Oil Readout Mystery - Subaru - HELP!!
Discussion
I am at a loss and have nowhere else to turn exception the Subaru dealership and I would like to avoid going to them if I can.
[B]CLIFF NOTES/SUMMARY: I didn't realize how much I've typed, so here is the short of it.
In the past year everytime I check the level of oil in my car the dip stick seems to be only slightly wet with oil and it is very subjective as to the actual level. it is never clearly an amount with a visible line as to where the oil ends between the measuring dots/holes on the dip stick. It comes out more like a smear of oil. There are no visible, immediate or otherwise obvious faults with the car to conclude it is in fact leaking or burning up to half the amount it needs which is 2qts. I'm at a loss. [/b]
background info: 2007 Subaru Legacy 2.5 na with manual tranny and 123k on the clock. Always serviced on time and to
spec. I've used Mobile 1 synthetic 5w-30 since the beginning as well and per Subarus spec.
(90% highway miles, and I'm not just saying that, I commute via highway almost 70 miles a day roundtrip) though she is in perfect mechanical condition (and body is mint too, she's my baby). And should be running perfect considering in the past 6 months I replaced with all new tires brakes and rotors (cer
amic), starter and alternator, all belts, full tune up with new ignition coils and platinum plugs, new axle seal when I had to re
place the clutch and not a month later I had to replace the transmission (got a used one off a wrecked legacy with 66k and a full warranty from a reputable salvage yard, good price too, only $700.
So at the moment there are 3 unsolved problems that are driving me absolutely f'ing nuts!! But for the purpose of time constraints right now I will ask your assistance on the one my thread title pertains too.
For about the past year now I have had an oil consumption problem which never happened before. Thing of it is, I don't know if it really is burning the oil or if my dip stick is just somehow not reading right, however that may come to be, I don't know, but hence why I am turning to PH for advice. I've even tried switching from Mobil 1 syn to Royal Purple 5w-30 synthetic. Same problem ensues.
There is no smoke blowing out the tailpipe at all, and no excess of exhaust soot inside the tailpipe when I put my finger in it. No loss of power with the car, no engine codes to be scanned either. Can't be a blown head gasket. No oil leaks of any kind that I can see or detect otherwise. And no oil to be found in the antifreeze or the antifreeze over flow tank, plus I had the radiator flushed when I had the tune up done.
So what's happening is that I will do an oil change, and within a few days check the level and there will be no visible oil between the two measuring dots/holes on the stick. Instead the oil is, how do I describe this?, the oil is like spread about the bottom the dipstick and runs too thin between the dots to conclude any real measure of it. Because unless I'm delusional or hugely mistaken, every car I've owned before this one when checking the oil, you could clearly see the oil on the stick and where the oil ends on the stick woud be a very clearly visible line. There is no line of oil to see on this one. And one could say to just simply be able to get a good reading by whatever oil is in fact on it, but that's just the thing, there is practically no oil on it. Just a very very thing amount. A litle wet. I've tried everything, run the car for a minute, turn it off for a minute then check level.
Now it has just occured to me that I have never checked the level minutes directly after a fresh oil change. And that is because (you will all now yell at me for this, I know I know) the past year I have not personally changed the oil on this car simply because a year ago I gave it to my OH and this is now her car. But we do get it changed through MY shop (my brother and I own an auto parts store and we have a garage with mechanics whom we employ). And yet as silly as it sounds I have never asked them to tell me the level afterwards nor have I myself checked it.
So to end this, I wonder, is my car really consuming oil or is it posible the dip stick isn't reading right? And if that it the case regarding the dip stick, how could that be?
Also, forgot to mention, we end up adding sometimes up to 2 extra quarts of oil less than a week later thinking its running on nothing!! it would read normal, but still the amt of oil on the stick would leave me questioning its amount and have me confused and still not trusting the readout. I am worried I am overfilling it but at the same time worried there is a lack of oil for proper lubrication and fear destroying my engine, especially now that winter is coming.
Just now before posting here I put a quart of the Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer in it. Ran the car a minute or two shut it for.a min or two and checked. Same low read out. And as you all know, Lucas is a top notch product and is very thick and sticks pehenomonally through the crankcase, so you can certainly understabd my concern when after putting Lucas inand still getting no readout.
Any help is appreciated, thank you. I look forward with suspense to hear your advice or general comments.
[B]CLIFF NOTES/SUMMARY: I didn't realize how much I've typed, so here is the short of it.
In the past year everytime I check the level of oil in my car the dip stick seems to be only slightly wet with oil and it is very subjective as to the actual level. it is never clearly an amount with a visible line as to where the oil ends between the measuring dots/holes on the dip stick. It comes out more like a smear of oil. There are no visible, immediate or otherwise obvious faults with the car to conclude it is in fact leaking or burning up to half the amount it needs which is 2qts. I'm at a loss. [/b]
background info: 2007 Subaru Legacy 2.5 na with manual tranny and 123k on the clock. Always serviced on time and to
spec. I've used Mobile 1 synthetic 5w-30 since the beginning as well and per Subarus spec.
(90% highway miles, and I'm not just saying that, I commute via highway almost 70 miles a day roundtrip) though she is in perfect mechanical condition (and body is mint too, she's my baby). And should be running perfect considering in the past 6 months I replaced with all new tires brakes and rotors (cer
amic), starter and alternator, all belts, full tune up with new ignition coils and platinum plugs, new axle seal when I had to re
place the clutch and not a month later I had to replace the transmission (got a used one off a wrecked legacy with 66k and a full warranty from a reputable salvage yard, good price too, only $700.
So at the moment there are 3 unsolved problems that are driving me absolutely f'ing nuts!! But for the purpose of time constraints right now I will ask your assistance on the one my thread title pertains too.
For about the past year now I have had an oil consumption problem which never happened before. Thing of it is, I don't know if it really is burning the oil or if my dip stick is just somehow not reading right, however that may come to be, I don't know, but hence why I am turning to PH for advice. I've even tried switching from Mobil 1 syn to Royal Purple 5w-30 synthetic. Same problem ensues.
There is no smoke blowing out the tailpipe at all, and no excess of exhaust soot inside the tailpipe when I put my finger in it. No loss of power with the car, no engine codes to be scanned either. Can't be a blown head gasket. No oil leaks of any kind that I can see or detect otherwise. And no oil to be found in the antifreeze or the antifreeze over flow tank, plus I had the radiator flushed when I had the tune up done.
So what's happening is that I will do an oil change, and within a few days check the level and there will be no visible oil between the two measuring dots/holes on the stick. Instead the oil is, how do I describe this?, the oil is like spread about the bottom the dipstick and runs too thin between the dots to conclude any real measure of it. Because unless I'm delusional or hugely mistaken, every car I've owned before this one when checking the oil, you could clearly see the oil on the stick and where the oil ends on the stick woud be a very clearly visible line. There is no line of oil to see on this one. And one could say to just simply be able to get a good reading by whatever oil is in fact on it, but that's just the thing, there is practically no oil on it. Just a very very thing amount. A litle wet. I've tried everything, run the car for a minute, turn it off for a minute then check level.
Now it has just occured to me that I have never checked the level minutes directly after a fresh oil change. And that is because (you will all now yell at me for this, I know I know) the past year I have not personally changed the oil on this car simply because a year ago I gave it to my OH and this is now her car. But we do get it changed through MY shop (my brother and I own an auto parts store and we have a garage with mechanics whom we employ). And yet as silly as it sounds I have never asked them to tell me the level afterwards nor have I myself checked it.
So to end this, I wonder, is my car really consuming oil or is it posible the dip stick isn't reading right? And if that it the case regarding the dip stick, how could that be?
Also, forgot to mention, we end up adding sometimes up to 2 extra quarts of oil less than a week later thinking its running on nothing!! it would read normal, but still the amt of oil on the stick would leave me questioning its amount and have me confused and still not trusting the readout. I am worried I am overfilling it but at the same time worried there is a lack of oil for proper lubrication and fear destroying my engine, especially now that winter is coming.
Just now before posting here I put a quart of the Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer in it. Ran the car a minute or two shut it for.a min or two and checked. Same low read out. And as you all know, Lucas is a top notch product and is very thick and sticks pehenomonally through the crankcase, so you can certainly understabd my concern when after putting Lucas inand still getting no readout.
Any help is appreciated, thank you. I look forward with suspense to hear your advice or general comments.
Edited by ESOG on Sunday 23 October 06:50
Sometimes when you pull a dipstick out one side gets wiped but the other side still has oil on it, If you wipe it with a cloth that has polish on it it can stop oil sticking!!! you could try sanding the end slighty with some emery cloth which will hold oil to it, also very thin/clean oil isnt easy to see check it with a cold engine with the car in the same place each time. Maybe it is burning a little, I would just use a more basic semi syn 10/40, drain and mesasure the amount from the pan and filter, fill with the corect amount then run engine for 5 mins allow it to cool and check the dipstick note the level , check every 500miles cold engine in the same spot to get a acurate idea of oil consumption...
Edited by powerstroke on Sunday 23 October 07:55
A dipstick is a simple device, it cannot read wrong. Unless the person reading it has not pushed it in properly, or is simply reading from the wrong place.
Clean oil can often be very difficult to see though, as you've already described.
Easiest thing to do is change the oil yourself, fill to the specified amount. Run the engine a little then shut it off and check the reading.
Then you know there is enough in it and should be able to get yourself a baseline reading from the dipstick for future reference.
As I dont have a picture to hand, googling found this. Not that difficult to read really ?
Clean oil can often be very difficult to see though, as you've already described.
Easiest thing to do is change the oil yourself, fill to the specified amount. Run the engine a little then shut it off and check the reading.
Then you know there is enough in it and should be able to get yourself a baseline reading from the dipstick for future reference.
As I dont have a picture to hand, googling found this. Not that difficult to read really ?
stevieturbo said:
A dipstick is a simple device, it cannot read wrong. Unless the person reading it has not pushed it in properly, or is simply reading from the wrong place.
Clean oil can often be very difficult to see though, as you've already described.
Easiest thing to do is change the oil yourself, fill to the specified amount. Run the engine a little then shut it off and check the reading.
Then you know there is enough in it and should be able to get yourself a baseline reading from the dipstick for future reference.
As I dont have a picture to hand, googling found this. Not that difficult to read really ?
I completely understand what you are saying about it not being a difficult thing to do but regarding the picture you posted, it doesnt even look like that, the entire stick looks like the oil on the far right of the stick in your picture through out the entire dip stick. Changing the oil myself isnt a big deal and since this problem seems to be getting me angry I think I will take it upon myself to change it on my from now on so that I can observe and log the outcome. See the thing is, I am not so worried initially, because if I change the oil tomorrow but the dip stick still seems off atleast I know I just changed the oil and so the amount has to be correct. I am worried between the changes because most cars need a quart between oil changes, how in the hell would I be able to determine it?Clean oil can often be very difficult to see though, as you've already described.
Easiest thing to do is change the oil yourself, fill to the specified amount. Run the engine a little then shut it off and check the reading.
Then you know there is enough in it and should be able to get yourself a baseline reading from the dipstick for future reference.
As I dont have a picture to hand, googling found this. Not that difficult to read really ?
OK a couple of things. Firstly don't check the oil shortly after the engine has been running. Oil spray could have got thrown up inside the dipstick tube and this may be smearing onto the stick and confusing the reading. Take the dipstick out, cover the end of the tube and leave the car overnight so any oil in the tube can run back down into the sump. Wipe the dipstick completely dry with a clean cloth and then push it fully home and take the reading. The reason you take the stick out the previous day is so when you take the reading you aren't firstly smearing oil off the bottom of the stick into the tube which then smears back onto the stick when you put it back in.
If the dipstick tube is dry then the oil on the stick can only smear in the downwards direction as you withdraw the stick so the highest place you can see any oil at all should be the true level.
With very thin oils such as you are using and especially when the oil is brand new and clean it can be hard to see it properly. On older engines with thicker oil and more carbon deposits turning it black it's much easier to see. I confess I did once try to check my oil at a petrol station at night in the middle of a long trip and the combination of poor light and clean oil meant I ended up thinking the level was low when it was actually fine and putting an extra 2 litres in there! Fortunately it made not a scrap of difference to how the car ran and the oil got changed out the next day anyway.
If the problem is one of contrast between the colour of the oil and the stick then paint one side of the stick up to just above the upper level notch with Tippex or white paint. Don't leave this on there to contaminate the sump, scrape it back off again when you're done. It should at least help you work out what is really going on.
I'm pretty sure there is nothing wrong with the engine. You just aren't reading the stick properly.
If the dipstick tube is dry then the oil on the stick can only smear in the downwards direction as you withdraw the stick so the highest place you can see any oil at all should be the true level.
With very thin oils such as you are using and especially when the oil is brand new and clean it can be hard to see it properly. On older engines with thicker oil and more carbon deposits turning it black it's much easier to see. I confess I did once try to check my oil at a petrol station at night in the middle of a long trip and the combination of poor light and clean oil meant I ended up thinking the level was low when it was actually fine and putting an extra 2 litres in there! Fortunately it made not a scrap of difference to how the car ran and the oil got changed out the next day anyway.
If the problem is one of contrast between the colour of the oil and the stick then paint one side of the stick up to just above the upper level notch with Tippex or white paint. Don't leave this on there to contaminate the sump, scrape it back off again when you're done. It should at least help you work out what is really going on.
I'm pretty sure there is nothing wrong with the engine. You just aren't reading the stick properly.
Edited by Pumaracing on Sunday 23 October 17:45
Any chance of you posting a picture of the dipstick with the oil the way you describe it.
It's just very difficult to understand what you mean (even with your very detailed explanation) without assuming that you're being a dipstick yourself and not checking it when the engine is cold and the oil has settled in the sump or that you're finding it difficult to see new fresh oil.
It's just very difficult to understand what you mean (even with your very detailed explanation) without assuming that you're being a dipstick yourself and not checking it when the engine is cold and the oil has settled in the sump or that you're finding it difficult to see new fresh oil.
Edited by DanielC4GP on Sunday 23 October 17:13
ESOG said:
Also, forgot to mention, we end up adding sometimes up to 2 extra quarts of oil less than a week later thinking its running on nothing!!
From a quick Google, the capacity is 5.3 quarts and if you are reading it wrong and putting in an extra 2 quarts (US quart is just under a litre) then that's a pretty significant overfill - I'd expect that you'd be getting smoke blowing out of the exhaust etc.Why don't you talk it through with the mechanics in your garage?
You dont even need to change the oil. Just drain it and measure how much is in there. Oil filter and galleries will hold a minimal amount, less than 0.5litres
So it will give you an idea if you're miles off or not.
Cant say much about n/a cars, but certainly a lot of the more modern 2.5 turbo cars did have oil consumption issues. Some being very very bad.
Yet no visible signs of the oil being burned. Short motors were replaced under warranty, and many people fobbed off by dealers.
And from reading various forums, the VW TSi engines seem to go a similar way, using loads of oil.
But if you are patient, have good light and clean the dipstick thoroughly then dip, you should be able to get a reading without too much difficulty.
So it will give you an idea if you're miles off or not.
Cant say much about n/a cars, but certainly a lot of the more modern 2.5 turbo cars did have oil consumption issues. Some being very very bad.
Yet no visible signs of the oil being burned. Short motors were replaced under warranty, and many people fobbed off by dealers.
And from reading various forums, the VW TSi engines seem to go a similar way, using loads of oil.
But if you are patient, have good light and clean the dipstick thoroughly then dip, you should be able to get a reading without too much difficulty.
How to suck eggs:
Park on level ground
Engine off, pull dipstick.
Wipe it clean with paper towel
Reinsert
Pull dipstick and read level.
If all those things are already being done, I also dont see why the OP isnt gettign a clean 'read' of oil level. It works for everything.
Anyway, more helpful suggestions (with no knowledge of Subarus) - are all the engine breathers clear and any PCV valves working correctly (and associated hoses intact)? i.e. are you sure the engine once refilled with oil doesn't just puke a pint or so quickly and then settle down..?
Park on level ground
Engine off, pull dipstick.
Wipe it clean with paper towel
Reinsert
Pull dipstick and read level.
If all those things are already being done, I also dont see why the OP isnt gettign a clean 'read' of oil level. It works for everything.
Anyway, more helpful suggestions (with no knowledge of Subarus) - are all the engine breathers clear and any PCV valves working correctly (and associated hoses intact)? i.e. are you sure the engine once refilled with oil doesn't just puke a pint or so quickly and then settle down..?
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