Huskamute Biting :(
Discussion
Hi everyone!,
I have a 9 week old Huskamute boy- Alaskan malamute and husky corss.
He is always trying to bite me and my family. I could be lieing on the floor are he will take snaps at your face and hair. Even when i try stroke him he keeps trying to bite and scratch. I have started using a bottle to spray him with when hes naughty but im not sure how much water to actually apply? even when i do spray him he just lunges for the bottle. It is actually making us angry now because we cant even stroke him and play with him because he bites and barks.
Any tips would be good!
Thanks
I have a 9 week old Huskamute boy- Alaskan malamute and husky corss.
He is always trying to bite me and my family. I could be lieing on the floor are he will take snaps at your face and hair. Even when i try stroke him he keeps trying to bite and scratch. I have started using a bottle to spray him with when hes naughty but im not sure how much water to actually apply? even when i do spray him he just lunges for the bottle. It is actually making us angry now because we cant even stroke him and play with him because he bites and barks.
Any tips would be good!
Thanks
This is a complicated one and you need to seek more help that can probably be safely provided on here. Puppies playbite but unfortunately yours is doing it to the extreme. I don't think spraying with water is the right thing at this stage. Have you registered with a vets, if so get onto them and see if they have a vet/ nurse with good behavioural knowledge and poss take along for a visit and see if they witness what she is doing.
Normally you ignore this behaviour as soon as they start but usually it's triggered by play, does the pup seem to mean it?
How well socialised was it before you got it? Husky and Malamute cross is a difficult breed to handle and you need to ensure the biting isn't fear aggression.
Normally you ignore this behaviour as soon as they start but usually it's triggered by play, does the pup seem to mean it?
How well socialised was it before you got it? Husky and Malamute cross is a difficult breed to handle and you need to ensure the biting isn't fear aggression.
a couple of things I've stumbled across in puppy preparation:
http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/teaching-bite...
http://www.deesdogs.com/documents/teachingbiteinhi...
Are we allowed to post links? Hope this is OK.
http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/teaching-bite...
http://www.deesdogs.com/documents/teachingbiteinhi...
Are we allowed to post links? Hope this is OK.
I think maybe its playing but sometimes i am sitting on the coach like now and he jumpes up and i go to stroke him and he bites. Its not too sore its just scratching and he barks at you aswell=anoying. Like right now he jumped up and bit me and i said ouch and he started barking atm me biting me and growling. I think maybe hes just playing but doesnt understand it hurtS?
He is attention seeking, and as far as he is concerned, any attention is good! When you cry out 'ow' he's still getting attention. Personally I'd stop the spray bottle tactic now, at his age his behaviours are very malleable and you don't need punishment to correct him.
Next time he bites, just stand up and walk away from him. Every time he plays nicely, reward him verbally. He will soon make the connection that if he wants attention, he has to behave in a certain way. Make sure everyone in the family is following the same principle to avoid any confusion or backward steps. Hth
Next time he bites, just stand up and walk away from him. Every time he plays nicely, reward him verbally. He will soon make the connection that if he wants attention, he has to behave in a certain way. Make sure everyone in the family is following the same principle to avoid any confusion or backward steps. Hth
9 weeks is very young!
At the moment, I'd be inclined to err on the positive side, and remind yourself that 9 weeks is really young, so it's not a huge behavioural problem just yet.
He sounds really excitable, given that you mention him jumping up at you.
At 9 weeks, I'd still think that pup is still "exploring" as well as sating his urge to play (both of which manifest themselves as nips), and you can set boundaries for his behaviour.
Our pup (not the same breed, but still quite a challenging breed, like yours!) nipped for a long time. She was well over six months old before she grew out of play nipping. She'd do as you describe, as well; if my OH was lying on the floor, she'd be straight over, nipping at him to play with her.
A similar thing with her was how excited she got. Once she was in a particular frame of mind, it was really quite difficult to refocus her energies without riling her up further - I do think an analogy can be drawn between this and your pup's reaction to being sprayed with water.
Even at puppy classes, it was difficult to praise her for doing something well, as even just saying "good girl" would provoke an overly excited reaction which could quickly escalate.
Excuse the million questions, but the answers might shed some more light on the situation...
Is your pup left alone for long? How much stimulation does he get? Does he see lots of people/dogs through the day? Does he have exactly the same reaction with everyone? (i.e. does he randomly jump up at people who haven't ever played with him?) Does he go down onto his forelegs when he's barking? Have you been consistent in what you've been teaching him - does he have any commands that he's learning at the moment? Has he done it since you've had him, or is it a "new" thing?
As said, IMO 9 weeks is very young to be unduly worried, but you're right to be concerned and want opinions on it before it becomes a set behaviour.
And there's always vet/behavioural nurses opinions... please don't just follow any advice you read, though, as some of it is really outdated and unhealthy for dogs!
At the moment, I'd be inclined to err on the positive side, and remind yourself that 9 weeks is really young, so it's not a huge behavioural problem just yet.
He sounds really excitable, given that you mention him jumping up at you.
At 9 weeks, I'd still think that pup is still "exploring" as well as sating his urge to play (both of which manifest themselves as nips), and you can set boundaries for his behaviour.
Our pup (not the same breed, but still quite a challenging breed, like yours!) nipped for a long time. She was well over six months old before she grew out of play nipping. She'd do as you describe, as well; if my OH was lying on the floor, she'd be straight over, nipping at him to play with her.
A similar thing with her was how excited she got. Once she was in a particular frame of mind, it was really quite difficult to refocus her energies without riling her up further - I do think an analogy can be drawn between this and your pup's reaction to being sprayed with water.
Even at puppy classes, it was difficult to praise her for doing something well, as even just saying "good girl" would provoke an overly excited reaction which could quickly escalate.
Excuse the million questions, but the answers might shed some more light on the situation...
Is your pup left alone for long? How much stimulation does he get? Does he see lots of people/dogs through the day? Does he have exactly the same reaction with everyone? (i.e. does he randomly jump up at people who haven't ever played with him?) Does he go down onto his forelegs when he's barking? Have you been consistent in what you've been teaching him - does he have any commands that he's learning at the moment? Has he done it since you've had him, or is it a "new" thing?
As said, IMO 9 weeks is very young to be unduly worried, but you're right to be concerned and want opinions on it before it becomes a set behaviour.
And there's always vet/behavioural nurses opinions... please don't just follow any advice you read, though, as some of it is really outdated and unhealthy for dogs!
And I forgot - best technique I found with our unruly ladybeast was ignoring her.
Any undesirable behaviour, simply walk away.
If you're playing with him and he nips you, simply disengage and walk away. He'll very quickly learn what is and isn't acceptable to you, and what means continued play and what means end of play.
It sounds like it's a complete non-solution, but I promise you it works. Especially if you reinforce the good behaviour whilst ignoring the bad.
Any undesirable behaviour, simply walk away.
If you're playing with him and he nips you, simply disengage and walk away. He'll very quickly learn what is and isn't acceptable to you, and what means continued play and what means end of play.
It sounds like it's a complete non-solution, but I promise you it works. Especially if you reinforce the good behaviour whilst ignoring the bad.
I too am hoping it is just exploration etc but unfortunately having just experienced a very young pup exhibiting the same behaviour which then turned very quickly into fear aggression I am being overly cautious re seeking advice.
I am sure it will settle in time
but it is ott compared to the norm.
I am sure it will settle in time
but it is ott compared to the norm.
Poor pup, Bex! I assume it can still be reduced and managed, though? Hope so.
I'll bow to professional advice, obviously, but I just think that 9 weeks is quite young for the behaviour to be completely unchangeable, so calm management, OP, (no water sprays and absolutely no shouting) and clear, consistent boundaries should result in positive steps.
Two weeks ago my son was attacked by a Husky/staffy cross of 17 weeks old.
The dog got out of the house (cos the silly cow left the door wide open), chased my son and attacked him until it was physically pulled of him.
No real damage but a visit to A&E and a few days in dressings and a shredded T shirt..
Sadly a Husky or Malamute would actually be my dog of choice and I have spoken to a lot of owners in the past, all of whom have gone out of their way to talk me out of it.
They have a reputation for being very willful and single minded.
You can never let a husky off the lead as it WILL NOT come back when you call it. The last guy I spoke to said he only got the dog back as it stopped when it chased a cat up a tree.
I am told, possibly wrongly, that in the wild they play fight/bite to establish a hierarchy which will result in the dominant dog pinning the weaker to the floor by it's throat. The weaker dog will submit.
If you pin the dog down by the throat (not hurting it) you have established yourself as the dominant "dog".
It sort of made sense at the time, but IANAV.
The dog got out of the house (cos the silly cow left the door wide open), chased my son and attacked him until it was physically pulled of him.
No real damage but a visit to A&E and a few days in dressings and a shredded T shirt..
Sadly a Husky or Malamute would actually be my dog of choice and I have spoken to a lot of owners in the past, all of whom have gone out of their way to talk me out of it.
They have a reputation for being very willful and single minded.
You can never let a husky off the lead as it WILL NOT come back when you call it. The last guy I spoke to said he only got the dog back as it stopped when it chased a cat up a tree.
I am told, possibly wrongly, that in the wild they play fight/bite to establish a hierarchy which will result in the dominant dog pinning the weaker to the floor by it's throat. The weaker dog will submit.
If you pin the dog down by the throat (not hurting it) you have established yourself as the dominant "dog".
It sort of made sense at the time, but IANAV.
odyssey2200 said:
I am told, possibly wrongly, that in the wild they play fight/bite to establish a hierarchy which will result in the dominant dog pinning the weaker to the floor by it's throat. The weaker dog will submit.
If you pin the dog down by the throat (not hurting it) you have established yourself as the dominant "dog".
It sort of made sense at the time, but IANAV.
Definitely wrongly, the whole dominance theory thing is tosh. If you pin the dog down by the throat (not hurting it) you have established yourself as the dominant "dog".
It sort of made sense at the time, but IANAV.
http://www.fun4fido.co.uk/blog/debunking-the-domin...
Sorry to hear about your son, hope it doesn't make him scared of dogs.
ehonda said:
Definitely wrongly, the whole dominance theory thing is tosh.
http://www.fun4fido.co.uk/blog/debunking-the-domin...
Sorry to hear about your son, hope it doesn't make him scared of dogs.
He is OK, but had a lucky escape.http://www.fun4fido.co.uk/blog/debunking-the-domin...
Sorry to hear about your son, hope it doesn't make him scared of dogs.
He is Ok with dogs as my Sister has a couple of springers that he is fine with but he refuses to go past that house again, now.
This was afew days later
erk... i'm going to get really flamed for this, but this advice has worked for me.
Do not ignore it, do not treat it as a small thing.
Dogs ar oack animals and in my experience, from a very young age, look to push their boundaries.
As soon as your dog uses it's mouth when play fighting, you should stop, and tell it off. don't hit it, that's just stupid, but tell it off and then ignore it for a while.
If it is scared of you telling it off, then it treats you as the pack leader, and that's ok. don't feel like you have to apologise to it though.
However if it ignores you telling it off, you have a different problem, the dog does not think you are the pack leader. unfortunately my advice for this goes against what many will say, and this is the 'Cesar Milan hold', or pinning down the dog until submission. I would never put any actual pressure on the dog though, only enough to hold it down.
Do not ignore it, do not treat it as a small thing.
Dogs ar oack animals and in my experience, from a very young age, look to push their boundaries.
As soon as your dog uses it's mouth when play fighting, you should stop, and tell it off. don't hit it, that's just stupid, but tell it off and then ignore it for a while.
If it is scared of you telling it off, then it treats you as the pack leader, and that's ok. don't feel like you have to apologise to it though.
However if it ignores you telling it off, you have a different problem, the dog does not think you are the pack leader. unfortunately my advice for this goes against what many will say, and this is the 'Cesar Milan hold', or pinning down the dog until submission. I would never put any actual pressure on the dog though, only enough to hold it down.
just noticed how young you said the puppy was, too young for submission.
try just backing off from it any time it uses it's mouth and ignore it for a few minutes.
Also in my experience, breed has nothing to do with training. Just diferent breeds attract different types owners, who often have quite generalised ways of dealing with the dog, which in turn creates the issues.
eg.
Owners are always too sort with labs, so they usually end upout of control ad excitable.
Owners of staffies often treat them as tough animals and play aggressive games with them, or act scared of them, hence the bad and aggressive behaviour.
I could go on, but I have never met a breed of dog yet that reacted differently in my training of it. Just think of it as a dog, not a specific breed.
try just backing off from it any time it uses it's mouth and ignore it for a few minutes.
Also in my experience, breed has nothing to do with training. Just diferent breeds attract different types owners, who often have quite generalised ways of dealing with the dog, which in turn creates the issues.
eg.
Owners are always too sort with labs, so they usually end upout of control ad excitable.
Owners of staffies often treat them as tough animals and play aggressive games with them, or act scared of them, hence the bad and aggressive behaviour.
I could go on, but I have never met a breed of dog yet that reacted differently in my training of it. Just think of it as a dog, not a specific breed.
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do not advise the pinning down method, such a negative training tool and potentially dangerous if aadivsed to inexperienced dog owners.
Believe me we have seen the damage this method can do to some dogs and the months it takes to try and reverse the damage.
If a dog backs off frightened it is not respecting your dominance it is showing the potential for fear aggression - more dangerous than 'dominance aggression' and far far more common.
Karyn - I agree with you and hope this is the case (the pup I mentioned was a husky mix)
Husky and Malamutes can be great but they are a difficult breed and unpredictable as a result and being overbred (thus carelessness ensues re: temperament etc) a good husky is generally a very well exercised husky
Believe me we have seen the damage this method can do to some dogs and the months it takes to try and reverse the damage.
If a dog backs off frightened it is not respecting your dominance it is showing the potential for fear aggression - more dangerous than 'dominance aggression' and far far more common.
Karyn - I agree with you and hope this is the case (the pup I mentioned was a husky mix)
Husky and Malamutes can be great but they are a difficult breed and unpredictable as a result and being overbred (thus carelessness ensues re: temperament etc) a good husky is generally a very well exercised husky
bexVN said:
Paddy_N_Murphy said:
bexVN said:
a good husky is generally a very well exercised husky
Partly why their popularity in the UK now concerns me. I simply can't believe the 'average' UK husky is getting enough exercise.Our German Shepherd was very bitey as a puppy and it was a pretty awful experience. Looking back, we probably over-stimulated her and made too little effort to draw her energy to toys.
Our Lab tried to be bitey but after the previous experience I decided not to let a single incident go. We tried:
1) Plastic bottle half filled with rice. Keep it on you and when he bites throw it at the floor as hard as you can.
2) Left him on his own as soon as he became "naughty" - only came back to him after he stopped crying (5-10 minutes), at which point he was a lot calmer.
3) If he goes for hands, stick your thumb into his mouth and push down on the back of his tongue. It gags them and they're unlikely to keep biting your hands.
Number 3 is what finally worked for the German Shepherd - the Lab was a determined wee guy and learned to bite further up my arms where my thumb couldn't get him
When he was about 6-7 months old I had one incident where a biting game went much further. He had decided it was time to challenge his daddy, and to say it got excessive is a huge understatement. It ended up with him pinned to the ground with a couple of fingers pushed into the side of his neck (according to Cesar Millan it simulates canine teeth - who knows!) while he used all his force to try and twist his head around to bite me - accompanied with snarling and growling. After 25 minutes I was sweating but he was exhausted - he got weaker and weaker and eventually gave up and went limp. I let him go, he acted like a perfect little puppy and I've never had another challenge since
.Well I'm glad it worked for your dog but you have described an horrific scenario and this is exactly what happened to a clients dog by a supposed expert. In this case the dog has, as a result, become a fearful wreck of a dog. It has been ruined because the above was done to it.
Also just reading it sends shivers down my spine thinking of the injuries that could have occurred to either party. I dread to think what you could have done if you pressed on the wrong part of his neck, or the strain he put on his neck whilst struggling to get away.
Also just reading it sends shivers down my spine thinking of the injuries that could have occurred to either party. I dread to think what you could have done if you pressed on the wrong part of his neck, or the strain he put on his neck whilst struggling to get away.
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