Discussion
A friend of mine was sacked. Im not entirely sure why and tbh I dont trust what she is telling me about the situation. But, she is owed money by the company (a small shop) for about a months wages, they say they cant afford to pay her it.
What can she do or who can she get involved to help mediate this situation?
What can she do or who can she get involved to help mediate this situation?
Odie said:
A friend of mine was sacked. Im not entirely sure why and tbh I dont trust what she is telling me about the situation. But, she is owed money by the company (a small shop) for about a months wages, they say they cant afford to pay her it.
What can she do or who can she get involved to help mediate this situation?
The county court.What can she do or who can she get involved to help mediate this situation?
Odie said:
That online thing? small claims court.
Yes. If they owe her, there's a contract that says they owe her, and they're saying no, it's pretty much a slam dunk. Even better if they've written to her and said they're not going to pay because they can't afford it. She'll need to send a "letter before action" first; basically a letter saying pay up in seven days or I consider legal action which needs to go by recorded delivery. After that it's fairly straightforward.davepoth said:
Odie said:
That online thing? small claims court.
Yes. If they owe her, there's a contract that says they owe her, and they're saying no, it's pretty much a slam dunk. Even better if they've written to her and said they're not going to pay because they can't afford it. She'll need to send a "letter before action" first; basically a letter saying pay up in seven days or I consider legal action which needs to go by recorded delivery. After that it's fairly straightforward.
Dismissal without notice or payment in lieu of notice is wrongful dismissal (a common law concept distinct from the statutory concept of unfair dismissal), unless the employee committed gross misconduct. If your friend had been employed by the shop for at least a year, she might (I say might) also have a claim for unfair dismissal (I said might). A small claim for breach of contract can be made in the county court or in an employment tribunal. What was the reason for the dismissal?
Breadvan72 said:
Dismissal without notice or payment in lieu of notice is wrongful dismissal (a common law concept distinct from the statutory concept of unfair dismissal), unless the employee committed gross misconduct. If your friend had been employed by the shop for at least a year, she might (I say might) also have a claim for unfair dismissal (I said might). A small claim for breach of contract can be made in the county court or in an employment tribunal. What was the reason for the dismissal?
She was dismissed for being off sick too much, she has a bad back (not my doing), the ownership of the shop changed about 6-8 months ago and it hasnt been doing very well, it seems the new owners never performed any due diligence before purchase, the previous owner ran it into the ground using groupon and similar. Seems yesterday bailif went into the business, so it looks like its going under.
If a person is off sick for long periods of time, the employer cannot sack them for that reason. But after a set period of time they can reduce the amount they pay the employee to the Satutory Sick Pay levels. Some employers will continue to pay an absent employee salary amounts close to their normal wage levels.. But smaller employers usually cannot afford to be so generous and will drop the salary to the SSP levels as soon as they can.
Unless someone has copmmitted an act of gross misconduct, they usually cannot be sacked out of hand.
Unless someone has copmmitted an act of gross misconduct, they usually cannot be sacked out of hand.
There is no one line bloke in pub answer to these questions. In certain circumstances, an employee can lawfully and fairly be dismissed for being absent due to sickness. In common law, all employees can be dismissed on notice, without cause. The employer must give the contractual notice, or pay damages in lieu of notice. Summary dismissal is only lawful when the employee repudiates the contract. Gross misconduct (eg schtupping teenage nuns on company time) is a repudiation of the contract. Many modern contracts contain a payment in lieu clause. Employees who qualify for statutory employment protection cannot be lawfully dismissed unless the employer has a potentially fair reason for dismissal, and acts reasonably in dismissing for that reason.
This is a summary, not an exhaustive guide for cherry pickers. The law is extensive and not always susceptible to bloke in pub analysis. "My mate says X" is no basis for a grown up to act upon.
This is a summary, not an exhaustive guide for cherry pickers. The law is extensive and not always susceptible to bloke in pub analysis. "My mate says X" is no basis for a grown up to act upon.
Breadvan72 said:
This is a summary, not an exhaustive guide for cherry pickers. The law is extensive and not always susceptible to bloke in pub analysis. "My mate says X" is no basis for a grown up to act upon.
Eric Mc said:
I bet she never signed a formal employment contract.
You are correct she didn't.ETA - just to clarify, the money she is trying to get back is her final paycheck, the money that she has worked for and is owed. This thread is not about 'compensation' likely she 'deserves' some but thats for another time.
She is the kind of person who will never see a penny of any money she owed or some swindling lawyer will take the case and it will cost her more in the long run.
She is still owed pay by the previous owner iirc.
ETFA - She was sacked by text message...
Edited by Odie on Thursday 24th May 10:33
Edited by Odie on Thursday 24th May 10:37
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