serious cerb itch needs scratching//few questions
Discussion
hi cerbera fellas,
seriously looking to get this itch scratched in the not too distant future but have a few numpty questions please.
looking at trying to find a really well cared for sorted enthusiast owned example to try and negate the horrors. wanting a 4.5, budget would be max c.15k is this enough for a really good car? aware of the chassis outriggers,what else needs or would be nice to be done, what questions relating to known problem areas should i be asking? anyone care to post up checklist? what would be servicing costs per annum? is putting aside £1k a year enough generally?
power wise what does a healthy 4.5 really make hp/tq, anyone care to share a dyno graph-interested in shape of the curves. what sensible tuning options for the 4.5ajp work well, is it just the chip/re-map and exhausts that are generally done, is this just smoother or are a few ponies gained? donning flame proof suit are we talking 15mpg-only asking as do a few long euro jaunts! who are the current favourite insurers?
really appreciate a bit of guidance tia!
seriously looking to get this itch scratched in the not too distant future but have a few numpty questions please.
looking at trying to find a really well cared for sorted enthusiast owned example to try and negate the horrors. wanting a 4.5, budget would be max c.15k is this enough for a really good car? aware of the chassis outriggers,what else needs or would be nice to be done, what questions relating to known problem areas should i be asking? anyone care to post up checklist? what would be servicing costs per annum? is putting aside £1k a year enough generally?
power wise what does a healthy 4.5 really make hp/tq, anyone care to share a dyno graph-interested in shape of the curves. what sensible tuning options for the 4.5ajp work well, is it just the chip/re-map and exhausts that are generally done, is this just smoother or are a few ponies gained? donning flame proof suit are we talking 15mpg-only asking as do a few long euro jaunts! who are the current favourite insurers?
really appreciate a bit of guidance tia!
£1K a year might cover it in a very good year should the previous owner have spoilt it and you can do everything yourself. Just look at the price of clutches, slaves, brake discs, radiators, shocks, chassis out riggers, water pipes etc Assume £3k pa and even then be prepared to have some years far in excess of that and others lower.
There are plenty of dyno prints, do a search.
a 4.2 is better value. Out the box they are very often higher bhp than standard 4.5s.
The 4.2s have limited tuning opportunity.
The later 4.2s (from 00 onwards?) have a 4.5 engine but with 4.2 breathing. They tend to push 400 with mild work.
A 4.2 will probably generally max out at 380/390 after some mapping etc..
A 4.5 will break 400bhp after a map. I forget what my Red Rose got - 436bhp I think (but I could be sniffing glue).
To maximise bhp (although I would buy a car and worry about bhp a year into ownership) on a 4.5 it needs short induction, remap, linked decats and possibly some head work.
For more bhp then go 4.7ltr (or 4.8).
a 4.2 is better value. Out the box they are very often higher bhp than standard 4.5s.
The 4.2s have limited tuning opportunity.
The later 4.2s (from 00 onwards?) have a 4.5 engine but with 4.2 breathing. They tend to push 400 with mild work.
A 4.2 will probably generally max out at 380/390 after some mapping etc..
A 4.5 will break 400bhp after a map. I forget what my Red Rose got - 436bhp I think (but I could be sniffing glue).
To maximise bhp (although I would buy a car and worry about bhp a year into ownership) on a 4.5 it needs short induction, remap, linked decats and possibly some head work.
For more bhp then go 4.7ltr (or 4.8).
cabbron said:
thanks guys, keep the info coming. what about the 4.5 ajp questions,power/upgrades/dyno print? happy to get on the spanners up to a point. anyone with a main stuff to check list? thanks again
These are all answered on a very regular basis, if search is down just page back in this forum and you will find answers to all you questions without going too far.Tanguero said:
These are all answered on a very regular basis, if search is down just page back in this forum and you will find answers to all you questions without going too far.
haha ph search facility! been back about 20 pages and didn't find all the answers hence the ask. nice site btw.Here's my best dyno chart:
It has a Silverstone Performance exhaust (company is no longer trading AFAIK so hard to get hold of now, but ACT do alternatives) and a remap. As standard it made 369bhp which is typical for a std 4.5. Remapping helps driveability and fuel economy, particularly on the 4.5 which left the factory with a very rich map.
The 2 other plots I have are both 411bhp and the same torque. My torque is down on most other 4.5s which often make 360+ ftlbs.
A healthy 4.2 will make 380bhp or so with similar mods.
HTH
It has a Silverstone Performance exhaust (company is no longer trading AFAIK so hard to get hold of now, but ACT do alternatives) and a remap. As standard it made 369bhp which is typical for a std 4.5. Remapping helps driveability and fuel economy, particularly on the 4.5 which left the factory with a very rich map.
The 2 other plots I have are both 411bhp and the same torque. My torque is down on most other 4.5s which often make 360+ ftlbs.
A healthy 4.2 will make 380bhp or so with similar mods.
HTH
ridds said:
scotty_d said:
15 MPG is the norm when running around hooning and to the shops ect. You should see low to mid 20's on a steady run.
I can see a smidge over 25mpg on a 80mph cruise. 
FarmyardPants said:
Here's my best dyno chart:
It has a Silverstone Performance exhaust (company is no longer trading AFAIK so hard to get hold of now, but ACT do alternatives) and a remap. As standard it made 369bhp which is typical for a std 4.5. Remapping helps driveability and fuel economy, particularly on the 4.5 which left the factory with a very rich map.
The 2 other plots I have are both 411bhp and the same torque. My torque is down on most other 4.5s which often make 360+ ftlbs.
A healthy 4.2 will make 380bhp or so with similar mods.
HTH
nice map and exactly what i wanted to see- have you got std mbe and intakes? seems massive improvement on std.It has a Silverstone Performance exhaust (company is no longer trading AFAIK so hard to get hold of now, but ACT do alternatives) and a remap. As standard it made 369bhp which is typical for a std 4.5. Remapping helps driveability and fuel economy, particularly on the 4.5 which left the factory with a very rich map.
The 2 other plots I have are both 411bhp and the same torque. My torque is down on most other 4.5s which often make 360+ ftlbs.
A healthy 4.2 will make 380bhp or so with similar mods.
HTH
Oh yea, short induction (aka whirlwind), forgot about that. Pioneered by Joo (spitfire4v8) I believe, the whirlwind induction reduces torque slightly and moves it up the rev range, but any reduction is more than made up for by the fuel/timing remap. The AJP is a surprisingly revvy/cammy engine for a 2 valve V8 as the graph shows - max power @ 7350 rpm - a totally different animal from the rover V8. It has a unique character which is why we love it 
and yes it is a massive improvement on std. It was a different car after the remap. As I said the std map on the 4.5 in particular is poor, which is why they are so tunable. The 4.2 also benefits, mostly from driveability (smooths out the dips) and to a lesser extent, power output. I run the MBE. The emerald ECU will squeeze a bit more out of it but it's quite expensive. Good luck finding your cerb, 15K should buy you a good one. Look for lots of money lavished on it and a good chassis.
Edited by FarmyardPants on Tuesday 24th July 17:09
^ thanks for that. yep going to take my time and seek out a good un. just read your euro raid to spain. did this a few times in the elise so look foreward to the comfort and mile munching of the cerb. also had some huge momments just north of madrid towards burgos in the snow on yokos!
Gazzab said:
To maximise bhp (although I would buy a car and worry about bhp a year into ownership) on a 4.5 it needs short induction, remap, linked decats and possibly some head work.
That is roughly what I did. It's taken me a year to the the car running properly, but I did start off with the cheapest running 4.5 ever sold, in a colour I hate. I ignored the oft given advice that engine variant is not that important because they are all quick. I wanted a 4.5 so that's what I got.I've only just fitted the short induction kit, and the car also has the abysmal Sports Exhaust. Other than that it is standard, immediately before the remap it was at 381. But the reason I went for the remap was to remedy the (head skim induced) pinking which meant I couldn't drive it under 2000 revs for fear it would self destruct.
I still can't believe it's made such good numbers considering how badly corroded the bores are, and how worn the tappets. Joolz said the Cats were worth up to 7 or 8 bhp, so with a decat the car could be almost 420. However if I remove them it will be because of the heat soak, rather than a few bhp.
Gassing Station | Cerbera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff