Discussion
1st post on PH!
After many years driving various Lotus models (Esprit, Elise, Exige) I’ve decided a change is in order so I’m in the market for a new Caterham 7. However, living here in Switzerland we only have one engine type homologated for sale : the 175bhp Duratec.
This is offered over 3 different chassis types; Roadsport, Roadsport SV and CSR.
I visited the Caterham dealer here in Switzerland and test drove a Roadsport SV which I just loved. What a great car. Laugh out loud fun.
As the car will see very limited track work and will mostly be used for B road blasts, mountain pass fun and the occasional tour to France / Italy / Spain etc. I’m told the SV chassis suits my needs better.
I’m not a big guy - 5’10” - 12 stone. So the SV is perhaps not the natural choice, although the extra room may equal additional (limited) comfort for longer trips – right?
What I have no solid feel about is the real benefit of the CSR chassis over the SV? I was not able to drive the CSR, but it looks pretty interesting with the inboard front and fully independent rear etc.
The CSR obviously commands a premium over the SV so the question is : What is the real world benefit of the CSR over the SV?
To anyone who has had (or driven) both; Is it worth stumping up the extra cash?
Looking at my current budget if I were to go for the CSR I’d have to sacrifice a few options (i.e. paint & leather) at the beginning to offset the price hike a little - and bring the overall price into a more wife friendly range :-)
This doesn’t bother me that much, but just means not getting my preferred spec right now...
Any input most welcome - Cheers form Switzerland!
Andy
I'm not a fan of the SV - unless you really do need the 'extra space'...
When seen sid-by-side with the 'original' size chassis it looks kinda wrong. My personal view!
But, I don't have a CSR - I have a 23+ year old live axle chassis, with 210BHP Zetec, 5 Speed 'box, and bench seats.
I love it, and it gets well used on roads - not track.
At the end, either will be great fun!
When seen sid-by-side with the 'original' size chassis it looks kinda wrong. My personal view!
But, I don't have a CSR - I have a 23+ year old live axle chassis, with 210BHP Zetec, 5 Speed 'box, and bench seats.
I love it, and it gets well used on roads - not track.
At the end, either will be great fun!
The indepedent rear suspension of the CSR is very nice on bumpy roads, and gets the power down very well.
I wasn't very impressed with the inboard front suspension on the 260 I drove.
The salesman pointed out how "Compliant" it was. I just thought it was soft. But this could have just been setup/personal taste.
The CSR chassis is the same dimensions as the SV. You will have plenty of room for tours, as the larger dimension chassis gives you a bit more space in the boot, a bit more fuel due to a slightly wider tank, and the longer cockpit means you may have a bit of space behind the seats.
I have owned an S3 car, and sold it to get an SV, as I found the S3 chassis too small especialy two up.
If you see an SV standing on it's own, I think you'd be hard pushed to tell what it was without counting the poppers along the top of the screen.
I think caterham did a good job of getting the proportions right.
Of course the other good thing about the CSR, is I believe it has the lovely hand crafted Arch Chassis. Unless the bean couters have ditched that too.
I would say go for the CSR with the flat dash, and try the composite seats, I think you'd be suprised how comfortable they are, (I drove my R300 with Tillets to Mallorca from U.K.) you can always paint the car later, (although Personaly I prefer the bare alloy) and change things as you wish, and tell the wife everything cost 50 quid!
I'm sure you'll be very happy with whatever you decide.
Regards,
Mick.
ETA, welcome to the mad house!
I wasn't very impressed with the inboard front suspension on the 260 I drove.
The salesman pointed out how "Compliant" it was. I just thought it was soft. But this could have just been setup/personal taste.
The CSR chassis is the same dimensions as the SV. You will have plenty of room for tours, as the larger dimension chassis gives you a bit more space in the boot, a bit more fuel due to a slightly wider tank, and the longer cockpit means you may have a bit of space behind the seats.
I have owned an S3 car, and sold it to get an SV, as I found the S3 chassis too small especialy two up.
If you see an SV standing on it's own, I think you'd be hard pushed to tell what it was without counting the poppers along the top of the screen.
I think caterham did a good job of getting the proportions right.
Of course the other good thing about the CSR, is I believe it has the lovely hand crafted Arch Chassis. Unless the bean couters have ditched that too.
I would say go for the CSR with the flat dash, and try the composite seats, I think you'd be suprised how comfortable they are, (I drove my R300 with Tillets to Mallorca from U.K.) you can always paint the car later, (although Personaly I prefer the bare alloy) and change things as you wish, and tell the wife everything cost 50 quid!
I'm sure you'll be very happy with whatever you decide.
Regards,
Mick.
ETA, welcome to the mad house!
I have had both - initially an SV with 150bhp K series engine, followed by a CSR 260 4 years later. I am sure that you will enjoy both. The main difference is in the way the car rides uneven roads. With the CSR, you can feel the wheels litter-pattering over the surface of the road, leading to a smoother ride. The DeDion tube on the SV means that there is a bit more roll at the rear of the car, but still far less than you would experience on a road car.
Both are good tourers, with the SV having a deeper boot because of the lack of rears IRS, but other than that the dimensions are identical. The SV has pedals that adjust to 3 positions, the CSR's are fixed although you can get adjustable pedals that bring the pedal runners closer using a scre thread.
You don't have to have the swoopy dash on the CSR as you can fit the same flat dash that the SV has. If you have long legs this may be a benefit, but at 5'10" you should have no problems.
You will fit in a normal car though and you should try it out - if you haven't driven one before, you won't appreciate the difference that having a tighter cockpit makes when you are pressing on. If you have a passenger regularly, you should both try it out as the shoulder room can be limited in the S3 body!
Steve
Both are good tourers, with the SV having a deeper boot because of the lack of rears IRS, but other than that the dimensions are identical. The SV has pedals that adjust to 3 positions, the CSR's are fixed although you can get adjustable pedals that bring the pedal runners closer using a scre thread.
You don't have to have the swoopy dash on the CSR as you can fit the same flat dash that the SV has. If you have long legs this may be a benefit, but at 5'10" you should have no problems.
You will fit in a normal car though and you should try it out - if you haven't driven one before, you won't appreciate the difference that having a tighter cockpit makes when you are pressing on. If you have a passenger regularly, you should both try it out as the shoulder room can be limited in the S3 body!
Steve
My 1st 7 was an S3 K series 180 bhp and I didn't think anything could be more exciting to drive until I got the CSR260 
The way I recall it, the CSR chassis was designed specifically to take a 2.3 Cosworth Duratec with a view to getting better performance from the heavier engine. As the other guys have said the CSR ride is certainly more comfortable but if I had your choices I would go the the SV, I am 6ft 12.5 stone and found the S3 a bit cramped especially for gear changing. Living in Scotland, a lot of the months I am wearing a flying jacket and wearing that in an S3 was like being in a straight jacket 
The extra space in the SV is also very useful especially touring.
If you do have any cash to spare I would unreservedly recommend the new Caterham G T Seats
http://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product.php?id_prod...
I have just had them fitted to my new 7 and they are infinitely more comfortable than my previous standard leather seats, offering more lumbar support and a more reclined driving position
The way I recall it, the CSR chassis was designed specifically to take a 2.3 Cosworth Duratec with a view to getting better performance from the heavier engine. As the other guys have said the CSR ride is certainly more comfortable but if I had your choices I would go the the SV, I am 6ft 12.5 stone and found the S3 a bit cramped especially for gear changing. Living in Scotland, a lot of the months I am wearing a flying jacket and wearing that in an S3 was like being in a straight jacket The extra space in the SV is also very useful especially touring.If you do have any cash to spare I would unreservedly recommend the new Caterham G T Seats
http://www.caterhamparts.co.uk/product.php?id_prod...
I have just had them fitted to my new 7 and they are infinitely more comfortable than my previous standard leather seats, offering more lumbar support and a more reclined driving position
It's funny how one person's comfortable seat is another's torture device.
I really like the look of those new seats, and was admiring a pair in a car at Dunsfold.
The owner told me he was really cross that Caterham had installed those instead of the S types he was expecting because the new ones give him terrible back pain!
I went for Tillets because about 10 minutes was all I could stand in an S type seat, but my wife isn't a fan.
I really like the look of those new seats, and was admiring a pair in a car at Dunsfold.
The owner told me he was really cross that Caterham had installed those instead of the S types he was expecting because the new ones give him terrible back pain!
I went for Tillets because about 10 minutes was all I could stand in an S type seat, but my wife isn't a fan.
downsman said:
It's funny how one person's comfortable seat is another's torture device.
I really like the look of those new seats, and was admiring a pair in a car at Dunsfold.
The owner told me he was really cross that Caterham had installed those instead of the S types he was expecting because the new ones give him terrible back pain!
I went for Tillets because about 10 minutes was all I could stand in an S type seat, but my wife isn't a fan.
I don't think it is worth getting into a long discussion about these seats other than to say that I like them and if they weren't an improvement CC would not have introduced them but regardless, mine were tried out by an aircraft pilot who felt that they were similar posture and comfort to those he had in his aircraft I really like the look of those new seats, and was admiring a pair in a car at Dunsfold.
The owner told me he was really cross that Caterham had installed those instead of the S types he was expecting because the new ones give him terrible back pain!
I went for Tillets because about 10 minutes was all I could stand in an S type seat, but my wife isn't a fan.
. I don't mean to disrespect or disbelieve your story but the guy's opinion doesn't really make sense to me but each to his own I suppose. As for tillets, they aren't designed for comfort but for weight reduction so unless you are going round and round a track all day ... get some comfort I have owned Caterhams with the leather seats and the Tillett seats and both are comfortable. The shell seats may look like torture devices (and I believe some find them uncomfortable), but I have done hundreds of miles in one go without any discomfort. Seats are quite a personal thing and there are a huge number of factors related to why they are comfortable or uncomfortable for some people. It is like discussions on height, one 6 ft 4in person might be comfortable in an S3 and another not, but one might have very long legs and the other a long back (in proportion to overall height). I have heard a story about one Japanese car having insufficient headroom because the engineers had not allowed for the size of European backsides in comparison to Japanese ones!
Personally I find Tilletts and S-Type seats comfy, but bench seats, pre-S leather seats and those dreadful sharkfin GRP seats, fitted to early fast Caterhams to be awful.
As has been stated, the SV has a usefully larger boot, more space for passengers and if you aren’t that tall you will get luggage down the back of the seats. It could be that this is more wife friendly too as she will have more comfort and space. The fuel tank is also bigger (extra gallon I think) and you can move your feet more in the footwell or wear almost any kind of shoes. CSR is a far more refined beast, very compliant ride, far less fidgety over bad surfaces and much easier to steer on rough roads as you get very little bucking and kicking from the steering (you still get feel though). Pistonheads Chris Harris wrote a very complimentary article on the CSR when it first came out for Autocar, he raved about the experience. Mickrick has a beautiful all aluminium car which he is rightly very proud of, but the ally finish is massively hard work to keep looking good and I have seen a few shabby looking cars over the years. Polishing that bonnet with all the little vents is a pain and I would never even consider an unpainted car.
Personally I find Tilletts and S-Type seats comfy, but bench seats, pre-S leather seats and those dreadful sharkfin GRP seats, fitted to early fast Caterhams to be awful.
As has been stated, the SV has a usefully larger boot, more space for passengers and if you aren’t that tall you will get luggage down the back of the seats. It could be that this is more wife friendly too as she will have more comfort and space. The fuel tank is also bigger (extra gallon I think) and you can move your feet more in the footwell or wear almost any kind of shoes. CSR is a far more refined beast, very compliant ride, far less fidgety over bad surfaces and much easier to steer on rough roads as you get very little bucking and kicking from the steering (you still get feel though). Pistonheads Chris Harris wrote a very complimentary article on the CSR when it first came out for Autocar, he raved about the experience. Mickrick has a beautiful all aluminium car which he is rightly very proud of, but the ally finish is massively hard work to keep looking good and I have seen a few shabby looking cars over the years. Polishing that bonnet with all the little vents is a pain and I would never even consider an unpainted car.
Thanks for all the feedback, much appreciated.
After much deliberation, in the end I decided on the CSR so I went back to the dealer last Friday and put my order in.
Pretty basic spec: Yellow Paint, black pack, carbon mirrors and dash, leather, Schroth harnesses, Momo steering wheel, aero style filler.
This had pretty much maxed my budget, so unfortunately the lovely carbon seats will have to wait a bit but will certainly come.
Delivery end of Nov – can’t bloody wait...
After much deliberation, in the end I decided on the CSR so I went back to the dealer last Friday and put my order in.
Pretty basic spec: Yellow Paint, black pack, carbon mirrors and dash, leather, Schroth harnesses, Momo steering wheel, aero style filler.
This had pretty much maxed my budget, so unfortunately the lovely carbon seats will have to wait a bit but will certainly come.
Delivery end of Nov – can’t bloody wait...
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