Opinion on value - Am I way out?

[dr_gn]

Went to look at this car last week:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/140716084438?ssPageName=...

See thread of gearbox fault here:

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

It's described as pretty much spot on, but there is the above fairly blatant gearbox fault which became apparent within 2 minutes of driving it, plus the 'unmarked' interior has a scratched Carbon trim on the driver's door, and it's been a smokers car so smells of smoke/air freshener.

He wanted £3950. Now, after pointing out the gearbox fault, he wants £3500. I've offered £3000 max. which would be conditional on not finding anything else when I see it on a ramp. I know I'd have to take the 'box out to fix the gear shift fault.

I'm now thinking it's not even worth £3k judging by the almost zero completed listings of these things on EBay.

Out of interest, what do people think is a fair price for this car??

Thanks in advance.

[Nigel Worc's]

It's worth whatever you think it is worth, at least you know there is a gearbox issue.

My mate has the gearbox in his 735i repaired by an outfit in Moseley, Birmingham, two or three years ago now, it was completely fooked, and cost just over a grand, and it has been lovely since, although I don't know how much more complicated that more modern box will be.

http://www.drivertransmissions.co.uk/index.html if you want to get a quote for an idea.

My concern wouldn't be with that car in particular, it'd be why are you looking at a gearbox problem on such a top end car, at such a low mileage ?

[kchika]

I have an exact same car in Black Sapphire with black leather and xenons, heated seats and H/K. I paid a lot more than that about 6 months ago with FBMWSH all from the supplying dealer.

Apart from the gearbox issue you mentioned, there are a couple of things that makes this car undesirable:
1) Exterior colour
2) No leather
3) Only 2 keys, I have 4 (2 remote, 1 service, 1 valet)
4) Don't know about you, but I'd rather not have the car debadged

However, it is on very low miles. Also, for 330i saloons, manual cars are rarer than autos. You haven't mentioned the service history on it either. What's it like?

Whether there are any completed listings on eBay is irrelevant, because there are always people who use AutoTrader and PH Classifieds. Just picking a few, they're all around the £4,500 mark:

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3573009.htm

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3662463.htm

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3652353.htm

At the end of the day though, it's only going to worth the amount that you're willing to pay.

[dr_gn]

Nigel Worc's said:

It's worth whatever you think it is worth, at least you know there is a gearbox issue.

My mate has the gearbox in his 735i repaired by an outfit in Moseley, Birmingham, two or three years ago now, it was completely fooked, and cost just over a grand, and it has been lovely since, although I don't know how much more complicated that more modern box will be.

http://www.drivertransmissions.co.uk/index.html if you want to get a quote for an idea.

My concern wouldn't be with that car in particular, it'd be why are you looking at a gearbox problem on such a top end car, at such a low mileage ?

Thanks,

It's no problem to do it myself at little cost apart from time and hassle.

It is also apparently a common problem. Maybe it's an age thing rather than mileage? I can imagine a plunger getting stuck in a bore if the oil is old or if it's not been used much as opposed to it being worn out.

Will be interesting to see what it goes for (if it goes at all).

[dr_gn]

kchika said:

I have an exact same car in Black Sapphire with black leather and xenons, heated seats and H/K. I paid a lot more than that about 6 months ago with FBMWSH all from the supplying dealer.

Apart from the gearbox issue you mentioned, there are a couple of things that makes this car undesirable:
1) Exterior colour
2) No leather
3) Only 2 keys, I have 4 (2 remote, 1 service, 1 valet)
4) Don't know about you, but I'd rather not have the car debadged

However, it is on very low miles. Also, for 330i saloons, manual cars are rarer than autos. You haven't mentioned the service history on it either. What's it like?

Whether there are any completed listings on eBay is irrelevant, because there are always people who use AutoTrader and PH Classifieds. Just picking a few, they're all around the £4,500 mark:

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3573009.htm

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3662463.htm

http://pistonheads.com/sales/3652353.htm

At the end of the day though, it's only going to worth the amount that you're willing to pay.

Thank you.

It's only a partial BMW history.

I don't want leather, but that's irrelevant becasue I know most people do. The car is as close to my ideal spec as I've seen (I'd prefer blue, but red's not a disaster for me), but it's not perfect by any means (interior trim, wheels), and it's a buyer's market. I've got time on my side to choose a car, and obviously I don't want a dog. Nor do I want ripping off.

FYI the previous owner paid over £5k for it in end December 2011 (yes, just over 2 months ago). It was part exed for a newer BMW. I havent been able to contact the previous owner, and when I 'phoned the garage who he bought it from to ask for info, they just put the 'phone down, which was a bit...odd I thought.

Not bothered about the debadging TBH. Fair enough, others might.

Cheers


ETA The cars you listed from PH classifieds are asking price. Without exception, I know from talking to three sellers who'd already sold their cars bythe time I called, that asking price and what they got are two totally different figures for these cars. In one case it was more than £1000 less: £3500 asking, £2400 actual IIRC for a low miles 2000 330 SE.

Edited by dr_gn on Sunday 4th March 12:21

[Nigel Worc's]

dr_gn said:

Thanks,

It's no problem to do it myself at little cost apart from time and hassle.

Right ....saving you as a friend then for when mine goes tits up lol.

I actually quite like the colour (although I'm not a 3 series fan), leather or not doesn't worry me in the slightest, neither does it being smoked in, because if it hasn't, I'll be smoking in it anyway !

I dislike that carbon or brushed aliminium stuff, I prefer wood plastic lol, but I'm just old.

A lot of car for that money ...... as BMW's always are.

[dr_gn]

Nigel Worc's said:

dr_gn said:

Thanks,

It's no problem to do it myself at little cost apart from time and hassle.

Right ....saving you as a friend then for when mine goes tits up lol.

I actually quite like the colour (although I'm not a 3 series fan), leather or not doesn't worry me in the slightest, neither does it being smoked in, because if it hasn't, I'll be smoking in it anyway !

I dislike that carbon or brushed aliminium stuff, I prefer wood plastic lol, but I'm just old.

A lot of car for that money ...... as BMW's always are.

I know, the thing that's stopping me are the EBay completed listings of 330i's at £1700, £1800, £2400 etc. in apparently similar or better condition...

[OldSkoolRS]

In a similar vein I was looking at various Z3s last weekend and the difference in condition was surprising and not always tallying with the asking price. Even some that were higher priced turned out to be poor, so price isn't always a good indication of condition, nor were some seller's descriptions very accurate. I know there may now be other cheaper ones for sale than the one I ended up buying (so I'm not looking at any adverts now ) but without going to look at them they could be in worse condition and the cheaper price may not be saving by the time they'd had various issues sorting, like some I did look at. I'd guess that some of those cheaper Ebay sales you mention might also not be the bargains they may initially appear, so I wouldn't get too hung up on those.

[dr_gn]

OldSkoolRS said:

I'd guess that some of those cheaper Ebay sales you mention might also not be the bargains they may initially appear, so I wouldn't get too hung up on those.

I know...ah well.

I might wait and see if it sells this time around and if not make another offer.

On the other hand I'd rather not buy a car knowing it's a gearbox out job straight away (or at least until I could put up with it no longer). I wonder how many potential buyers would dismiss it straight away based on the awkward gearshift?

[stevesuk]

Nigel Worc's said:

It's worth whatever you think it is worth, at least you know there is a gearbox issue

I thought my 330Ci had a gearbox problem, symptoms are similar to what the OP posted in the other thread. I find its only very noticeable when the car is cold (and takes a little longer to go away when its very cold outside). Test drove on a mild day and after the dealer had popped it up the road to "put some fuel in it", so didn't really notice.

My local indie (ex BMW techs) had a look over the car last week and couldn't find any faults. So I think its more an annoyance than a proper transmission fault.

From what I read online, there are a couple of cheap parts that wear over time and could do with replacing (maybe some rubber bushes, and/or a piston?). Unfortunately, it requires good access to the gearbox to replace these parts (perhaps a gearbox out job). Was thinking with mine that I'd probably wait until the clutch needs replacing and look at getting it done then. In the meantime, its just a minor annoyance I've already got used to. The rest of the car is so good I don't really mind, and I tend to spend most of my miles in 5th gear on the motorway anyway :-)

[DivideBYZero]

Forget the gearbox problem. Even if you fix it the car will always smell like a bin, due to the smoking. I'd rather be missing two cogs than have to drive a heavy smokers car.

[dr_gn]

stevesuk said:

Nigel Worc's said:

It's worth whatever you think it is worth, at least you know there is a gearbox issue

I thought my 330Ci had a gearbox problem, symptoms are similar to what the OP posted in the other thread. I find its only very noticeable when the car is cold (and takes a little longer to go away when its very cold outside). Test drove on a mild day and after the dealer had popped it up the road to "put some fuel in it", so didn't really notice.

My local indie (ex BMW techs) had a look over the car last week and couldn't find any faults. So I think its more an annoyance than a proper transmission fault.

From what I read online, there are a couple of cheap parts that wear over time and could do with replacing (maybe some rubber bushes, and/or a piston?). Unfortunately, it requires good access to the gearbox to replace these parts (perhaps a gearbox out job). Was thinking with mine that I'd probably wait until the clutch needs replacing and look at getting it done then. In the meantime, its just a minor annoyance I've already got used to. The rest of the car is so good I don't really mind, and I tend to spend most of my miles in 5th gear on the motorway anyway :-)

Yes, it appears to be a minor fault that takes 5 minutes to fix...once the gearbox is out.

I was thinking the same thing - take the box out and shove a new clutch in it at the same time, maybe a new rad and water pump to be on the safe side and before you can say "Shipwright's Disease" I'm up to £4k.

[Fox-]

Nigel Worc's said:

My concern wouldn't be with that car in particular, it'd be why are you looking at a gearbox problem on such a top end car, at such a low mileage ?

Because its 9 years old which makes it mileage more or less irrelevent?

[bilsland]

My opinion - why touch it? It's not the ideal colour or spec you want, it is a smokers car, the interior isn't perfect and it's got a known fault. it also appears to need a service in 75 miles?

If I was unsure I'd say no but tell him you'd consider an offer if he services and fixes the car and has a valet remove the smell ( if possible)

I know it sounds aggressive but honestly there are too many cherished and decent cars of this style for sale to waste time with one that is broken and flawed.

[Fox-]

bilsland said:

it also appears to need a service in 75 miles?

No, it'll need a tank of petrol in 75 miles.

[bilsland]

Ah yes... Probably explains why the dealer gives me funny looks when I drop the car off for a service every 350 miles or so!

[Nigel Worc's]

DivideBYZero said:

Forget the gearbox problem. Even if you fix it the car will always smell like a bin, due to the smoking. I'd rather be missing two cogs than have to drive a heavy smokers car.

FFS, clowns like you are quite useful really, makes cars cheaper for me lol

Any other smells bother you ? curry, farts, certain perfumes ?

[dr_gn]

bilsland said:

I know it sounds aggressive but honestly there are too many cherished and decent cars of this style for sale to waste time with one that is broken and flawed.

BMW 330i M Sport.
< 80,000 miles.
FBMWSH.
No leather.
pref. Blue or Silver.
No faults. At all.
Non Smoker (the owner).
< £3500.

Be great if you could find me one

ETA, is it possible to remove the smoke smell from a car interior?

[stevesuk]

dr_gn said:

Be great if you could find me one

Despite what others have said, I don't think they are that easy to find in the right condition, with the right spec and for the right budget - unless you're willing to wait ages for the perfect car, or travel miles (possibly with many wasted journeys due to people describing cars as "spot on" when they actually aren't).

I just looked on Autotrader, and there is only one 330i Sport saloon for sale within 100 miles of my address within your budget - and that doesn't meet all your other requirements.

If you add on some extra requirements (eg. I wanted a coupe with xenons), then it makes it even harder to find one within budget.

At the end of the day, you're looking to spend £3,500 on a 9 or 10 year old car which would have cost its original owner maybe 10 times more than that (by the time some options were added). I doubt you'll find an absolutely perfect one, some compromises and an expectation that you might have to spend some money on curing faults is probably to be expected.

Just my opinion mind, someone else will probably be along later posting up some links of mint condition low mileage cars for you

[dr_gn]

stevesuk said:

dr_gn said:

Be great if you could find me one

Despite what others have said, I don't think they are that easy to find in the right condition, with the right spec and for the right budget - unless you're willing to wait ages for the perfect car, or travel miles (possibly with many wasted journeys due to people describing cars as "spot on" when they actually aren't).

I just looked on Autotrader, and there is only one 330i Sport saloon for sale within 100 miles of my address within your budget - and that doesn't meet all your other requirements.

If you add on some extra requirements (eg. I wanted a coupe with xenons), then it makes it even harder to find one within budget.

At the end of the day, you're looking to spend £3,500 on a 9 or 10 year old car which would have cost its original owner maybe 10 times more than that (by the time some options were added). I doubt you'll find an absolutely perfect one, some compromises and an expectation that you might have to spend some money on curing faults is probably to be expected.

Just my opinion mind, someone else will probably be along later posting up some links of mint condition low mileage cars for you

Thanks,

I realise a 10 year old car like this is not going to be perfect. I also realise that despite it being 'cheap' to buy, it will still have maintenence costs that do not recognise age or depreciation. Luckily I'm able to undertake most work myself. I am however terrified of rust.

I'd be happy with the car in the O/P, it is just price - and the nagging doubt about the smoke smell - that's stopping me.

I need a car before my current MOT expires in July. I've been looking on and off since last July. I've missed two potentially very good examples by being too late calling the seller. I'm sure something will turn up eventually.