so long as you don't thrash it from cold.
They sound pretty good for a 4-cylinder 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PRV8T0cFdU
The VVC engines are more complicated, heavier and are difficult to fix if anything goes wrong with the VVC mechanism.
It seems pretty hit and miss with regard to quality control - bit like 70s Alfas!! I get the impression it got to 12pm on a Friday and Longbridge was already thinking of the pub...
If I were you, I'd try and find one that had been fixed properly - head skimmed, peened, liners checked etc, new HG, by somebody reputable. Once it's been fixed once, they can be very reliable, and are good engines.
Not so sure about lower capacity versions, but I'd imagine they are indeed better as standard, as that's what the engine / head was designed for. 1.8s still have the same valves etc, so aren't really ideal unless modified.
I'm really tempted by an MG ZR 160. Good little cars. I'd have thought something like the 105bhp 1.4 would still be a laugh though - they handle well and look quite reasonable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PRV8T0cFdU
The VVC engines are more complicated, heavier and are difficult to fix if anything goes wrong with the VVC mechanism.
It seems pretty hit and miss with regard to quality control - bit like 70s Alfas!! I get the impression it got to 12pm on a Friday and Longbridge was already thinking of the pub...
If I were you, I'd try and find one that had been fixed properly - head skimmed, peened, liners checked etc, new HG, by somebody reputable. Once it's been fixed once, they can be very reliable, and are good engines.
Not so sure about lower capacity versions, but I'd imagine they are indeed better as standard, as that's what the engine / head was designed for. 1.8s still have the same valves etc, so aren't really ideal unless modified.
I'm really tempted by an MG ZR 160. Good little cars. I'd have thought something like the 105bhp 1.4 would still be a laugh though - they handle well and look quite reasonable.
The 2.0 uses the T-series rather than the K-series engine, and this uses a conventional design of headgasket with an iron block mated to an alloy head, rather then a two piece alloy block with the head bolts as load bearing members.
This is much less prone to headgasket failure and has a more robust cooling system than the K-Series.
It does suffer from its own issues of course, the front coolant pipe just above the manifold gets perished easily and will spilt. The honda PG1 gearbox uses nylon bearing bushes which wear, leading to whine from the gearbox and early failure.
The distributer is also prone to cracking which leads to water ingress and misfiring.
This is much less prone to headgasket failure and has a more robust cooling system than the K-Series.
It does suffer from its own issues of course, the front coolant pipe just above the manifold gets perished easily and will spilt. The honda PG1 gearbox uses nylon bearing bushes which wear, leading to whine from the gearbox and early failure.
The distributer is also prone to cracking which leads to water ingress and misfiring.
pthelazyjourno said:
They sound pretty good for a 4-cylinder
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PRV8T0cFdU
The VVC engines are more complicated, heavier and are difficult to fix if anything goes wrong with the VVC mechanism.
It seems pretty hit and miss with regard to quality control - bit like 70s Alfas!! I get the impression it got to 12pm on a Friday and Longbridge was already thinking of the pub...
If I were you, I'd try and find one that had been fixed properly - head skimmed, peened, liners checked etc, new HG, by somebody reputable. Once it's been fixed once, they can be very reliable, and are good engines.
Not so sure about lower capacity versions, but I'd imagine they are indeed better as standard, as that's what the engine / head was designed for. 1.8s still have the same valves etc, so aren't really ideal unless modified.
I'm really tempted by an MG ZR 160. Good little cars. I'd have thought something like the 105bhp 1.4 would still be a laugh though - they handle well and look quite reasonable.
The VVC engines are otherwise the same apart formt he VVC gubbins which is the actuator and the stuff to adjust the cams from what I remember, cant imagine its massively heavier than a vanilla 1.8, from doing the HG on my VVC it didn't seem that complicated and I believe that part is pretty reliable, plus it gives more power and flexibility.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PRV8T0cFdU
The VVC engines are more complicated, heavier and are difficult to fix if anything goes wrong with the VVC mechanism.
It seems pretty hit and miss with regard to quality control - bit like 70s Alfas!! I get the impression it got to 12pm on a Friday and Longbridge was already thinking of the pub...
If I were you, I'd try and find one that had been fixed properly - head skimmed, peened, liners checked etc, new HG, by somebody reputable. Once it's been fixed once, they can be very reliable, and are good engines.
Not so sure about lower capacity versions, but I'd imagine they are indeed better as standard, as that's what the engine / head was designed for. 1.8s still have the same valves etc, so aren't really ideal unless modified.
I'm really tempted by an MG ZR 160. Good little cars. I'd have thought something like the 105bhp 1.4 would still be a laugh though - they handle well and look quite reasonable.
What kills the K series is people booting them from cold, the bigger variants as has been said suffer more and hence why Freelanders with the 1.8 were a nightmare, big heavy car with cack handed owners that should have bought a diesel, should never have been fitted to a Freelander, not enough metal in the engine to absorb the thermal shock from accelerating a big lump of a car like that.
Superb engine, the vvc especially when its working, my BRM was a joy to drive until it broke, the gearchange being brilliant as well.
Look for something in 1.4 engine size, esp if its for over winter. As stated earlier, the K-series was designed originally as a 1.4 so the liners are thicker than the 1.6 and 1.8 engines. the bigger engines are the same pistons, just a longer stroke on the 1.8 to give the extra 200cc size.
Main things to look out for is white smoke, oil/water mixing which are signs of HGF. Don't always assume that water loss means HGF, the waterpump seals do go but leak for ages before it becoming obvious there is an issue, same with the inlet manifold gaskets. I would personally look for a derv due to them easily going to 150k+ and 150bhp is attainable for very little outlay.
Main things to look out for is white smoke, oil/water mixing which are signs of HGF. Don't always assume that water loss means HGF, the waterpump seals do go but leak for ages before it becoming obvious there is an issue, same with the inlet manifold gaskets. I would personally look for a derv due to them easily going to 150k+ and 150bhp is attainable for very little outlay.
That looks fine tbh, without seeing it I cant say for sure but seems tidy enough, I was going to suggest this if you wanted more poke:
http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthread.php?t=436550
Belongs to a friend of mine, doubt its ever been past 4k rpm haha
http://forums.mg-rover.org/showthread.php?t=436550
Belongs to a friend of mine, doubt its ever been past 4k rpm haha
Bunnybopper said:
Liquid Knight said:
Hmmmm, a Rover for £500 you say? 
Several actually. All sub 500 with 9-12 months test 
For what you're looking to spend it doesn't really matter does it? The K-series does have a bad reputation but like any car with any engine it's only as good as how well the last owner looked after it.
Happy hunting.
Bunnybopper said:
Why are these so cheap? The alternatives are nothing better than 1.2 corsas of 1993-7 vintage.
Because of your initial question and debate about the dreaded legend of "HGF"Because the British public somehow think that all British products/cars are far less superior to their German counterparts.
Because people are under the impression that because the company went bust, parts are hard to come by.
Because all younger people would rather have teh "sportier" MG Zed variant.
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