Airport Security - worth it?
Discussion
You know all the hassle we need to go through with carry-on luggage; no liquids over 100ml, no pocket knife or multi tool, no nail scissors, no lighter etc etc?
Does anyone really think its worthwhile and does anything to prevent terror attacks?
I recently forgot about a zippo in my pocket and had to surrender it at a German airport (oddly, it was in my jacket on the way out but nobody cared/noticed) and after some debate, the woman claimed a gas lighter was ok but not a petrol one. He couldn't explain why so if anyone knows, do tell!
On the whole, I'm just pissed off you can't travel with a Swiss Army knife and a toilet bag in your carry on as it makes overnighters a massive faff of decanting into smaller bottles and whatnot. I can't believe it makes an appreciable safety difference either...do you agree?
Does anyone really think its worthwhile and does anything to prevent terror attacks?
I recently forgot about a zippo in my pocket and had to surrender it at a German airport (oddly, it was in my jacket on the way out but nobody cared/noticed) and after some debate, the woman claimed a gas lighter was ok but not a petrol one. He couldn't explain why so if anyone knows, do tell!
On the whole, I'm just pissed off you can't travel with a Swiss Army knife and a toilet bag in your carry on as it makes overnighters a massive faff of decanting into smaller bottles and whatnot. I can't believe it makes an appreciable safety difference either...do you agree?
It's a bit of a joke. I reckon that it's more to cause hassle and see how (supposedly nervous) would-be terrorists react. I have to say that the controls at Munich airport are the worst I've encountered - slow and inefficient, and it turns out useless too:
Man's laptop sets off explosives alarm, man grabs laptop and runs inside and security seal off terminal, stop all flights and still can't find said man and laptop. Impressive.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8470954.stm
Man's laptop sets off explosives alarm, man grabs laptop and runs inside and security seal off terminal, stop all flights and still can't find said man and laptop. Impressive.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8470954.stm
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
CommanderJameson said:
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Spot on, imho. It's all about being seen to be doing something.CommanderJameson said:
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
As above!Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
I always liked the quote I overheard from security at Tel Aviv when asked by an ageing UK passenger waiting to pass through security whether they needed to bag up their cosmetics etc.
'No sir. Leave it in your bag as we KNOW whether you are carrying anything dangerous and we're not stupid'
Most security through the UK/US/Euro zone seems to be playing lip service to the media's perceived risks. I used to pass through Dublin/Southampton security almost weekly-
1. One week a colleague had a roll of duct tape confiscated as he may use it to 'tie someone up'.
2. Tie-wraps on another trip. See above.
3. Set of allen keys. Could stab someone with them
4. Hand carrying a motor inverter drive. Took 10 minutes to 'convince' security it wasn't a bomb as it had a digital display and wires.
5. One old dear on Friday was pulled up with a set of knitting needles. Fair do's on that one. But she didn't think so
They never haul up anyone with spikey stilletoes or belts on though. Stab or tie up someone...course not?
On arriving home one Friday I was rummaging through my bottomless back pack and found 20x .243 rifle cartridge cases (long story, but in brief I had taken them into work to clean prior to reloading - 3-4 weeks before and then forgotten about). I would have thought that I would have been pulled out of line for those after an x-ray - they had 6 chances after all?
Edited by Marlin45 on Thursday 5th July 13:59
CommanderJameson said:
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Good reading ceej, and I agree with him, I think.Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Disruption and hassle for the sake of being seen to do something and the only people really affected are, once again, the normal law-abiding people.
CommanderJameson said:
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
I was going to quote this *exact* thing, and it's a point I wholly subscribe to. Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
Dog Star said:
CommanderJameson said:
I reckon a lot of it is "security theatre" - a load of stuff designed to look like we're Really Very Serious about security, but which doesn't really do anything but get on everyone's tits.
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
I was going to quote this *exact* thing, and it's a point I wholly subscribe to. Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
When I went through T5 a few years ago I was wearing a t-shirt with an image of an x-rayed gun on it. I was then told that I had to either turn it inside out or put a jumper on once through security as people may think its a real one. I thought they were joking.
That said having previously worked in an airport for over 6 years, most security staff dont enjoy causing people hassle, they are only following the rules that are set out. However some are overly anal.
That said having previously worked in an airport for over 6 years, most security staff dont enjoy causing people hassle, they are only following the rules that are set out. However some are overly anal.
Airport security doesn't just protect us from those with murderous intent, but the terminally stupid, too.
If people weren't forcibly prevented from doing so, I dread to think what items would be brought on board that could inadvertently risk or seriously disrupt the flight.
But yes, one of the successes of terrorism is the inordinate amount of seemingly over the top security at airports.
If people weren't forcibly prevented from doing so, I dread to think what items would be brought on board that could inadvertently risk or seriously disrupt the flight.
But yes, one of the successes of terrorism is the inordinate amount of seemingly over the top security at airports.
CommanderJameson said:
Bruce Schneier, who's a bloke what's a bit of a security expert, reckons that there are only really two significant things that have actually had an effect on making us safer when we fly: cockpit doors that aren't going to open no matter what, and the fact that passengers now know that they must resist hijackers.
This column is typical of his point of view.
He's spot on, all the authorities can do is protect against what terrorists did last time, it's responsive rather than proactive. Nobody with half a brain would bother to blow up a plane these days anyway, why would you when there are hundreds (maybe thousands) of targets you could attack that would cause equal disruption with far less risk?This column is typical of his point of view.
What REALLY annoyed me was on the way back from Guatemala.... bought a litre of Rum and 6 50ml bottles... no problems with it in my hand luggage, but got to Madrid, security scan, "No Senor, liquid in bag". Take out the 1 litre, they take it off me (even though it was bought in Duty Free) and bin it, but I was allowed the small bottles of Zacapa (thankfully!) as they were less than 50ml. I would have drunk the other bottle in one bloody go, but no... straight in the bin! (good job it wasn't zacapa!! And yes I would have checked the bag in, but didn't have time :-( )
Amazing holiday in Central America though, so don't really care too much!
Amazing holiday in Central America though, so don't really care too much!
The only decent and effective airport security I have encountered was at Tel Aviv. They have armed and unarmed, uniformed and plain clothes security and you can be quizzed by them at any point between walking into the terminal and getting on the flight. Its a proper interrogation and if you say you're travelling with others they'll wait until they return and grill them with the same questions.
A bit full on but they're polite and getting through baggage scan and passport control takes minutes.
What I hate about airport security is the amount of f
kwits who wait until they put their bag on the belt only then to take the liquid out, take off belt, loose change etc. They should shoot em imo.
A bit full on but they're polite and getting through baggage scan and passport control takes minutes.
What I hate about airport security is the amount of f
kwits who wait until they put their bag on the belt only then to take the liquid out, take off belt, loose change etc. They should shoot em imo. Recently boarded in Marrakech, I've never encountered such lax security.
Literally wandered through the metal detectors, pockets full with phone wallet etc, belt on, shoes on, no concern what so ever.
Hand luggage went through the scanner, I'm not even convinced the guy sat behind it was watching the screen.
Very very lax.
Literally wandered through the metal detectors, pockets full with phone wallet etc, belt on, shoes on, no concern what so ever.
Hand luggage went through the scanner, I'm not even convinced the guy sat behind it was watching the screen.
Very very lax.
Had a LOL moment on a UK domestic flight. security took my leatherman multitool off me and said I could collect it from the captain at the end of the flight.
They then sat me on the back row of the aircraft next to the internal baggage hold of the aircraft right next to my toolbox which contained things such as a stanley knife phillips screwdriver scissors and other nice sharp implements.
Airport security has cost me lots and lots of wasted time even carrying the correct airside permits.
They then sat me on the back row of the aircraft next to the internal baggage hold of the aircraft right next to my toolbox which contained things such as a stanley knife phillips screwdriver scissors and other nice sharp implements.
Airport security has cost me lots and lots of wasted time even carrying the correct airside permits.
fizz47 said:
I have never understood the how pedantic they are about nail cutters and sharp objects considering that if you travel on first or business class on some airlines they supply you with sharp knives anyway for your meals..
Everyone knows terrorists don't turn left when they get on a flight.
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