A Recruitment Dilemma

[foreverlearning]

Hi Guys

I'm 21 and just graduated from Uni with a 2.1 degree.I've just got off the phone with Hydrogen Group after applying for a position as a trainee recruitment consultant. I've spoken with them twice so far and they want to see me face to face in London, great so far.

I've already had an unsuccessful face to face interview with Robert Walters so I think I have an idea of what to expect and will feel far more comfortable for this interview than I did at that one.

Anyway to the point, is there really two kinds of high end recruiters?
I'm sure the whole "back-stabbing you for an extra 2k" kind of people must exist within recruitment because, frankly, they'll most likely be successful and good at the job in terms of beating targets.

But does this or can this other "team based, friendlier" recruitment company exist? And if so who are they? I'm going into recruitment because yes, i'm money motivated, confident, target driven and want to work 12 hour days. (not to be a workaholic just because I get bored easily and I think working in a stressful job for a number of years will help me develop as a person...basically I want a challenge and to push myself while I'm still young.)

That might come off as a little egotistical (sorry if it does) but here's the thing, I am a nice guy. I want to work with a team because I love people, I want to share the ups and downs that come with such a career. When I do get a job in recruitment I'll abide by my one rule in life "it's fine to do it if no one gets hurt". Basically Ill try everything once but I refuse to do anything that hurts other people in any way.

You can obviously see the dilemma here, the recruitment companies I've been approaching stress (without using these exact words) being ruthless. My dream job would be working for a company that has an ethos of "us against everyone else in the recruitment game" and not "your all against each other" but does this company exist?

This may seem a little ranty so apologies. Any advice would be appreciated

[hornetrider]

Welcome to PH. The kind of recruitment consultant cold calling salesmen you describe are s. The question is - will you fit in? Only you can answer that.

[zaphod42]

Welcome to PH.

I don't think you will fit there, it seems you have morals. There are some good recruitment consultants, and some very good ones. But they are, in my professional experience in the minority (both as a buyer of their services, and as a recipient)

The only ones I know that meet the description you have are some of the very high end niche head hunters and some of the smaller sole trader businesses.

Sorry, but you sound too nice.

[Zad]

I'm sure they are all nice guys at home. Most are certainly go-getting ambitions target-led and other buzz word defined careers too. With regards to big recruiters, every one I have had dealings with has insisted that they are different to the rest, with my interests at heart, working tirelessly in the cause. Every one would back stab you for £200 never mind £2K. It is fundamentally a tele-sales job where you get paid to place people in a job. End of story.

Personally, I think your 2.1 would be wasted in a job like this. I'm sure it'll develop you as a person, but do you want to be developed into that sort of person? If you really want to be a good recruiter, join a small company.

[pokethepope]

foreverlearning said:

I'm going into recruitment because yes, i'm money motivated, confident, target driven and want to work 12 hour days. (not to be a workaholic just because I get bored easily and I think working in a stressful job for a number of years will help me develop as a person...basically I want a challenge and to push myself while I'm still young.)

Have you thought about other industries; finance, law?

[singlecoil]

foreverlearning said:

and not "your you're all against each other" but

Watch out for that kind of thing if you are submitting written applications.

[New POD]

Tell you what, I'll send you my CV, and you get me a Contract Role without me having to actually attend an interview at twice my current hourly rate, and I'll let you have £10 personally for every hour I work between January 2012 and December 2012. Most weeks I'll work 40 plus hours so that's £1600 to you every month once you've got me the job.
If you can do that I think you'll be okay.

[Fun Bus]

foreverlearning said:

want to work 12 hour days.

You won't be saying that for long. None of us want to work 12 hour days. In the real world, 12 hours in the office can often have a stty commute at the front and back end. I often hear people say they'd like to work away - I've been working away and living out of hotels since the middle of June and I'm not kidding when I say it isn't a life, it's more of an existance.

Anyway, I'd put your degree to better use than a recruitment consultant. I think it would be a waste. Like others have said there are good and bad. I have 3 contacts in supply-chain recruitment who I trust and respect. That's it - many, many others are wkers.

[NobleGuy]

foreverlearning said:

I'm going into recruitment because yes, i'm money motivated, confident, target driven and want to work 12 hour days.

First few bits fine, but the last bit...

[Original Poster]

You really are asking on the wrong forum for becoming a recruitment consultant.

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Just search for the thousands of topics consisting of "recruiters vs the world" on here.

My advice, it's a great industry to work in, don't upset candidates, don't upset clients, return every single call, always give feedback to candidates, never promise something to a client that you can't deliver, if you say I will have CV's over to you in 4 days, send them in 2, don't deal with arrogant candidates, don't deal with candidates that will only communicate over email and never upset your manager.

If you can do all of the above, you might turn out alight. There are a lot of tossers in this industry, please don't become one of them.

[hornetrider]

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Okayyyyy. You have a vested interest and are defending your position, which is fine.

Original Poster said:

There are a lot of tossers in this industry, please don't become one of them.

Ever think that the 'absolute bks' as you put it is not actually bks, rather, it is candidates and clients direct experience of some of those middlemen tossers?!

[singlecoil]

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

[Original Poster]

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

I'm not here to start another debate about it, I totally understand that many people on here would have had bad experiences with recruiters, there are enough bad ones to warrant that. But you can tell when someone on here has totally made up a complete load of nonsense to join in on the bashing.

[singlecoil]

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

I'm not here to start another debate about it, I totally understand that many people on here would have had bad experiences with recruiters, there are enough bad ones to warrant that. But you can tell when someone on here has totally made up a complete load of nonsense to join in on the bashing.

I've not noticed such a post, perhaps you could quote one so that I can see what you mean? In any case, why would anyone go to the trouble of fabricating something, just to join in, I must say that seems very unlikely. Still, if you could show us a post that illustrates what your position, I would be interested.

[Original Poster]

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

I'm not here to start another debate about it, I totally understand that many people on here would have had bad experiences with recruiters, there are enough bad ones to warrant that. But you can tell when someone on here has totally made up a complete load of nonsense to join in on the bashing.

I've not noticed such a post, perhaps you could quote one so that I can see what you mean? In any case, why would anyone go to the trouble of fabricating something, just to join in, I must say that seems very unlikely. Still, if you could show us a post that illustrates what your position, I would be interested.

I'm not going to trawl through posts to find one.

Do you honestly believe that people don't lie on here in order to either fit in, make people laugh, be able to contribute to posts etc. If you read the lounge and believe everything that everyone writes in there you are incredibly naive.

[foreverlearning]

Wow, good forum. Thanks for the responses guys, I've found them really helpful.
I was going to try and reply to each response individually but I was expecting so many replies. I'd be here all day :P

The reason why I put the working 12 hours part is because there's maybe 20-30 of my friends who are currently doing these kinds of hours, some of them more. While I am sure their putting their bodies through hell, they are some of the happiest people I know. I think the thing I was confusing here was passion with ambition. All of these friends work in creative areas, such as directing and film making and they are loving what they do.

I think it was naivety on my part to think that people who are working these crazy hours haven't got time to be bored (and actually typing it out, it sounds even more stupid) but you live and learn

I'm still going to the interview ans carry on the application process, just for the experience since I might be able to learn something from it and if nothing else its another excuse to go see London

But I can believe that someone can be too nice for recruitment (thanks to those who said I was too nice ) so I think i'll start looking elsewhere career wise.

[singlecoil]

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

I'm not here to start another debate about it, I totally understand that many people on here would have had bad experiences with recruiters, there are enough bad ones to warrant that. But you can tell when someone on here has totally made up a complete load of nonsense to join in on the bashing.

I've not noticed such a post, perhaps you could quote one so that I can see what you mean? In any case, why would anyone go to the trouble of fabricating something, just to join in, I must say that seems very unlikely. Still, if you could show us a post that illustrates what your position, I would be interested.

I'm not going to trawl through posts to find one.

That's a shame, I got the impression from you earlier that there were plenty such posts on this forum. Being unable or unwilling to back up what you said earlier does make your position seem rather weak, if you don't mind me saying so.

Original Poster said:

Do you honestly believe that people don't lie on here in order to either fit in, make people laugh, be able to contribute to posts etc. If you read the lounge and believe everything that everyone writes in there you are incredibly naive.

I don't visit the Lounge very often, and if I did I don't expect that I would believe every word, but that's quite different to what you have been alleging on this thread.

[Original Poster]

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

singlecoil said:

Original Poster said:

I own an agency and the amount of absolute bks that gets spouted on here from people that think they know my industry is laughable.

Some of it must be based on experience, though. And if you don't tell us which posts you think are bks then you're not being very helpful.

I'm not here to start another debate about it, I totally understand that many people on here would have had bad experiences with recruiters, there are enough bad ones to warrant that. But you can tell when someone on here has totally made up a complete load of nonsense to join in on the bashing.

I've not noticed such a post, perhaps you could quote one so that I can see what you mean? In any case, why would anyone go to the trouble of fabricating something, just to join in, I must say that seems very unlikely. Still, if you could show us a post that illustrates what your position, I would be interested.

I'm not going to trawl through posts to find one.

That's a shame, I got the impression from you earlier that there were plenty such posts on this forum. Being unable or unwilling to back up what you said earlier does make your position seem rather weak, if you don't mind me saying so.

Original Poster said:

Do you honestly believe that people don't lie on here in order to either fit in, make people laugh, be able to contribute to posts etc. If you read the lounge and believe everything that everyone writes in there you are incredibly naive.

I don't visit the Lounge very often, and if I did I don't expect that I would believe every word, but that's quite different to what you have been alleging on this thread.

Sorry but how on earth is it different? I said that people on here spout a load of bks that often isn't true, they make up stories about conversations they have had with recruiters that so obviously aren't true and anyone with any real understanding of how recruitment works (or anyone with common sense for that matter) would appreciate that it's totally fictional.

If you don't read the lounge much that would explain a lot, a perfect example of where lies would be rife is a topic about "What's the most embarrassing thing you've ever had happen to you". You can guarantee about 10%+ are totally made up stories to provide humour/man points or to move up on the PH popularity scale that seems to silently exist.

[singlecoil]

Original Poster said:

Sorry but how on earth is it different? I said that people on here spout a load of bks that often isn't true, they make up stories about conversations they have had with recruiters that so obviously aren't true and anyone with any real understanding of how recruitment works (or anyone with common sense for that matter) would appreciate that it's totally fictional.

If you don't read the lounge much that would explain a lot, a perfect example of where lies would be rife is a topic about "What's the most embarrassing thing you've ever had happen to you". You can guarantee about 10%+ are totally made up stories to provide humour/man points or to move up on the PH popularity scale that seems to silently exist.

It's not looking as if we are going to get anywhere with this. For myself, I will continue to take what is posted on this forum, about the topic of recruitment consultants and agencies, at face value unless there are indications to the contrary.

I've had enough experiences of these matters myself to know that the vast majority of them probably are true. However, if you do spot anything in the future which is obviously 'bks' then do please draw my attention to it.

[smokey145]

OP welcome to pistonheads.

I did almost exactly the same as you, finished my education and went into recruitment at 20 years of age. It was very eye opening, I earned an obscene amount of money for my age over the 2 years I did it. I too am all of the things you mention you are, target driven, money motivated, a hard worker. It's such a harsh environment it really does develop you as a person, and can set out your work ethic in your career from the very outset. It really isn't a long term option in my opinion.
Some advice, go into it with your eyes open for real long term opportunities. I went into construction recruitment (perm placements) . Got to know the industry so well I ended up going into construction as my career (I am now a quantity surveyor). Also don't get too use to the money, don't get "trapped" in the cycle as many of my ex colleagues have. They are now have financial commitments they have to maintain, they can only do this by staying in the job they are in no matter of the fact they are unhappy. They cannot afford to take a backwards step to re-train.

Good luck, it is very rewarding, enjoyable and lucrative. Will really help to develop you, I still use alot of the skills I picked up as a recruiter in my role now (negotiations, communication, management) ect. Good luck.