Most Pointless Warranty in the World
Discussion
Despite my nearest dealer being 110 miles away in Edinburgh and me living 10 miles south of Aberdeen, I decided to purchase an Abarth 500 Esseesse in January 2010. Car was delivered in April 2010 and to date I have done 28k and the car still has 9 months left on its warranty.
Recently a few issues have developed. Ironically mainly after I had it serviced in April this year. MW radio has stopped working for months (I know it's ancient but I use it for the football), the car has developed intermittent starting problems which is embarassing for a car of this age, the rear two wheel bearings have now developed a loud squealing noise and finally the passenger side suspension creaks loudly when you turn the wheel. Apart from the suspension, the other items are hardly "bespoke" Abarth 500 items and at the end of the day, my car is just a top of the range Fiat 500 (excluding the Ferrari edition ;-)).
So I was waiting on a fan bearing part from Abarth in Edinburgh and they said just to order it from Fiat in Aberdeen who will fit it as part of warranty. So today I phoned firstly to book the car in to have the issues mentioned above looked at. The receptionist initially said they could look at it but Abarth in Edinburgh would have to fix it. A bit inconvienient for me unable to get time off and just jolly down to Edinburgh, but it could be planned at a weekend. Then came the revelation that for them to look at the issues they would be charging me £93 an hour. Yes, ninety three pounds an hour!! I told her this was unacceptable and after speaking to her manager they wouldn't budge.
So now I'm stuck with a car with issues that need sorting and absolute zero customer service from Fiat. I didn't know my car was so specialist that it needs a superhuman mechanic to fix the problems. Abarth or not, Fiat should be able to diagnose problems and order the parts from Abarth and fix accordingly, as I said it's a bloody Fiat 500 at the end of the day! I've sent off an angry email to the Fiat customer service and await a response. I love the car but this just makes me want to sell up (I planned on keeping it another 2 years whilst I save for a Megane 265).
What are peoples thoughts on this. Should I accept I bought an Abarth and therefore knew the nearest dealer was 110 miles away, or do people agree Fiat should be looking at the problems regardless and especially not at £93 an hour! It raises the question, what is the point in a warranty.
Thank you for reading my rant :-)
Recently a few issues have developed. Ironically mainly after I had it serviced in April this year. MW radio has stopped working for months (I know it's ancient but I use it for the football), the car has developed intermittent starting problems which is embarassing for a car of this age, the rear two wheel bearings have now developed a loud squealing noise and finally the passenger side suspension creaks loudly when you turn the wheel. Apart from the suspension, the other items are hardly "bespoke" Abarth 500 items and at the end of the day, my car is just a top of the range Fiat 500 (excluding the Ferrari edition ;-)).
So I was waiting on a fan bearing part from Abarth in Edinburgh and they said just to order it from Fiat in Aberdeen who will fit it as part of warranty. So today I phoned firstly to book the car in to have the issues mentioned above looked at. The receptionist initially said they could look at it but Abarth in Edinburgh would have to fix it. A bit inconvienient for me unable to get time off and just jolly down to Edinburgh, but it could be planned at a weekend. Then came the revelation that for them to look at the issues they would be charging me £93 an hour. Yes, ninety three pounds an hour!! I told her this was unacceptable and after speaking to her manager they wouldn't budge.
So now I'm stuck with a car with issues that need sorting and absolute zero customer service from Fiat. I didn't know my car was so specialist that it needs a superhuman mechanic to fix the problems. Abarth or not, Fiat should be able to diagnose problems and order the parts from Abarth and fix accordingly, as I said it's a bloody Fiat 500 at the end of the day! I've sent off an angry email to the Fiat customer service and await a response. I love the car but this just makes me want to sell up (I planned on keeping it another 2 years whilst I save for a Megane 265).
What are peoples thoughts on this. Should I accept I bought an Abarth and therefore knew the nearest dealer was 110 miles away, or do people agree Fiat should be looking at the problems regardless and especially not at £93 an hour! It raises the question, what is the point in a warranty.
Thank you for reading my rant :-)
you did the right thing with the email, I would also forward a letter to one of the managers. I hope they can sort something out. This is why I hate taking out warranties - they will do anything to get out of coughing up.. and even worse than that - they will take forever to complete even simple work
Schuey M said:
So you plan on going from fiat to renault! Out of the frying pan and into the fire.
Sell up and get a quality car instead; ideally a jap or german motor.
The Megane has come a long way and reading reports of the 250 I've not heard any horror stories. I've had a VW before and although "better built" than the Abarth, I spent thousands on repairs for things going wrongSell up and get a quality car instead; ideally a jap or german motor.
Schuey M said:
So you plan on going from fiat to renault! Out of the frying pan and into the fire.
Sell up and get a quality car instead; ideally a jap or german motor.
Sell up and get a quality car instead; ideally a jap or german motor.
You ain't seen the jap dealers up here in aberdeen
I wouldn't trust the honda dealer to find their own arse with two hands and a map
Mouse1903 said:
Despite my nearest dealer being 110 miles away in Edinburgh and me living 10 miles south of Aberdeen, I decided to purchase an Abarth 500 Esseesse in January 2010. Car was delivered in April 2010 and to date I have done 28k and the car still has 9 months left on its warranty.
To be honest i'd be tempted to forget the warranty and go to autotechnic in Aberdeen unless someone knows an fiat expert in aberdeenCan't comment on Fiat's stance however what you describe isn't actually that uncommon. Many manufacturers state certain models can only be worked on by certain dealers so it's likely that whilst it's a Fiat you have, the local dealer is not an appointed Arbath dealer and thus they are probably forbidden from doing any warranty work on said Fiat 500. On that basis, they won't be able to claim any costs back (dealers are franchises remember) from Fiat and thus, they won't do any work under warranty as they won't be paid.
Complete pain in the hole but as said, not uncommon. Within the VAG, all dealers can service cars but cars such as the Toureg, Paeton and R8 must go to appointed dealers for certain jobs (even if it's not under warranty) and for any warranty concersn, they must go back to those dealers who are approved. It's very frustrating for the delaers and the customers alike. In those situations, I/we (as in the dealer I worked in) would try and accomodate the customer and we'd transport the car to another branch for any work we weren't permitted to do. Most customers were fine, some had a serious issue but there's a limit as to what can be done.
In this case, the dealer is perhaps right and whilst the car is 'under warranty' as a non-approved Arbath outlet and with somebody having to pay for any work/diagnostics that are carried out (be it you, the dealer or Fiat warranty) that means they'll happily have a look and diagnose the isuses but as Fiat won't pay for their time, you'll need to. Plus, chances are they won't be able to order any bespoke Arbath parts and it's also likely that they'll be blocked from ordering the parts from Edinburgh and fitting them, simply because Fiat will then decline the warranty claim and the Aberdeen dealer will be out of pocket - hence, they will simply not entertain any Arbath warranty issues. It's not they don't want to, it's more than likely that they can't.
Hopefully that makes sense!
Complete pain in the hole but as said, not uncommon. Within the VAG, all dealers can service cars but cars such as the Toureg, Paeton and R8 must go to appointed dealers for certain jobs (even if it's not under warranty) and for any warranty concersn, they must go back to those dealers who are approved. It's very frustrating for the delaers and the customers alike. In those situations, I/we (as in the dealer I worked in) would try and accomodate the customer and we'd transport the car to another branch for any work we weren't permitted to do. Most customers were fine, some had a serious issue but there's a limit as to what can be done.
In this case, the dealer is perhaps right and whilst the car is 'under warranty' as a non-approved Arbath outlet and with somebody having to pay for any work/diagnostics that are carried out (be it you, the dealer or Fiat warranty) that means they'll happily have a look and diagnose the isuses but as Fiat won't pay for their time, you'll need to. Plus, chances are they won't be able to order any bespoke Arbath parts and it's also likely that they'll be blocked from ordering the parts from Edinburgh and fitting them, simply because Fiat will then decline the warranty claim and the Aberdeen dealer will be out of pocket - hence, they will simply not entertain any Arbath warranty issues. It's not they don't want to, it's more than likely that they can't.
Hopefully that makes sense!
Definitely makes sense Davie. I trust it's the Aberdeen Fiat dealer being lazy as Edinburgh Abarth have said they are authorised to make repairs to Abarths. I've seen a few up here, and most newer than mine. Don't see them going to Edinburgh or Glasgow to get theirs serviced. I saw one for sale in Turiff a few years ago at an independent dealer, was only 6 months old at the time, makes me wonder what they did for servicing and warranty
Another thing to bear in mind which also isn't made very clear is that with all diagnostics work, the customer is liable for the costs until the dealer indentifies the issue and confirms it's a warranty concern. Once the fault has been diagnosed and deemed a warranty issue, the dealer will be paid for the time spent diagnosing the issue and subsequently repairing it. If however the diagnostics/investigation things reveals the issues are not covered by the warranty, then it's you, the customer who is liable for paying those costs although in some cases the dealer (if it's the supplying dealer especially) will waive those costs to save upsetting you.
As an example, I was involved in a starting/immobiliser/remote central locking issue on a 6 months old Vivaro van. It was booked in and the receptionist incorrectly told the customer it was under warranty, no need to worry etc. 2hrs of diagnostics, investigation and removal of half the dash revealed a control unit and fuse box full of coffee. Rang the customer, explained that the issue was due to misuse and he went off at the deep end aas he'd been told and signed a job card say it was a warranty issue. Eventually the dealership had to 'absorb' the diagnostic costs although Renault refused to cover any repairs under warranty.
The flip side to that is in your case, ie as the customer, if you walk into a dealership with a car that is within manufacturers warranty and you're told that you could be liable for any investigation costs (which in this case, seems is what has happened) then you're going to be understandably annoyed and probably decline the work and end up on the phone to customer services. As the dealer you're using wasn't the supplying dealer, they're less likely to waive said costs too. The vast majority of the time everything is fine and the manufacturers warranty will pay all costs incurred but there are times when 'warranty' issues turn out to be nothing of the sort. Some dealers are stricter then others when it comes to controlling their costs. Again, I've worked in a few where the ammount of workshop hours that are being written off at month end are truely staggering. And written off hours are lost revenue and at £93 per hour, that rapidly adds up and with targets to meet and technicians efficiencies to keep as high as possible, it's little wonder some dealers can be very unhelpful when it comes to potential warranty issues.
My advice would be to pop in unannouced and ask if the workshop foreman/master-tech can come for a quick drive just to confirm the noises you're hearing and whilst on a test drive with him, point out the other issues 'off the record' as it were. If he hears the issues and feels they are something they need to check, get the car booked in there and then with him beside you to tell the front of house staff whet he feels needs investigated. The intermitant starting issue, that could prove difficult to pinpoint but offering to leave the car for a day or two and ask them to keep trying till the fault occurs could be the best option. Bear in mind, if a technician is 'officially' clocked onto your job then he's racking up time on your car and at the end of the day, someboidy needs to pay for that. Alot of the time the dealer can claim up to an hour from the manufacturer but anything more than that, they either need to have some answers or raise a concern with the technical department who may then authorise additional time for the dealer to check.
Ultimately, the dealer is the middle man... he's acting on behalf of you and also under instruction from the manufacturer, so something they are limited as to what they can and can't do. Not only is it frustrating for you, the customer but also for the dealership as they will want the issues solved and you away happy more than anything but sometimes they are restricted. It really is a minefield and certainly not as simple as some people assume, my best advice especially when it comes to random and irregular issues is to be patient and not kick off at the dealer. All that'll do is create a further issue, getting the dealer on side will be a huge help and it makes for less stress for all involved. Plus, the nice customers are so much better to deal with plus human nature dictates you'd rather help a nice person than a nasty one.
Hope you get it sorted, even if it means a run down the A90 at some stage.
As an example, I was involved in a starting/immobiliser/remote central locking issue on a 6 months old Vivaro van. It was booked in and the receptionist incorrectly told the customer it was under warranty, no need to worry etc. 2hrs of diagnostics, investigation and removal of half the dash revealed a control unit and fuse box full of coffee. Rang the customer, explained that the issue was due to misuse and he went off at the deep end aas he'd been told and signed a job card say it was a warranty issue. Eventually the dealership had to 'absorb' the diagnostic costs although Renault refused to cover any repairs under warranty.
The flip side to that is in your case, ie as the customer, if you walk into a dealership with a car that is within manufacturers warranty and you're told that you could be liable for any investigation costs (which in this case, seems is what has happened) then you're going to be understandably annoyed and probably decline the work and end up on the phone to customer services. As the dealer you're using wasn't the supplying dealer, they're less likely to waive said costs too. The vast majority of the time everything is fine and the manufacturers warranty will pay all costs incurred but there are times when 'warranty' issues turn out to be nothing of the sort. Some dealers are stricter then others when it comes to controlling their costs. Again, I've worked in a few where the ammount of workshop hours that are being written off at month end are truely staggering. And written off hours are lost revenue and at £93 per hour, that rapidly adds up and with targets to meet and technicians efficiencies to keep as high as possible, it's little wonder some dealers can be very unhelpful when it comes to potential warranty issues.
My advice would be to pop in unannouced and ask if the workshop foreman/master-tech can come for a quick drive just to confirm the noises you're hearing and whilst on a test drive with him, point out the other issues 'off the record' as it were. If he hears the issues and feels they are something they need to check, get the car booked in there and then with him beside you to tell the front of house staff whet he feels needs investigated. The intermitant starting issue, that could prove difficult to pinpoint but offering to leave the car for a day or two and ask them to keep trying till the fault occurs could be the best option. Bear in mind, if a technician is 'officially' clocked onto your job then he's racking up time on your car and at the end of the day, someboidy needs to pay for that. Alot of the time the dealer can claim up to an hour from the manufacturer but anything more than that, they either need to have some answers or raise a concern with the technical department who may then authorise additional time for the dealer to check.
Ultimately, the dealer is the middle man... he's acting on behalf of you and also under instruction from the manufacturer, so something they are limited as to what they can and can't do. Not only is it frustrating for you, the customer but also for the dealership as they will want the issues solved and you away happy more than anything but sometimes they are restricted. It really is a minefield and certainly not as simple as some people assume, my best advice especially when it comes to random and irregular issues is to be patient and not kick off at the dealer. All that'll do is create a further issue, getting the dealer on side will be a huge help and it makes for less stress for all involved. Plus, the nice customers are so much better to deal with plus human nature dictates you'd rather help a nice person than a nasty one.
Hope you get it sorted, even if it means a run down the A90 at some stage.
aw51 121565 said:
OP, if one googles "fiat 500 abarth aberdeen", this thread is fourth on the list. The current fifth placed link explains all as regards the name of the dealer 
(and 
).
edinburgh turns up this one (and ).http://www.arnoldclark.com/abarth/
hardcorehobbit said:
Might want to remove that, we're not supposed to talk about them by name.
sorry I wasn't naming and shamingI found an Abarth dealer in Edinburgh (& Glasgow) rather than Dundee which might help the OP
I said nothing either way about them just trying to be helpful.
Theres always Fiat Customer services to see if they will support the Dealer
Isn't it pretty standard that you have to pay for an inspection which diagnoses the issues? Mending them would then be covered by the warranty. They have to check that the faults are warranty faults before mending them, and they can't be expected to do that for free.
What I would expect, though, would be to pay their £93 per hour for the inspection, but if work is found which will be covered under warranty, THEN they refund the inspection fee.
What I would expect, though, would be to pay their £93 per hour for the inspection, but if work is found which will be covered under warranty, THEN they refund the inspection fee.
mrmr96 said:
Isn't it pretty standard that you have to pay for an inspection which diagnoses the issues? Mending them would then be covered by the warranty. They have to check that the faults are warranty faults before mending them, and they can't be expected to do that for free.
What I would expect, though, would be to pay their £93 per hour for the inspection, but if work is found which will be covered under warranty, THEN they refund the inspection fee.
I've never had to pay a penny for investigation of issues which led to warranty claims, or even those that didn't. This includes dealers having the car for 2-3 days to reproduce issues (most recently with Seat). What I would expect, though, would be to pay their £93 per hour for the inspection, but if work is found which will be covered under warranty, THEN they refund the inspection fee.
Doesn't help, but I'd be appalled in the OPs circumstances if the warranty meant paying for diagnostics, which lets face it is just a cable and reader/PC jobby.
rllmuk said:
Doesn't help, but I'd be appalled in the OPs circumstances if the warranty meant paying for diagnostics, which lets face it is just a cable and reader/PC jobby.
A cable and a reader/PC jobby can diagnose suspension creaks, wheel breaing noises, intermitant starting issues and an issue with the MW reception on the radio? Really?
Where do I get one of these machines, how much does it cost and will it also tell me why my missus is in the huff?
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