Shocks & Coilover Spring Rates What Are you Running With?
Discussion
I'm going back to the guys at GAZ next week because my ride and handling is awful following their recomended spring rates and damper settings advice for my Wedge. They have asked to see my car but it is simply not driveable and is unsafe to say the least..
Having picked up info from a couple of you guys I'm keen to hear from anyone who's fitted coilovers on the front with regard to the spring rates used along with the rears. So far 2 have said they are running with 900lbs on the front - when I have mentioned this to GAZ they don't think that is possible on a road car.
To be frank I'm not interested what their views are as they are not driving my car I just want to go back to them with something based on your experiences if you have had the work done. As I have said before - the current state is that my car is bouncing/oscilating profusely with the damper settings set to maximum stiffness - even when I had the SH arrangement which was the route cause of my issues - the car drove much better albeit with miniscule damping on the front...
By all means email me if you want to keep your views out of the public domain...
Having picked up info from a couple of you guys I'm keen to hear from anyone who's fitted coilovers on the front with regard to the spring rates used along with the rears. So far 2 have said they are running with 900lbs on the front - when I have mentioned this to GAZ they don't think that is possible on a road car.
To be frank I'm not interested what their views are as they are not driving my car I just want to go back to them with something based on your experiences if you have had the work done. As I have said before - the current state is that my car is bouncing/oscilating profusely with the damper settings set to maximum stiffness - even when I had the SH arrangement which was the route cause of my issues - the car drove much better albeit with miniscule damping on the front...
By all means email me if you want to keep your views out of the public domain...
My experience with _standard_ dampers is that the front end will bounce and/or oscillate when driving if the dampers are ineffective. This includes (but is not limited to) when the damper mounting bungs have become perished or the nut is loose, and you only need a few mm of loose movement to give that awful floaty feeling.
Now I know you are talking about coilovers but the spring rate sets (a) the ride height and (b) when your spring becomes coil bound and the suspension bottoms out.
The effect you are talking about is entirely different - it sounds to me like either play in the damper coupling to the suspension, or that the damper itself internally has very little damping, even if this occurs just at the neutral position and then become progressively stiffer.
When I cured my loose damper mount the floaty feeling went away immediately, so I would investigate the damping at the neutral point, make sure all the suspension goints have no play, first of all, rather than getting yet another load of springs.
P.S. I have a set of SH coilovers not fitted yet, and have been reading the various threads with interest, so's I can do it properly when the time comes!
Now I know you are talking about coilovers but the spring rate sets (a) the ride height and (b) when your spring becomes coil bound and the suspension bottoms out.
The effect you are talking about is entirely different - it sounds to me like either play in the damper coupling to the suspension, or that the damper itself internally has very little damping, even if this occurs just at the neutral position and then become progressively stiffer.
When I cured my loose damper mount the floaty feeling went away immediately, so I would investigate the damping at the neutral point, make sure all the suspension goints have no play, first of all, rather than getting yet another load of springs.
P.S. I have a set of SH coilovers not fitted yet, and have been reading the various threads with interest, so's I can do it properly when the time comes!
Edited by adam quantrill on Saturday 19th May 17:40
"when I have mentioned this to GAZ they don't think that is possible on a road car"
Well tell them they are talking tosh. As you know, I have 900 on the front of mine and was thinking of stepping down to 750-800 but I haven't as after 12 months I am still quite happy with it as is.
How is your car sitting for height while stationary? does the ride height look about right with the springs fitted or has it sagged down to the end of the damper travel.
I would check this by taking the front wheel off and jack the front hub up by the lower ball joint position. Taking note when the car starts to lift, is the damper fully compressed at this point. If it is, then the springs fitted are either too soft or need more pre load. Too much pre load will make the spring coil bound, so heavier spring required.
If the car lifts and still has some damper travel left on it, (not resting on the bump stops or coil bound) then this points to inefficient damping, as it is not restricting the bounce of the spring.
Well tell them they are talking tosh. As you know, I have 900 on the front of mine and was thinking of stepping down to 750-800 but I haven't as after 12 months I am still quite happy with it as is.
How is your car sitting for height while stationary? does the ride height look about right with the springs fitted or has it sagged down to the end of the damper travel.
I would check this by taking the front wheel off and jack the front hub up by the lower ball joint position. Taking note when the car starts to lift, is the damper fully compressed at this point. If it is, then the springs fitted are either too soft or need more pre load. Too much pre load will make the spring coil bound, so heavier spring required.
If the car lifts and still has some damper travel left on it, (not resting on the bump stops or coil bound) then this points to inefficient damping, as it is not restricting the bounce of the spring.
TOPTON said:
"when I have mentioned this to GAZ they don't think that is possible on a road car"
Well tell them they are talking tosh. As you know, I have 900 on the front of mine and was thinking of stepping down to 750-800 but I haven't as after 12 months I am still quite happy with it as is.
How is your car sitting for height while stationary? does the ride height look about right with the springs fitted or has it sagged down to the end of the damper travel.
I would check this by taking the front wheel off and jack the front hub up by the lower ball joint position. Taking note when the car starts to lift, is the damper fully compressed at this point. If it is, then the springs fitted are either too soft or need more pre load. Too much pre load will make the spring coil bound, so heavier spring required.
If the car lifts and still has some damper travel left on it, (not resting on the bump stops or coil bound) then this points to inefficient damping, as it is not restricting the bounce of the spring.
Great piece of advice Top - I'll try this out before I see the GAZ guys. With regard to ride height the 275's on the rear with 14" open length on the springs has made the rear end too high by a couple of inches...Well tell them they are talking tosh. As you know, I have 900 on the front of mine and was thinking of stepping down to 750-800 but I haven't as after 12 months I am still quite happy with it as is.
How is your car sitting for height while stationary? does the ride height look about right with the springs fitted or has it sagged down to the end of the damper travel.
I would check this by taking the front wheel off and jack the front hub up by the lower ball joint position. Taking note when the car starts to lift, is the damper fully compressed at this point. If it is, then the springs fitted are either too soft or need more pre load. Too much pre load will make the spring coil bound, so heavier spring required.
If the car lifts and still has some damper travel left on it, (not resting on the bump stops or coil bound) then this points to inefficient damping, as it is not restricting the bounce of the spring.
GV said:
Great piece of advice Top - I'll try this out before I see the GAZ guys. With regard to ride height the 275's on the rear with 14" open length on the springs has made the rear end too high by a couple of inches...
Dificult to diagnose from a distance, as it always is for any problem not only suspension work. With your 275's without pre load,(i'm hoping that's what you meant by "open lenght") it was still too high. If they are pre loaded then back them off a bit. Then I would go with what combine has said he has on his, 250's on the back. At least with a 14" spring you will have room for pre load if the static sag is too much.
Another way, if the damper allows it is to lower the base of the spring leaving it slack while under no load. It becomes tight when weight is put on it. Some say this is seriously wrong, I disagree. It only becomes a problem if the rear wheels leave the ground. So it depends how often you 'get some air' I guess
GAZ actually made a coilover setup for the granada/cortina front suspension? when i phoned them, they just refused to get involved because of the extra beefing up everything needed 
900lb springs wouldn't surprise me, but it depends how firm you want the ride, or how many pot holes are about on your local hooning roads
900lb springs wouldn't surprise me, but it depends how firm you want the ride, or how many pot holes are about on your local hooning roads
Gassing Station | Wedges | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff