I smell Petrol - Could it be a leak?
Discussion
Went for a blast yesterday and smelt petrol on the way home but didn't think much of it as we had just filled the car up and I got the usual splattering of Super Plus on my hand.
When we got home, we could still smell petrol and it seemed to be coming from the nearside rear of the car. Had a dekko underneath and couldn't see or feel anything wet, although there was a small liquid stain on the body work behind the rear wheel - but no gushings of petrol or puddles on the garage floor.
Opened the boot and the carpet on the left hand side of the boot was damp and smelt strongly of petrol. I know that I didn't spill any into the boot when I filled it (all the gear that was in there was bone dry so I couldn't have done) - but the carpet is wet.
Anyone out there got any ideas or had the same thing - we don't want to end up as a frazzled wreck on the side of the road on our way to Chatsworth next weekend.
Cheers
Herbie!
When we got home, we could still smell petrol and it seemed to be coming from the nearside rear of the car. Had a dekko underneath and couldn't see or feel anything wet, although there was a small liquid stain on the body work behind the rear wheel - but no gushings of petrol or puddles on the garage floor.
Opened the boot and the carpet on the left hand side of the boot was damp and smelt strongly of petrol. I know that I didn't spill any into the boot when I filled it (all the gear that was in there was bone dry so I couldn't have done) - but the carpet is wet.
Anyone out there got any ideas or had the same thing - we don't want to end up as a frazzled wreck on the side of the road on our way to Chatsworth next weekend.
Cheers
Herbie!
Don't want to alarm you, but I had wet boot carpets and a strong petrol smell, 2 weeks after I got my Chimaera (new). I noticed it first when stuck in a traffic jam on the M1. It gradually got worse, until one day, as I took some shopping out of the boot, I noticed the smell, plus liquid in the boot. Sure enough, there ws 2" of petrol swilling about in thwe boot, and dripping through the bolt holes in the bodywork, onto the hot exhaust!! Turned out there was a small hole in the back of the tank/. Needless to say, I was less than chuffed - a human/car fireball had been a distinct possibility. Get it checked ASAP!!
Thanks for the replies chaps.
I am probably being really dense here, but is the tank under the car, or is it the rectangular bit of metal at the back of the boot?
Also, is there an overflow from the petrol tank at the rear of the car? The only reason I ask is that I did squeeze in a the last few drops of petrol when we filled up and I am hoping that I Have just splurted a bit of fuel into an overflow and it is nothing more sinister than that.
I really hate to ask silly questions like this and I have just ordered Steve's book so that I can hopefully pick up on things like this myself, but in the meantime, happy to hear your thoughts!
Cheers
Herbie!
I am probably being really dense here, but is the tank under the car, or is it the rectangular bit of metal at the back of the boot?
Also, is there an overflow from the petrol tank at the rear of the car? The only reason I ask is that I did squeeze in a the last few drops of petrol when we filled up and I am hoping that I Have just splurted a bit of fuel into an overflow and it is nothing more sinister than that.
I really hate to ask silly questions like this and I have just ordered Steve's book so that I can hopefully pick up on things like this myself, but in the meantime, happy to hear your thoughts!
Cheers
Herbie!
quote:
Sure enough, there ws 2" of petrol swilling about in thwe boot, and dripping through the bolt holes in the bodywork, onto the hot exhaust!! Turned out there was a small hole in the back of the tank/. Needless to say, I was less than chuffed - a human/car fireball had been a distinct possibility.
If it's any consolation, petrol/exhaust isn't as dangerous as you might think because petrol's boiling point is lower than its flash point - it evaporates before it catches fire. Oil is far more dangerous from that point of view, and hydraulic fluid is downright lethal.
Pete - IIRC the 'flash point' of a liquid is the temperature that above which, the vapour given off will ignite if exposed to an ignition source. So evaporating petrol, although not able to explode of its own accord, is not a good thing.
>> Edited by Leadfoot on Thursday 6th June 01:13
>> Edited by Leadfoot on Thursday 6th June 01:13
'IIRC the 'flash point' of a liquid is the temperature that above which, the vapour given off will ignite if exposed to an ignition source.'
I think it's the temp at which the vapour catches fire spontaneously - ie it doesn't *need* an ignition source as such, just temp, to make it go bang. Matches set fire to petrol at almost any temp!
I think it's the temp at which the vapour catches fire spontaneously - ie it doesn't *need* an ignition source as such, just temp, to make it go bang. Matches set fire to petrol at almost any temp!
When I got my Griff I had the worrying smell of petrol. Someone on here gave me a tip to check and it sorted it.
He suggested that I might need to tighten the nut where I think its called the fuel guage sender goes in to the tank. In the Griff its that 'rectagular box' in the boot. Top right had side - easy to get at once you peel back some carpet.
It worked for me!
Paul
He suggested that I might need to tighten the nut where I think its called the fuel guage sender goes in to the tank. In the Griff its that 'rectagular box' in the boot. Top right had side - easy to get at once you peel back some carpet.
It worked for me!
Paul
quote:
I think it's the temp at which the vapour catches fire spontaneously - ie it doesn't *need* an ignition source as such, just temp, to make it go bang. Matches set fire to petrol at almost any temp!quote:
Wrong track I'm afraid.
I'll give you an example of a flash point of a fuel I'm familiar with:
Jet A1 (aviation fuel) has a flash point of +23 deg C. This stuff is basicaly kerosene so its a LOT less volatile than petrol. I can assure you that if you spill it onto hot tarmac on a hot day it won't ignite - or there'd be an awful lot of explosions at Airports!
No idea about petrols flash point, but I'd guess it's very very low.
Let me add my tuppence on this subject. It is vapours given off from a flammable liquid that combust, not the liquid itself. When the vapour from a flammable liquid combines with the correct amount of oxygen and a source of ignition (e.g. a spark) is introduced, the vapour will ignite. (This is what appears to be happening in 7 of the 8 cylinders in my car - the reason will remain unclear until the Optimax is consumed!)
Most flammable liquids have flash points at or below room temperature. Petrol actually begins to release vapours at -43°C. That is, vapour is given off into the air at that temperature, and this layer of vapour will burn when an ignition point is brought near. Liquids like these are called volatile. As ambient temperature increases their volatility increases correspondingly i.e. they become more readily combustible as ambient temperature rises.
The vapour density of flammable liquids determines whether the vapour will rise and dissipate in the air or whether it sinks into low places such as sewers and the bottom of a Chimp's boot. The vapour density of petrol is around 2.5 compared to air at 1.0. This means that very often at head height on a still day you may not smell a petrol vapour cloud even though your tootsie’s might be screaming “don’t light that fag, for Chrissakes”.
Now over to the other issue: what is the spontaneous ignition temperature (SIT) of a liquid, i.e. the lowest temperature at it will ignite without the application of an ignition source. This temperature is higher than the flash point. The SIT for petrol is around 260°C which is why petrol and the hot exhaust is often blamed for conflagrations after RTAs when in fact (as GreenV8S pointed out) the usual cause is ruptured brake/clutch lines since the SIT of this fluid is below that of petrol.
Hutch
Most flammable liquids have flash points at or below room temperature. Petrol actually begins to release vapours at -43°C. That is, vapour is given off into the air at that temperature, and this layer of vapour will burn when an ignition point is brought near. Liquids like these are called volatile. As ambient temperature increases their volatility increases correspondingly i.e. they become more readily combustible as ambient temperature rises.
The vapour density of flammable liquids determines whether the vapour will rise and dissipate in the air or whether it sinks into low places such as sewers and the bottom of a Chimp's boot. The vapour density of petrol is around 2.5 compared to air at 1.0. This means that very often at head height on a still day you may not smell a petrol vapour cloud even though your tootsie’s might be screaming “don’t light that fag, for Chrissakes”.
Now over to the other issue: what is the spontaneous ignition temperature (SIT) of a liquid, i.e. the lowest temperature at it will ignite without the application of an ignition source. This temperature is higher than the flash point. The SIT for petrol is around 260°C which is why petrol and the hot exhaust is often blamed for conflagrations after RTAs when in fact (as GreenV8S pointed out) the usual cause is ruptured brake/clutch lines since the SIT of this fluid is below that of petrol.
Hutch
quote:
I think it's the temp at which the vapour catches fire spontaneously - ie it doesn't *need* an ignition source as such, just temp, to make it go bang. Matches set fire to petrol at almost any temp!
This is the fire point. Flashpoint will do as it sounds. You will see a quick burst of flame and then it will extinguish, if you continue to heat the fluid it will then remain a light. Heating fuel will eventually cause it to self ignite i.e. firepoint regardless if an ignition source is present. This is difficult to do as it will evaporate.
>> Edited by zippy500 on Friday 2nd August 07:58
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