Lets not get carried away, Mansell did better....

[Rs2oo]

As much as I applaud the results Vettel has achieved with "equalling" Nigel Mansells pole positions in one season, let's not forget that Mansell raced in only 16 races in the 1992 season as opposed to 20 this year for Vettel. I'm sure with the best car and 300 races next year, even Mark Webber could equal or even beat the record. Well done Red Bull and Vettle but with 4 extra races in which to do it, not that impressive.

[schmalex]

But on the other hand, Mansell's car was absolutely untouchable that season. Yes, the RB's are quick, but only 3 or 4/10 quicker on the qualy lap. The car Mansell drove had a significantly greater advantage IIRC.

All in all, I would call it a draw.

[zaphod42]

All fair points. I think Vettels strike rate of poles is pretty impressive - more comparable to senna, at least in stats...

Edit to add: (poles/races)
Senna 65/162
Vettels 29/80
Mansell 32/190
Prost 33/202 (funny I always had in my mind that Prost had more)

Edited by zaphod42 on Wednesday 23 November 10:10

[Ultuous]

schmalex said:

But on the other hand, Mansell's car was absolutely untouchable that season. Yes, the RB's are quick, but only 3 or 4/10 quicker on the qualy lap. The car Mansell drove had a significantly greater advantage IIRC.

All in all, I would call it a draw.

Spot on!

[rdjohn]

The simplest comparison is to say that they both drove perfect cars, perfectly.

I am not a fan of comparing drivers from different eras. In a personal performance sport such as tennis, it is pointless comparing Perry, Borg and Federer; trying to do the same, and allow for differing car performance amongst competitors, is puerile, but TV commentators are obliged to fill the time somehow.

[CampDavid]

Ultuous said:

schmalex said:

But on the other hand, Mansell's car was absolutely untouchable that season. Yes, the RB's are quick, but only 3 or 4/10 quicker on the qualy lap. The car Mansell drove had a significantly greater advantage IIRC.

All in all, I would call it a draw.

Spot on!

Indeed. Mansells car was unbelievable that year, featuring active suspension amoung other things, it was a second or more a lap faster and the only real competition for poles was from James Hunt's best mate, Recardo Patrese.

The fast that Vettel has managed this in a car which isn't as dominant as Mansells or even some of the Schumacher Ferraris is pretty amazing. In a one lap shoot out he is the man I'd put my money on to deliver, even over Alonso and Lewis

[andyb66]

(poles/races)
Senna 65/162 ... 40%
Vettels 29/80 ... 36%
Mansell 32/190 ... 17%
Prost 33/202 ... 16%

Gives a better perspective IMHO

[Johnboy Mac]

andyb66 said:

(poles/races)

Vettels 29/80 ... 36%
Mansell 32/190 ... 17%

If poles are really that important, the above says it all, Vettel is twice as impressive and still got many, many years left in F1.

[E30M3SE]

Rs2oo said:

As much as I applaud the results Vettel has achieved with "equalling" Nigel Mansells pole positions in one season, let's not forget that Mansell raced in only 16 races in the 1992 season as opposed to 20 19 this year for Vettel. I'm sure with the best car and 300 races next year, even Mark Webber could equal or even beat the record. Well done Red Bull and Vettle but with 4 extra races in which to do it, not that impressive.

Corrected that for you, Bahrain didn't happen.

[Fire99]

Since the cars, tracks, risks were far different in Mansell's day compared to now, personally I find these statistics pretty meaningless.

[Ultuous]

Very true - there seems to be an obsession with comparing stats like a game of Top Trumps on here at the moment... Even some of this year's rule changes seem to have suited some more than others to a certain extent - comparing between completely different eras is ultimately rather pointless!

[Streps]

Personally i do not compare drivers and cars from different eras.
Too many variables to know ...so i don't bother.

Watching drivers like Prost...Vettel and Schumacher in the race of champions battling together
in equal machinery is fascinating though.

[Rs2oo]

Agreed, I'm sick of them banging on about Vettel equalling/beating records. It's all meaningless due to in this case the amount of races he's done it in compared to Mansell who did a fantastic job as has Vettel. We must not forget Mansell also had a team mate in an identical car
As a patriotic Brit however, I don't want a German to get the spoils !

[Johnboy Mac]

Rs2oo said:

As a patriotic Brit however, I don't want a German to get the spoils !

What about the three hundred or so staff in MK?

[Rs2oo]

Johnboy Mac said:

What about the three hundred or so staff in MK?

It won't affect them They already have their £££ bonus and John Smith the fabricator will never be mentioned in the record books. This is why these so called records are misleading and pointless decades apart.

[marcosgt]

Streps said:

Personally i do not compare drivers and cars from different eras.
Too many variables to know ...so i don't bother.

Watching drivers like Prost...Vettel and Schumacher in the race of champions battling together in equal machinery is fascinating though.

To a degree - It's hard to compare Prost (doing a few ice races a year and at what, 60?) with Vettel in any meaningful way.

The RoC tends to throw up some odd results too - The guy who won last year was a real outsider.

M.

[thanetspeedshop]

Also qualifying was a very different beast back in the (G)-olden days of Mansell and Senna; bolt on some one-lap qualifying tyres, turn up the boost (1200hp) and find some space on a track full of another 25 cars...

[paulmurr]

thanetspeedshop said:

Also qualifying was a very different beast back in the (G)-olden days of Mansell and Senna; bolt on some one-lap qualifying tyres, turn up the boost (1200hp) and find some space on a track full of another 25 cars...

In Mansell's glory days turbos had been banned for about 5 years.

[thanetspeedshop]

paulmurr said:

In Mansell's glory days turbos had been banned for about 5 years.

Hmmn... 1st pole position '84 Lotus Renault Turbo, '85-'87 12 poles Williams Honda Turbo...

[thiscocks]

paulmurr said:

In Mansell's glory days turbos had been banned for about 5 years.

Although you could say he had glory days earlier at williams in the 80's also