Discussion
I'm not getting this.
Greece is a debt-ridden workshy donkey that's dragging the whole Euro zone down.
So why is the prospect of it leaving the Euro so dreadful and 'cataclysmic'? Kicking out the donkey should make the rest stronger, no? Shares should be going up!
Mind you it's all the fault of the bloody fools who let them join in the first place. Clever economists costing everybody a fortune? Well I never. And even though we're no in the Euro, we're getting screwed anyway
Greece is a debt-ridden workshy donkey that's dragging the whole Euro zone down.
So why is the prospect of it leaving the Euro so dreadful and 'cataclysmic'? Kicking out the donkey should make the rest stronger, no? Shares should be going up!
Mind you it's all the fault of the bloody fools who let them join in the first place. Clever economists costing everybody a fortune? Well I never. And even though we're no in the Euro, we're getting screwed anyway
Because a lot of the eurozone countries who have lent the Greeks euros over the last decade will suddenly find their debts converted to dracmas, worth at best 50% of their face value.
This loss will have to be written out of the lender's books, except the lenders are probably pension funds and commercial banks, who sort of need it.
But for the average Greek in the street, yes, leaving the euro must seem the obvious answer if some faceless corporation on the other side of Europe is the only loser.
This loss will have to be written out of the lender's books, except the lenders are probably pension funds and commercial banks, who sort of need it.
But for the average Greek in the street, yes, leaving the euro must seem the obvious answer if some faceless corporation on the other side of Europe is the only loser.
Huntsman said:
There is more than one debt ridden work shy donkey in the Euro zone.
If Greece leaves it sets a precedent....
That's what it is. Greece leaving the Euro will do two things.If Greece leaves it sets a precedent....
1)Get Greece back on an even keel at some point; and
2)Deal a hell of a lot of pain out to the rest of the Eurozone countries.
The electorate in Spain, Portugal, Ireland, The Netherlands, and possibly Italy and maybe even France will see Greece freefall out of the Euro, but then the recovery will likely happen much more quickly than it would in the Eurozone.
They'll then ask themselves "why not?" and maybe make the jump themselves. If your economy is a little less basket case-y than Greece (like Ireland) you will probably have a reasonably gentle devaluation which is just what the doctor ordered for growth.
king euroland......twunts.davepoth said:
That's what it is. Greece leaving the Euro will do two things.
1)Get Greece back on an even keel at some point; and
2)Deal a hell of a lot of pain out to the rest of the Eurozone countries.
The electorate in Spain, Portugal, Ireland, The Netherlands, and possibly Italy and maybe even France will see Greece freefall out of the Euro, but then the recovery will likely happen much more quickly than it would in the Eurozone.
They'll then ask themselves "why not?" and maybe make the jump themselves. If your economy is a little less basket case-y than Greece (like Ireland) you will probably have a reasonably gentle devaluation which is just what the doctor ordered for growth.
Here's hoping but I fear the Irish politicians will do anything to ride the EU gravy train for as long as possible,they are some of the highest paid and least qualified politicians in the EU.1)Get Greece back on an even keel at some point; and
2)Deal a hell of a lot of pain out to the rest of the Eurozone countries.
The electorate in Spain, Portugal, Ireland, The Netherlands, and possibly Italy and maybe even France will see Greece freefall out of the Euro, but then the recovery will likely happen much more quickly than it would in the Eurozone.
They'll then ask themselves "why not?" and maybe make the jump themselves. If your economy is a little less basket case-y than Greece (like Ireland) you will probably have a reasonably gentle devaluation which is just what the doctor ordered for growth.
The euro currency and the private banking debts has ruined this country for the foreseeable future, the sooner Ireland gets out the quicker the return to some sort of growth, I just cant see that happening with the current policies and direction we (Ireland) are headed at the moment.
Sump Scraper said:
Here's hoping but I fear the Irish politicians will do anything to ride the EU gravy train for as long as possible,they are some of the highest paid and least qualified politicians in the EU.
The euro currency and the private banking debts has ruined this country for the foreseeable future, the sooner Ireland gets out the quicker the return to some sort of growth, I just cant see that happening with the current policies and direction we (Ireland) are headed at the moment.
You have a referendum coming up shortly, don't you? The euro currency and the private banking debts has ruined this country for the foreseeable future, the sooner Ireland gets out the quicker the return to some sort of growth, I just cant see that happening with the current policies and direction we (Ireland) are headed at the moment.
EDLT said:
heppers75 said:
Just in case you are in any doubt as to why the Euro RaRa crew want to bail out Greece.....
No, I still don't get it. Those numbers are tiny compared to the debts those countries already have. Not that small. The issue is the banks more than anything. If they fall over their economies will too.
Simpo Two said:
I'm not getting this.
Greece is a debt-ridden workshy donkey that's dragging the whole Euro zone down.
So why is the prospect of it leaving the Euro so dreadful and 'cataclysmic'? Kicking out the donkey should make the rest stronger, no? Shares should be going up!
Mind you it's all the fault of the bloody fools who let them join in the first place. Clever economists costing everybody a fortune? Well I never. And even though we're no in the Euro, we're getting screwed anyway
I believe it's blatant market manipulation to simply separate the the private sharleholder from his invested cash. Oh, oh, crisis - sorry-io, your shares have tanked. 2 days later - ah, it was all a storm in a teacup, sorry-io, we own yer shares now. Feck off!Greece is a debt-ridden workshy donkey that's dragging the whole Euro zone down.
So why is the prospect of it leaving the Euro so dreadful and 'cataclysmic'? Kicking out the donkey should make the rest stronger, no? Shares should be going up!
Mind you it's all the fault of the bloody fools who let them join in the first place. Clever economists costing everybody a fortune? Well I never. And even though we're no in the Euro, we're getting screwed anyway
I base this theory on nothing sound except a deep distrust of anyone trying to sell me anything.
Its twofold:
1. If Greece is allowed to go, then Portugal will almost certainly follow. Ireland will look to hold another referendum on whether to stick or twist and Spain will at best be 50:50 over staying or going. Italy will try and stay.
2. The majority of the debt is held by the French. If Greece and/or any of the others defaults, 2 French banks will go bust and trash the French financial sector. If the French financial sector gets trashed Germany will have to hold the centre economically on its own and it cant/wont do that.
The UK is *relatively" protected, certainly in a race to the bottom we will have considerable bodies underneath us to absorb our impact. In theory we could benefit massively from putting out feet on their throats and raping the countries whilst they are weak.
1. If Greece is allowed to go, then Portugal will almost certainly follow. Ireland will look to hold another referendum on whether to stick or twist and Spain will at best be 50:50 over staying or going. Italy will try and stay.
2. The majority of the debt is held by the French. If Greece and/or any of the others defaults, 2 French banks will go bust and trash the French financial sector. If the French financial sector gets trashed Germany will have to hold the centre economically on its own and it cant/wont do that.
The UK is *relatively" protected, certainly in a race to the bottom we will have considerable bodies underneath us to absorb our impact. In theory we could benefit massively from putting out feet on their throats and raping the countries whilst they are weak.
EDLT said:
No, I still don't get it. Those numbers are tiny compared to the debts those countries already have.
So where the bailouts tiny really on national scales. The great thing about bailouts is that it's a circular flow, you can be sure much of that money went back to the Germans and French repaying debt and buying their products. Like those aid packages that used to be given to African countries in the 80's where we would lend some Africans $1bn or whatever but they had to spend it buying our tractors (despite the fact tractors where of little use to them) 
. The biggest threat to the Eurozone isn't Greece leaving, it's Greece doing well after it leaves.
Simpo Two said:
Greece is a debt-ridden workshy donkey that's dragging the whole Euro zone down.
I always think of donkeys as quite hardy and reliable little creatures.The problem for Greeks they where drip-fed just enough to service debt but not enough to turn their situation around. The Greek people are right, the EU bailout plan is a situation from which Greece cannot recover. They will be saddled with debt to larger Euro states perpetually if they go on pleasing the ECB.
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