New McLaren MP4
Discussion
Great BBC documentary recently on the McLaren MP4. A thing of wonder, and proof that Britain can compete with the world’s best.
But I think they have made a terrible mistake in pricing the car. Excluding the trackday/lightweight stuff, there is a rough ratio of performance per £ among premium brands, that follows a steady path (with diminishing returns) until you get to around £70-80k. The problem is that when you get to that stage – R8 and 911 territory – you already have more performance, and dynamic ability, than you could ever need on the road.
To sell a car for more than that, above all it needs the sheer ‘want me‘ factor. It may sound ridiculous, but I feel McLaren have majored too much on the dynamic abilities of the car, and its exotic construction. Likely punters are not only going to be enthusiasts, they will also be fairly ordinary drivers with a bit of cash, who don’t care too much about a carbon tub, or trick suspension.
For those people, in order to spend that much money on a car, it needs emotional appeal, to transcend the scope of its abilities – to be art. Or flash. Or both.
And unfortunately I don’t think they’ve achieved that with the MP4. A fine looking car, plenty of ability – just twice as expensive as it should be.
I dearly hope it does well. But at the expense of a small drop in performance, and more conventional construction, it could have sold in more numbers for half the price.
But I think they have made a terrible mistake in pricing the car. Excluding the trackday/lightweight stuff, there is a rough ratio of performance per £ among premium brands, that follows a steady path (with diminishing returns) until you get to around £70-80k. The problem is that when you get to that stage – R8 and 911 territory – you already have more performance, and dynamic ability, than you could ever need on the road.
To sell a car for more than that, above all it needs the sheer ‘want me‘ factor. It may sound ridiculous, but I feel McLaren have majored too much on the dynamic abilities of the car, and its exotic construction. Likely punters are not only going to be enthusiasts, they will also be fairly ordinary drivers with a bit of cash, who don’t care too much about a carbon tub, or trick suspension.
For those people, in order to spend that much money on a car, it needs emotional appeal, to transcend the scope of its abilities – to be art. Or flash. Or both.
And unfortunately I don’t think they’ve achieved that with the MP4. A fine looking car, plenty of ability – just twice as expensive as it should be.
I dearly hope it does well. But at the expense of a small drop in performance, and more conventional construction, it could have sold in more numbers for half the price.
So you're saying instead of aiming to provide the most advanced, capable car in the segment, they should have done something average and priced it accordingly.
I agree. In fact, they should brand it a bit better, too. Instead of 'McLaren', they could call it "British Leyland" and instead of that expensive and technical sounding 'MP4-12', they could call it 'Dolomite'.
I agree. In fact, they should brand it a bit better, too. Instead of 'McLaren', they could call it "British Leyland" and instead of that expensive and technical sounding 'MP4-12', they could call it 'Dolomite'.
JD2329 said:
Great BBC documentary recently on the McLaren MP4. A thing of wonder, and proof that Britain can compete with the world’s best.
But I think they have made a terrible mistake in pricing the car. Excluding the trackday/lightweight stuff, there is a rough ratio of performance per £ among premium brands, that follows a steady path (with diminishing returns) until you get to around £70-80k. The problem is that when you get to that stage – R8 and 911 territory – you already have more performance, and dynamic ability, than you could ever need on the road.
To sell a car for more than that, above all it needs the sheer ‘want me‘ factor. It may sound ridiculous, but I feel McLaren have majored too much on the dynamic abilities of the car, and its exotic construction. Likely punters are not only going to be enthusiasts, they will also be fairly ordinary drivers with a bit of cash, who don’t care too much about a carbon tub, or trick suspension.
For those people, in order to spend that much money on a car, it needs emotional appeal, to transcend the scope of its abilities – to be art. Or flash. Or both.
And unfortunately I don’t think they’ve achieved that with the MP4. A fine looking car, plenty of ability – just twice as expensive as it should be.
I dearly hope it does well. But at the expense of a small drop in performance, and more conventional construction, it could have sold in more numbers for half the price.
You are aware that there are a number of owners on here that already have their cars and there is a rather long thread about their thoughts?But I think they have made a terrible mistake in pricing the car. Excluding the trackday/lightweight stuff, there is a rough ratio of performance per £ among premium brands, that follows a steady path (with diminishing returns) until you get to around £70-80k. The problem is that when you get to that stage – R8 and 911 territory – you already have more performance, and dynamic ability, than you could ever need on the road.
To sell a car for more than that, above all it needs the sheer ‘want me‘ factor. It may sound ridiculous, but I feel McLaren have majored too much on the dynamic abilities of the car, and its exotic construction. Likely punters are not only going to be enthusiasts, they will also be fairly ordinary drivers with a bit of cash, who don’t care too much about a carbon tub, or trick suspension.
For those people, in order to spend that much money on a car, it needs emotional appeal, to transcend the scope of its abilities – to be art. Or flash. Or both.
And unfortunately I don’t think they’ve achieved that with the MP4. A fine looking car, plenty of ability – just twice as expensive as it should be.
I dearly hope it does well. But at the expense of a small drop in performance, and more conventional construction, it could have sold in more numbers for half the price.
If you're able to afford these cars you can probably afford more than one or already have something else is how I see it. I'd just like to have that problem.
HowMuchLonger said:
You do realize that this is the "middle priced model". There will be a super car and a 911 equivalent to come.
I know it's the oft trotted out line. But personally, I can see them making something more expensive. In the £350K does 230mph+ range. But really can't see them doing anything for £80-100K. Well . . . . what was the show called? Was this the "How to build a xxxx (Supercar) " series?
If so I thought it was a little odd training a young girl to assemble the car/brakes? I'm sure she's entirely capable but seems like there would be a handful of more qualified enthusiasts who would do the the same job at the same wage. Or maybe she seemed a bit inexperienced to me? Then again I'm not an expert on the labor market for manufacturing. I would think the people who built the Mclaren F1 were somewhat more experienced long term Mclaren employees.
The MP4-12C is a game changer. It will be interesting to see how it's value holds up on the secondary market.
If so I thought it was a little odd training a young girl to assemble the car/brakes? I'm sure she's entirely capable but seems like there would be a handful of more qualified enthusiasts who would do the the same job at the same wage. Or maybe she seemed a bit inexperienced to me? Then again I'm not an expert on the labor market for manufacturing. I would think the people who built the Mclaren F1 were somewhat more experienced long term Mclaren employees.
The MP4-12C is a game changer. It will be interesting to see how it's value holds up on the secondary market.
PiB said:
... but seems like there would be a handful of more qualified enthusiasts who would do the the same job at the same wage. Or maybe she seemed a bit inexperienced to me? Then again I'm not an expert on the labor market for manufacturing...
Firstly. At some point someone has to be taught to do something. So I think it's good they are training up the workforce. It's far more QC'd than your average garage/dealer. So the potential for f
k ups are greatly reduced.Secondly. I doubt it very much regarding pay. She'll be on minimum wage or thereabouts, maybe even less if she's officially an apprentice. (rules say no applicable if training) You'd get more working as a Technician in a Main Dealer. It's that old adage. We have a million people that would take your job. The majority of their new staff will be on less than £20K a year. (I'd guess at under £15K even!) It is fundamentally an assembly role after all. Fit A to B to C. There's no diagnostics required for example. Just like the guys building Range Rovers or Nissans around the country. Albeit in a far funkier building.
Edited by Rich_W on Monday 19th December 21:42
My problem is not with the workforce, or the car itself...far from it. We really need an independent British manufacturer to sell in volume. The car clearly is in many ways brilliant, I just feel that McLaren could be bolder(and hopefully will be) for future designs. The E type was not just a technical tour de force, it oozed appeal from every quarter. The McLaren needs that quality, it comes from confidence and passion. It is there, Britain needs to show that confidence through asthetic design, not just technical acomplishment.
I understand what you mean OP. Oddly an acquaintance showed me his just yesterday and I was excited about seeing it but as an item to lust after it left me feeling disappointingly flat. A very capable instrument but not a fire breathing monster that made my senses tingle.
I'd love to drive one in anger to reassess that view but I agree it's unlikely to become the poster car of young lads when fighting for wall space with its far more exotic and exciting looking peers.
I'd love to drive one in anger to reassess that view but I agree it's unlikely to become the poster car of young lads when fighting for wall space with its far more exotic and exciting looking peers.
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