Cayman S results of rolling road day
Discussion
Just for the records, I have just had my 2007 Cayman S on the Surrey rolling road and it produced a nice 319 bhp with 273 ftlbs of torque. The car has a Milltek cat back exhaust and has been mapped to optimize the modification. I had these modifications done about 6 months ago and the car really did feel 'uncorked' beyond 5K rpm but to see the figures just confirmed this. It's now up with the Gen2 cars so really pleased, sounds great as well.
Has anybody else done these or similar modifications and tested them?
Has anybody else done these or similar modifications and tested them?
Edited by Atom Ant on Friday 30th December 09:47
Thanks guys, the map and exhaust were done by AMD and the car runs so well with these mods. I would like to go further as you say a GT3 throttle body and adjusted map just to see where you can take this. I have however placed a deposit on a 996 GT3 Club Sport and I'm looking for a Cayman buyer that would appreciate the power increase. The GT3 has always been a car i wanted to own so pushing the boat out as a new year resolution.
Atom Ant said:
Thanks guys, the map and exhaust were done by AMD and the car runs so well with these mods. I would like to go further as you say a GT3 throttle body and adjusted map just to see where you can take this. I have however placed a deposit on a 996 GT3 Club Sport and I'm looking for a Cayman buyer that would appreciate the power increase. The GT3 has always been a car i wanted to own so pushing the boat out as a new year resolution.
Hi mate, if you don't mind me asking what was the cost of the map and exhaust, got me very interested 
Gibbo205 said:
Get GT3 throttlebody on the car and the map updated as the throttlebody gives the best gains. You might see another 20BHP or so from it.
Hi Gibbo, so could the throttle body mod be done without the exhaust or is best being done in conjunction with each other, do you know what the approximate results would be on its own and cost?Gibbo205 said:
Get GT3 throttlebody on the car and the map updated as the throttlebody gives the best gains. You might see another 20BHP or so from it.
Wow! that would take it beyond the Cayman R, it's just amazing how Porsche have restricted these cars. There are some that say the European R maps are much more agressive than those that we get in the UK.Any idea of the approx cost of the GT3 throttle body modifications?
Not my own work , copied from Planet 9 , a reply by Berty987 .............
Interesting reading.
Unfortunately the tuning process is one of diminishing returns, the more you do , the less you get and the cost goes up as well. Having researched the M96 and M97 engine derivatives and made comparisons with other engines in the porsche range and their specific output, its immediateley apparent that the cayman engine is stifled. The cylinder bore on the M97 gen 1 cayman is the same as the larger 3.6 and 3.8 engines albeit with a shorter stroke. The valves in the head are more than capable of flowing higher volumes by virtue of diameter and the addition of variocam plus. The inlet tract on a cayman uses a 76mm throttle body but also has a split intake design with modulating baffle plate. The purpose of this plate is to improve low end torque below 3000 rpm , but it also acts as a baffle when in the open position at higher rpms. Any hi flow plenum that removes this baffle will suffer some torque and power loss at lower revs. The benefit is however seen at medium to high revs as the baffle plate which sits across the intake is removed , allowing a better flow into the engine.
The exhaust manifolds (headers) on the gen 1 cayman are a very poor design and far from optimised , not only is the unequal branch design poor , but the bore size is also restrictive (the 3.2S boxster 987 has a performance manifold which is equal branch and larger bore). Added to this, the primary catalysts are a small diameter and 400 cell , making them very restrictive. The secondary catalysts (also 400 cell) are a larger diameter so less of a restriction.
The design of the exhuast manifold (header) will have a major impact on the torque curve of the engine , so its important to choose a design that meets your requirements. Short primaries are good for high Rpm and throttle response whereas longer primaries give a flatter and lower rpm torque peak.
The larger throttle body and matched plenum (GT3 or IPD) will give a more gutsy feel to the engine from mid range to peak power , this will Feel bigger than it actually is as you have a bigger differential in power and torque at mid range as a result of losing the modulating baffle at lower rpm (which loses power and torque).
The manifold with 200 cell cats or de cat will make the engine sound louder and deeper and rev easier to peak power. The drop off at peak power is also less as the engine can still exit gasses effectively at higher rpms.
The 911 engines use a different cylinder head to the 986/987 cayman and boxster , though in many cases share the same cam shafts and valves. Typically the 911 engines also rev higher , suggesting that the heads are better gas flowed , so can cope with higher inlet and exhaust volumes , even though the valve lift and seat areas are the same as the cayman/ boxster.
Putting this all together means that fitting a bigger throttle body and reducing the restriction in the exhaust manifold will give a power and torque gain from the mid range to peak power (id suggest 15-20 hp for both mods is reasonable if the ECU is also modified). Personally i hold little weight to the de snork or baffle plate mod giving any performance gain other than increasing intake noise , so wouldn't waste time or money on any mods here.
My preference would be to go the manifold and sport cats route as the gains are all positive whereas the IPD plenum and TB will give some negative impact at lower rpm.
It would be encouraging is there was a motorsport developer interested in making a split intake performance plenum. Ideally all that is required is an upsizing of the existing dimensions to allow an 82mm TB to be fitted and re orientation of the dividing baffle (to the same as it was on the 3.2 987 ) so it doesn't effect air flow when open. The internal profiling of the IPD plenum gives marginal gains ,the main benefit comes from the bigger throttle body itself.
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-modificatio...
Interesting reading.
Unfortunately the tuning process is one of diminishing returns, the more you do , the less you get and the cost goes up as well. Having researched the M96 and M97 engine derivatives and made comparisons with other engines in the porsche range and their specific output, its immediateley apparent that the cayman engine is stifled. The cylinder bore on the M97 gen 1 cayman is the same as the larger 3.6 and 3.8 engines albeit with a shorter stroke. The valves in the head are more than capable of flowing higher volumes by virtue of diameter and the addition of variocam plus. The inlet tract on a cayman uses a 76mm throttle body but also has a split intake design with modulating baffle plate. The purpose of this plate is to improve low end torque below 3000 rpm , but it also acts as a baffle when in the open position at higher rpms. Any hi flow plenum that removes this baffle will suffer some torque and power loss at lower revs. The benefit is however seen at medium to high revs as the baffle plate which sits across the intake is removed , allowing a better flow into the engine.
The exhaust manifolds (headers) on the gen 1 cayman are a very poor design and far from optimised , not only is the unequal branch design poor , but the bore size is also restrictive (the 3.2S boxster 987 has a performance manifold which is equal branch and larger bore). Added to this, the primary catalysts are a small diameter and 400 cell , making them very restrictive. The secondary catalysts (also 400 cell) are a larger diameter so less of a restriction.
The design of the exhuast manifold (header) will have a major impact on the torque curve of the engine , so its important to choose a design that meets your requirements. Short primaries are good for high Rpm and throttle response whereas longer primaries give a flatter and lower rpm torque peak.
The larger throttle body and matched plenum (GT3 or IPD) will give a more gutsy feel to the engine from mid range to peak power , this will Feel bigger than it actually is as you have a bigger differential in power and torque at mid range as a result of losing the modulating baffle at lower rpm (which loses power and torque).
The manifold with 200 cell cats or de cat will make the engine sound louder and deeper and rev easier to peak power. The drop off at peak power is also less as the engine can still exit gasses effectively at higher rpms.
The 911 engines use a different cylinder head to the 986/987 cayman and boxster , though in many cases share the same cam shafts and valves. Typically the 911 engines also rev higher , suggesting that the heads are better gas flowed , so can cope with higher inlet and exhaust volumes , even though the valve lift and seat areas are the same as the cayman/ boxster.
Putting this all together means that fitting a bigger throttle body and reducing the restriction in the exhaust manifold will give a power and torque gain from the mid range to peak power (id suggest 15-20 hp for both mods is reasonable if the ECU is also modified). Personally i hold little weight to the de snork or baffle plate mod giving any performance gain other than increasing intake noise , so wouldn't waste time or money on any mods here.
My preference would be to go the manifold and sport cats route as the gains are all positive whereas the IPD plenum and TB will give some negative impact at lower rpm.
It would be encouraging is there was a motorsport developer interested in making a split intake performance plenum. Ideally all that is required is an upsizing of the existing dimensions to allow an 82mm TB to be fitted and re orientation of the dividing baffle (to the same as it was on the 3.2 987 ) so it doesn't effect air flow when open. The internal profiling of the IPD plenum gives marginal gains ,the main benefit comes from the bigger throttle body itself.
http://www.planet-9.com/cayman-boxster-modificatio...
my old Cayman Gen 1, standard and with GT3 mods back to back on a 3rd party dyno as I did the mods myself :-).
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
mrdemon said:
my old Cayman Gen 1, standard and with GT3 mods back to back on a 3rd party dyno as I did the mods myself :-).
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
All of a sudden you have 911 beating performance.Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
The Gen1 Cayman S tunes well, good gains to be had.
Think some guys on Planet 9 who have pretty much done everything are in the region of 355-365BHP aint they?
[quote=mrdemon]my old Cayman Gen 1, standard and with GT3 mods back to back on a 3rd party dyno as I did the mods myself :-).
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
Wow that's a good increase in the bhp and torque, I agree with the removal of the rear cats being essential in the first instance. Sounds like either the Remis or Milltek cat back systems work well and sound magic too. The other mods you have made add that little bit extra on top, bet it goes well.
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
Wow that's a good increase in the bhp and torque, I agree with the removal of the rear cats being essential in the first instance. Sounds like either the Remis or Milltek cat back systems work well and sound magic too. The other mods you have made add that little bit extra on top, bet it goes well.
mrdemon said:
my old Cayman Gen 1, standard and with GT3 mods back to back on a 3rd party dyno as I did the mods myself :-).
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
Hi mrdemon, can I ask exactly what mods you carried out and the rough cost to reach the 341bhp?Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
Also is there any problems with the emissions ie: MOT, when the 2 cats have been removed?
mrdemon said:
my old Cayman Gen 1, standard and with GT3 mods back to back on a 3rd party dyno as I did the mods myself :-).
Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
What was a Cayman like with 341BHP?Exhaust is the best mod you can do as it deletes the 2 rear cats, smoothing out the throttle and giving quite a large power increase. NO point doing other mods untill you have taken the 2 rear cats off.
JR
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