Newbie looking for info.
Discussion
Been lurking in this neck of the woods for a while and have had a good look through old posts gleaning information about Ultima's (must admit not read all 400+ pages). I’ve also had a look at a good few of the build sites (CJ’s and the 640 to name a couple) and gained a fair bit of info from them.
I'm genuinely interested in getting an Ultima or GD T70 (but budget doesn’t stretch that far).
I have had a look through the classifieds here on PH and the ones on Autotrader and eBay and am trying to work out what’s good, bad or indifferent. I appreciate the Ultima community may be fairly close, so don’t expect any advice on any particular car.
I assume it’s a case of get the best you can afford, based upon what I want from the car, which is……
I’m keen on track days and have done a dozen or so in my current kitcar (admittedly it’s only a lowly Se7en esque, but good fun!) but appreciate noise may be an issue. I note that the majority of Ultima’s for sale state ‘never been tracked’, would noise be a major issue? If so, what’s the answer, 3rd track day silencer ?
I’d also like to do a ‘tour’, trip to Le Mans, alps or even to the highlands, would this be do-able? I’ve driven to Munich and the ‘ring’ in my Se7en and know it’s not hugely practical, but doable.
I’ve never been a show and shine type of person, but do enjoy giving something a bit of elbow grease once in a while, so it’s not out of the question.
I’m 6’ 2”, would I fit ?
Engine wise, any preference ? or is this down to personal choice? Must admit I would be preferable, purely to make the long runs slightly more affordable (I’m used to 20mpg in the Se7en).
I’m looking at going to the factory open day in August so that I can get a good feel of the marque.
Anyway, that’s enough for the moment, I’m sure I’ll have a few more newbie questions.
TIA
I'm genuinely interested in getting an Ultima or GD T70 (but budget doesn’t stretch that far).
I have had a look through the classifieds here on PH and the ones on Autotrader and eBay and am trying to work out what’s good, bad or indifferent. I appreciate the Ultima community may be fairly close, so don’t expect any advice on any particular car.
I assume it’s a case of get the best you can afford, based upon what I want from the car, which is……
I’m keen on track days and have done a dozen or so in my current kitcar (admittedly it’s only a lowly Se7en esque, but good fun!) but appreciate noise may be an issue. I note that the majority of Ultima’s for sale state ‘never been tracked’, would noise be a major issue? If so, what’s the answer, 3rd track day silencer ?
I’d also like to do a ‘tour’, trip to Le Mans, alps or even to the highlands, would this be do-able? I’ve driven to Munich and the ‘ring’ in my Se7en and know it’s not hugely practical, but doable.
I’ve never been a show and shine type of person, but do enjoy giving something a bit of elbow grease once in a while, so it’s not out of the question.
I’m 6’ 2”, would I fit ?
Engine wise, any preference ? or is this down to personal choice? Must admit I would be preferable, purely to make the long runs slightly more affordable (I’m used to 20mpg in the Se7en).
I’m looking at going to the factory open day in August so that I can get a good feel of the marque.
Anyway, that’s enough for the moment, I’m sure I’ll have a few more newbie questions.
TIA
langy said:
....I'm genuinely interested in getting an Ultima or GD T70 (but budget doesn’t stretch that far).
I’m keen on track days and have done a dozen or so in my current kitcar (admittedly it’s only a lowly Se7en esque, but good fun!) but appreciate noise may be an issue. I note that the majority of Ultima’s for sale state ‘never been tracked’, would noise be a major issue? If so, what’s the answer, 3rd track day silencer ?
I’d also like to do a ‘tour’, trip to Le Mans, alps or even to the highlands, would this be do-able? I’ve driven to Munich and the ‘ring’ in my Se7en and know it’s not hugely practical, but doable.
I’m 6’ 2”, would I fit ?
Engine wise, any preference ? or is this down to personal choice? Must admit I would be preferable, purely to make the long runs slightly more affordable (I’m used to 20mpg in the Se7en).
The 'never tracked' likely comes from cost...if your budget is tight then can you afford to bin it at a track day?I’m keen on track days and have done a dozen or so in my current kitcar (admittedly it’s only a lowly Se7en esque, but good fun!) but appreciate noise may be an issue. I note that the majority of Ultima’s for sale state ‘never been tracked’, would noise be a major issue? If so, what’s the answer, 3rd track day silencer ?
I’d also like to do a ‘tour’, trip to Le Mans, alps or even to the highlands, would this be do-able? I’ve driven to Munich and the ‘ring’ in my Se7en and know it’s not hugely practical, but doable.
I’m 6’ 2”, would I fit ?
Engine wise, any preference ? or is this down to personal choice? Must admit I would be preferable, purely to make the long runs slightly more affordable (I’m used to 20mpg in the Se7en).
Yes you will most likely need to work on it to get the noise in limit.
Touring will be no worse or better than doing it in a seven.
You will fit no problem.
Engine will be budget and performance driven. If you want to tour then a tame, unstressed, engine will be best. Any power will be more than enough.
Steve
Thanks for the info Steve, what would be classed as a 'stressed' engine, I'm not overly familiar with chevy V8's, guess I ought to take a look at the American Speed website and go from there.
With regards to the various roll bars, is there any easy way of differentiating them ? I'm sure I've seen some with a diagonal member going from the engine bay back to the main hoop, but others haven't.
Are there any particular things to look at when viewing cars? worn bushes, racks, smoke on start up etc. Any 'idiots guide to what to look for' ?
Sorry for all the Q's.
Sean
With regards to the various roll bars, is there any easy way of differentiating them ? I'm sure I've seen some with a diagonal member going from the engine bay back to the main hoop, but others haven't.
Are there any particular things to look at when viewing cars? worn bushes, racks, smoke on start up etc. Any 'idiots guide to what to look for' ?
Sorry for all the Q's.
Sean
Welcome Sean. Asking questions is the best thing to do, so keep 'em coming! Are you looking to buy or build? It sounds more like buy from you original post....
Regarding the cars in the classifieds, it's not a case of buying the most expesnsive, but the best built that meets your spec criteria. There are some cars out there that claim big things but fail to deliver once you inspect. Be very careful and very picky. Only accept a properly built and presented car, unless you plan on doing a rebuild the moment you get it home.
Regarding engines, don't get blinded by BHP. Some of the more drivable cars wil be around 500bhp and arguably would be quicker than a 650bhp+ car, because with low weight, there's only so much grunt you can deploy out of a bend / on a bumpy road. As you're a 7-driver, you'll know this already. Make sure you get a 'box that matches the engine's power and is geared for your needs....
....Basically, I'd suggest a more modern fuel injected LS engine over a small block. If you're touring, you want a good final drive / top gear on the 'box. Most cars will have a Porsche 911 'box of some kind, but there's a ton of different variants out there. Most G50s will be right hand (rod) shift with 5 gears (6 speeders are rare)... however, there's a lot of tweaking that can be done to them, so check the specs carefully. Later (996/7) 'boxes are centre change cable shifters, but the Carrera 2 boxes are short geared, especially for cruising, so look for a twin turbo box maybe.
Always get a car with big AP brakes and ideally the later double adjustable shocks.
GTRs can have welded in rear roll bar braces, or removable ones. For your requirements (i.e. not racing), there's probalby no issue with getting the removable ones.
Do your homework and don't rush into a purchase. Look at as many cars as possible before buying one, as that way you'll see the varying quality of cars and should get a good feel for what suits your needs.
Welcome to the dark side
Mark
Regarding the cars in the classifieds, it's not a case of buying the most expesnsive, but the best built that meets your spec criteria. There are some cars out there that claim big things but fail to deliver once you inspect. Be very careful and very picky. Only accept a properly built and presented car, unless you plan on doing a rebuild the moment you get it home.
Regarding engines, don't get blinded by BHP. Some of the more drivable cars wil be around 500bhp and arguably would be quicker than a 650bhp+ car, because with low weight, there's only so much grunt you can deploy out of a bend / on a bumpy road. As you're a 7-driver, you'll know this already. Make sure you get a 'box that matches the engine's power and is geared for your needs....
....Basically, I'd suggest a more modern fuel injected LS engine over a small block. If you're touring, you want a good final drive / top gear on the 'box. Most cars will have a Porsche 911 'box of some kind, but there's a ton of different variants out there. Most G50s will be right hand (rod) shift with 5 gears (6 speeders are rare)... however, there's a lot of tweaking that can be done to them, so check the specs carefully. Later (996/7) 'boxes are centre change cable shifters, but the Carrera 2 boxes are short geared, especially for cruising, so look for a twin turbo box maybe.
Always get a car with big AP brakes and ideally the later double adjustable shocks.
GTRs can have welded in rear roll bar braces, or removable ones. For your requirements (i.e. not racing), there's probalby no issue with getting the removable ones.
Do your homework and don't rush into a purchase. Look at as many cars as possible before buying one, as that way you'll see the varying quality of cars and should get a good feel for what suits your needs.
Welcome to the dark side
Mark
Relatively new to Ultima land so I'm sure the more experienced boys will be able to share their advice, but from my research I wanted a car that had "ample" performance, was ultra reliable and used latest technology where it aided both these points
My understanding is it can be more expensive to upgrade cars, than to buy the right car in the 1st case. The prices I've heard people quoted for changing from SBC to an LS engine for example can be frightening.
So my advice, from limited knowledge, is decide what you want and buy the best example you can afford that meets that criteria
Best of luck
Dave
My understanding is it can be more expensive to upgrade cars, than to buy the right car in the 1st case. The prices I've heard people quoted for changing from SBC to an LS engine for example can be frightening.
So my advice, from limited knowledge, is decide what you want and buy the best example you can afford that meets that criteria
Best of luck
Dave
Thanks for the responses.
Yes, I am looking to buy rather than build. I don't doubt I have the ability to do it, but I think it would take me far too long (working away from home etc), but there would be more satisfaction in building. Think I'll be in the buying camp all the same.
Don't worry, I'm not blinded by the BHP bragging rights down the pub, then again......
. Agree with the 500 ish number though, it does sounds hell of a lot compared to the Se7en and the tintop.
I think the injected route would be better as I know carbs do go out of balance and they have a tendancy of 'throwing' petrol in when not always required, mind you i still smile like an excited child when the flames exit the exhaust and the sound of popping on the over-run
. Is it just the LS engines which are injected ?
I have looked at the cost of an engine change in the Se7en and know it's probably cheaper to sell and buy something with the desired engine.
I'm in no rush to buy, so viewing a few isn't too much of an issue. Just need to keep an eye on the classifieds and go and have a look at a few.
If anyone is in the Herts, Beds, Bucks area and wouldn't mind giving me a guided tour of there car it'd be greatly appreciated, PM me if you are.
Yes, I am looking to buy rather than build. I don't doubt I have the ability to do it, but I think it would take me far too long (working away from home etc), but there would be more satisfaction in building. Think I'll be in the buying camp all the same.
Don't worry, I'm not blinded by the BHP bragging rights down the pub, then again......
. Agree with the 500 ish number though, it does sounds hell of a lot compared to the Se7en and the tintop.I think the injected route would be better as I know carbs do go out of balance and they have a tendancy of 'throwing' petrol in when not always required, mind you i still smile like an excited child when the flames exit the exhaust and the sound of popping on the over-run
. Is it just the LS engines which are injected ?I have looked at the cost of an engine change in the Se7en and know it's probably cheaper to sell and buy something with the desired engine.
I'm in no rush to buy, so viewing a few isn't too much of an issue. Just need to keep an eye on the classifieds and go and have a look at a few.
If anyone is in the Herts, Beds, Bucks area and wouldn't mind giving me a guided tour of there car it'd be greatly appreciated, PM me if you are.
Hi Sean, glad you found the site(s) useful (I'm also 'CJ' by the way).
Not alot to offer by way of advice that hasn't been given, but having raced a Seven before getting into Ultima's, I'd say you won't regret it.
The Ultima is far more user friendly and well suited to track or fast road use. I toured mine to Le Mans and did trackdays in both the GTR and the Can-Am. You're on the money power wise - 500bhp seems to be the usual benchmark, but don't worry too much about it. My Can-Am was 'only' 400bhp vs the 630odd of my GTR but both were way quicker than pretty much anything I ever encountered on a trackday.
Personally speaking, if you can stretch to it I'd tend to go with a fuel injected car, especially if you're not keep on spannering. That's not to say that a well setup carb car isn't a good option too, but it's alot easier letting an ECU do to the work of sorting mixture out rather than having to fiddle with jetting etc. especially as ambient/under canopy temperatures change.
Quite a lot of builders/owners/sellers end up here so worth checking in if you find a likely purchase. The factory are also a fantastic source of info so don't be afraid to ask them what they think of any given car - chances are it will have been through them for IVA (not always though), so they are well placed to give an expert opinion on those they've seen and checked.
Good luck!
CJ/Stig
Not alot to offer by way of advice that hasn't been given, but having raced a Seven before getting into Ultima's, I'd say you won't regret it.
The Ultima is far more user friendly and well suited to track or fast road use. I toured mine to Le Mans and did trackdays in both the GTR and the Can-Am. You're on the money power wise - 500bhp seems to be the usual benchmark, but don't worry too much about it. My Can-Am was 'only' 400bhp vs the 630odd of my GTR but both were way quicker than pretty much anything I ever encountered on a trackday.
Personally speaking, if you can stretch to it I'd tend to go with a fuel injected car, especially if you're not keep on spannering. That's not to say that a well setup carb car isn't a good option too, but it's alot easier letting an ECU do to the work of sorting mixture out rather than having to fiddle with jetting etc. especially as ambient/under canopy temperatures change.
Quite a lot of builders/owners/sellers end up here so worth checking in if you find a likely purchase. The factory are also a fantastic source of info so don't be afraid to ask them what they think of any given car - chances are it will have been through them for IVA (not always though), so they are well placed to give an expert opinion on those they've seen and checked.
Good luck!
CJ/Stig
Stig,
Good website you have, it's very informative during the build and early ownership. It appears that a lot of recent builds are on Farcebook, which I do try and avoid at all costs
I think the injected route would be the better option, I don't mind spannering, but anything to do with carbs and it goes to A.N. Other !
Hadn't thought about speaking to the factory with regards to hisory of cars, will make a mental note of that.
BogBeast,
Aircon, noted.
Good website you have, it's very informative during the build and early ownership. It appears that a lot of recent builds are on Farcebook, which I do try and avoid at all costs
I think the injected route would be the better option, I don't mind spannering, but anything to do with carbs and it goes to A.N. Other !
Hadn't thought about speaking to the factory with regards to hisory of cars, will make a mental note of that.
BogBeast,
Aircon, noted.
langy said:
It appears that a lot of recent builds are on Farcebook, which I do try and avoid at all costs
BogBeast,
Aircon, noted.
Sozza, my build site is on FB because they provide a very good template out of the box, so all I have to do is upload content pics & comment. You can look at my site without being an FB member tho', I've made it public purposely for those who aren't members BogBeast,
Aircon, noted.
Interestingly, even when researching my Can Am build everyone said that AC was a necessity, despite the lack of roof, LOL! GTRs I've been in have all got pretty toasty on any kind of warm day, so definately a must have there!
langy said:
Random question, will an Ultima fit in a single garage ? and still be able to open a door to get out rather than pushing it in ?
My Sport does/did. Had to be bolt straight going in and slightly to once side, but the door opened.I am guessing that singles do vary size wise. I can get dimensions for the weekend...
langy said:
Random question, will an Ultima fit in a single garage ? and still be able to open a door to get out rather than pushing it in ?
There isn't really such thing as a std sized garage... if you've looked at my build page you'll see I'm building in a single garage without any real problems, but my garage is a bit longer than a normal single. Width wise, again, I'm OK for room, but as Can Am doors go straight up, rather than butterflying outwards, I do have a bit of an advantage there That said, I've heard of a few folks who have built GTRs in singles too, so I suspect you'll be OK... Best to measure your garage and let us know then we can give you some better feedback.langy said:
Mmm, size of garage. Well it's a case of what size is required. In the process of moving, so I guess I'm looking for something with a suitably sized garage.
Looks like I'll be taking a tape measure when viewing
Ah, fair play then. The factory's web site has the car's measurements on it IIRC, so that'll give you your minimum door measurement and overall length. Then you need a nice GTR owner to give you a measurement of the door protrusion once opened to give you a good idea of the width reauired. Unless the garage is properly undersized, you should be fine Looks like I'll be taking a tape measure when viewing
Just one thing Langy; I've been scouting around for a bit, and had a good nose around the Ultima stand at Stoneleigh.
I'm a fraction shorter than you, (186cm) but fairly long in the torso, and I didn't fit in any of their demonstrators. I could only close the door if I tucked my chin right down, and needless to say couldn't sit properly when fully enclosed in the car.
The seats were of the bucket style on a small runner, so it might be possible to lose a little bit of height (?) but the base of the seat seemed pretty close to the floor. The employee on the stand wasn't terribly helpful or interested, and when I asked if the pedal box was adjustable (Thinking I could scooch forward then tip my seat back) he just said 'no'.
I haven't taken my interest much further since then, also because I'd like to use it for track days I can't see me fitting with a helmet on in a million years..
Ideally I'd like to have a sit in something that's been built with a side mount seat perhaps, to see if it gives more headroom, but I've not had the chance as yet.
I wonder what the taller owners do?
Cheers
Iain
I'm a fraction shorter than you, (186cm) but fairly long in the torso, and I didn't fit in any of their demonstrators. I could only close the door if I tucked my chin right down, and needless to say couldn't sit properly when fully enclosed in the car.
The seats were of the bucket style on a small runner, so it might be possible to lose a little bit of height (?) but the base of the seat seemed pretty close to the floor. The employee on the stand wasn't terribly helpful or interested, and when I asked if the pedal box was adjustable (Thinking I could scooch forward then tip my seat back) he just said 'no'.
I haven't taken my interest much further since then, also because I'd like to use it for track days I can't see me fitting with a helmet on in a million years..
Ideally I'd like to have a sit in something that's been built with a side mount seat perhaps, to see if it gives more headroom, but I've not had the chance as yet.
I wonder what the taller owners do?
Cheers
Iain
Gassing Station | Ultima | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff