Wedge Performance..?
Discussion
Has a rolling road session ever been organized for us wedge owners in the past? I wouldn't mind going to one, as i get the feeling that some of us really have no idea what our true power and torque outputs are
I have seen the factory figures of 275bhp for the 400, this i feel is far from the truth though.
I used to take my old Cosworth to Power Engineering in Uxbridge, maybe we can organize something??
I'm certainly getting fed up with some of the lax power muppet mobiles sticking to my bumper..
(stever...got the mail, sorry for no reply just got back from hol's. Did the meet go ahead as weather was cr*p?).
>>> Edited by waynester on Thursday 12th August 08:34
I have seen the factory figures of 275bhp for the 400, this i feel is far from the truth though. I used to take my old Cosworth to Power Engineering in Uxbridge, maybe we can organize something??
I'm certainly getting fed up with some of the lax power muppet mobiles sticking to my bumper..
(stever...got the mail, sorry for no reply just got back from hol's. Did the meet go ahead as weather was cr*p?).
>>> Edited by waynester on Thursday 12th August 08:34
waynester said:
I have seen the factory figures of 275bhp for the 400.
The 275 figure is for the 390. The 400 was rated at 268. Both are generally thought to be about 230bhp on most people's calibration.
I'm not too sure what you would gain from a RR session if you only measure what you have. Options and possible gains are well documenmted on this site.
Yes but i'm sure all engines with age can fall away from their perfect rated power outputs?
I thought it would,
A: Be a good reason for a Wedge bash, and
B: At least demonstrate if you are getting the accepted normal number of ponies for said model?
I'm convinced mine is down on power, even though it runs fine. Also, V8's on rollers......would sound fantastic
>> Edited by waynester on Thursday 12th August 12:58
I thought it would,
A: Be a good reason for a Wedge bash, and
B: At least demonstrate if you are getting the accepted normal number of ponies for said model?
I'm convinced mine is down on power, even though it runs fine. Also, V8's on rollers......would sound fantastic
>> Edited by waynester on Thursday 12th August 12:58
waynester said:
I'm certainly getting fed up with some of the lax power muppet mobiles sticking to my bumper..
Try fitting some poly bushes & uprated springs & adjustable shocks to the beasty. Muppets wagons are invariably very average on the bendy bits....
Great Fun!!!
>> Edited by wedgeman on Thursday 12th August 13:25
Wayne.
How you doing.
The problem is as I and others found out when you have it checked out on RR they are all low on BHP, you get pi--ed off, and then go after the power, on mine I had Austec change airflow meter to 4.6 ltr one, moved position and moved filter to cleaner air, Silicon smooth inlet hose, Tornado chip,and rolling road tune, set up by Mark Adams.
Acheived
278.2 BHP @ flywheel.
220.3 BHP @ wheels.
292.1 lb ft torque.
It was much quicker and responsive, also had brakes and suspension replaced/ upgrade to handle extra power, all work wonderfully. Cost plenty, worth it? YES.
Just for info my mate had his Griff 500 RR at 240BHP and poxy torque,(book says I think 340BHP) his was running well, just been serviced by Dealer, Austec replaced injectors, air meter, Silicon inlet hose, chip, RR and Mark Adams fiddle, left with 295BHP 312ft lb torque and VERY BIG
: and £2.2K on his card, Oh and a 
wife.
Mine having bigger injectors and 38mm carbon trumpets soon.:
>> Edited by redcar on Thursday 12th August 15:42
How you doing.
The problem is as I and others found out when you have it checked out on RR they are all low on BHP, you get pi--ed off, and then go after the power, on mine I had Austec change airflow meter to 4.6 ltr one, moved position and moved filter to cleaner air, Silicon smooth inlet hose, Tornado chip,and rolling road tune, set up by Mark Adams.
Acheived
278.2 BHP @ flywheel.
220.3 BHP @ wheels.
292.1 lb ft torque.
It was much quicker and responsive, also had brakes and suspension replaced/ upgrade to handle extra power, all work wonderfully. Cost plenty, worth it? YES.
Just for info my mate had his Griff 500 RR at 240BHP and poxy torque,(book says I think 340BHP) his was running well, just been serviced by Dealer, Austec replaced injectors, air meter, Silicon inlet hose, chip, RR and Mark Adams fiddle, left with 295BHP 312ft lb torque and VERY BIG
: and £2.2K on his card, Oh and a wife. Mine having bigger injectors and 38mm carbon trumpets soon.
: >> Edited by redcar on Thursday 12th August 15:42
Would also be up for that, as would like to know if jag meter / injectors / larger plenum / lower trumpets on 4.5 bv is worth it Be nice to compare with a standard 4.5 - if there is such a thing nowadays
Might try and see if my brothers project of importing a drag RR setup is still going ahead this year as can apparently cope with 1000 bhp !!
If I can get over a 1/4 of that I'd be happy - for a while
You also need to make sure the rest of the car is up to spec like cooling / ignition / etc etc
Be nice to compare with a standard 4.5 - if there is such a thing nowadays Might try and see if my brothers project of importing a drag RR setup is still going ahead this year as can apparently cope with 1000 bhp !!
If I can get over a 1/4 of that I'd be happy - for a while
You also need to make sure the rest of the car is up to spec like cooling / ignition / etc etc
It would be good to make comparisons with sorted cars like your beast or even a flaming SEAC.....Rev? 
My standard 350i went on the rollers at Austec about 4 months ago.
I was over the moon at 170BHP at the wheels and 200ft/lbs of torque.
The test was enough to stop work in the majority of the units around them.
If you have never seen a test it is well worth watch, over 100mph and not moving with a brick wall not far infront of the car and 2 other TVR's between the your car and the wall!!!!!
I found it best watching other car being tested rather than mine. The best one was a Serria Cosworth which had to have 2 people in the boot to prevent wheel spin.
I would be happy to speak to Mike and Paul to try and arrange a date.
I was over the moon at 170BHP at the wheels and 200ft/lbs of torque.
The test was enough to stop work in the majority of the units around them.
If you have never seen a test it is well worth watch, over 100mph and not moving with a brick wall not far infront of the car and 2 other TVR's between the your car and the wall!!!!!
I found it best watching other car being tested rather than mine. The best one was a Serria Cosworth which had to have 2 people in the boot to prevent wheel spin.
I would be happy to speak to Mike and Paul to try and arrange a date.
Had my 400se on a RR last night in the middle of Tunbridge! Evening session something to do with annoying the brand new religion shop across the road - won't bore you with the reasons, but it seems to have stopped their Wednesday evening hallelujah sessions!
Saw a peak of 241 BHP at the wheels, which depending on what you add for transmission losses, say 20%, is 300 at the flywheel. On the same rollers 3 years ago it gave 244 at the wheels. Thats with a 4.3 BV, upped compression, running on MOTEC. Tried to get Austec to do it a few weeks back, but they didn't have access to the proper leads for the ECU. Mind you, when I turned up last night, there was a mk3 Eskie grass tracker with no silencing being given the works (100BHP!) which made mine sound very quiet. Surprised windows wern't breaking.
Saw a peak of 241 BHP at the wheels, which depending on what you add for transmission losses, say 20%, is 300 at the flywheel. On the same rollers 3 years ago it gave 244 at the wheels. Thats with a 4.3 BV, upped compression, running on MOTEC. Tried to get Austec to do it a few weeks back, but they didn't have access to the proper leads for the ECU. Mind you, when I turned up last night, there was a mk3 Eskie grass tracker with no silencing being given the works (100BHP!) which made mine sound very quiet. Surprised windows wern't breaking.
dickymint said:
I'd be up for that. Another good reason to get a load of Wedgers together. Is there such a thing as a mobile rolling road for next years BBWF?
There is such a thing as a portible RR
I have some details for the chap that runs it, ill dig them out and post them soon
Campbell
ps ive seen it in action and it can handle 4x4 cars too, very smart
redcar said:
Wayne.
Acheived
278.2 BHP @ flywheel.
220.3 BHP @ wheels.
292.1 lb ft torque.
Mine having bigger injectors and 38mm carbon trumpets soon.
>> Edited by redcar on Thursday 12th August 15:42
Martin - when you have your latest changes - any chance you can get them to do a comparison run after bits fitted then another with Marks tweeks ... interested to know if those mods needs MA tweeks..
Can the new injectors fitted without remapping and still give gains !
rev-erend said:
redcar said:
Acheived
278.2 BHP @ flywheel.
220.3 BHP @ wheels.
292.1 lb ft torque.
Mine having bigger injectors and 38mm carbon trumpets soon.
>> Edited by redcar on Thursday 12th August 15:42
Martin - when you have your latest changes - any chance you can get them to do a comparison run after bits fitted then another with Marks tweeks ... interested to know if those mods needs MA tweeks..
Can the new injectors fitted without remapping and still give gains !
Alan.
Mark has to remap after injectors because the injector spray pattern is much shorter and finer and therefore all the fuel burns in chamber, Mark reduces petrol flow as not as much petrol is needed due to smaller mist, so yes MA tweeks are required.
For the full tecky Mark Adams version as he explained to me.
It is important to get the petrol to mist into very small modules, as when they burn the modules burn from the outside in, the smaller the module the more chance of a complete petrol burn and full energy/power from each module of fuel. If the modules are "normal" size the whole module may not burn in the chamber and therefore energy/power is wasted.Also the new injectors mist the fuel whereas the original injectors create a jet spray, he put both types into the test rig to prove this fact and the differance in the pattern is amazing
If Mark reads this perhaps he will go into more detail and explain it fully as he goes into F1 practices and theorys, I got lost after "It is Important"
:
Sounds like your being tempted to the injectors. People I know who have had them just go on & on about the smoothness of the engine.
See you Wednesday with bits.
Martin
>> Edited by redcar on Friday 13th August 12:44
>> Edited by redcar on Friday 13th August 13:09
Martin .. I fully understand .. better atomisation of fuel .. needs less fuel for same power, otherwise overrich mixture - bores washed of oil etc... hence a remap needed to supply less fuel for given throttle angle.
Got it.
When is your car next booked in to Austec to have the work done ?
Got it.
When is your car next booked in to Austec to have the work done ?
rev-erend said:
Martin .. I fully understand .. better atomisation of fuel .. needs less fuel for same power, otherwise overrich mixture - bores washed of oil etc... hence a remap needed to supply less fuel for given throttle angle.
Got it.
When is your car next booked in to Austec to have the work done ?
If Mike ever phones back to say trumpets are available should be 25th August, but its like waiting for paint to dry.
Correct ref RR's. They vary. Only true test is on a VCA approved engine dyno. - Silly dosh!
My test is on feel. Had many Wedges and always felt stock 400's felt weedie - prefered the feel of a stock 350 (all about size & power to weight)- IMHO of course.
When selling the 420 SEAC I had several(3) ex-Griff 500 owners have a go in it(one bought it). They all thought the engine performance and pick up was staggeringly good and blitzed their 500's. I guess it could be the Standard fit stage 4 heads ( a few SEAC's had them) and the standard wild cam.
What's it all mean? Figures are all well and good but it's about weather the car feels good to the driver - IMHO - Having said that a day at the Dyno for Wedges would be fun provided it isn't a bigg willy/HP contest which is the Max power way
TaS
My test is on feel. Had many Wedges and always felt stock 400's felt weedie - prefered the feel of a stock 350 (all about size & power to weight)- IMHO of course.
When selling the 420 SEAC I had several(3) ex-Griff 500 owners have a go in it(one bought it). They all thought the engine performance and pick up was staggeringly good and blitzed their 500's. I guess it could be the Standard fit stage 4 heads ( a few SEAC's had them) and the standard wild cam.
What's it all mean? Figures are all well and good but it's about weather the car feels good to the driver - IMHO - Having said that a day at the Dyno for Wedges would be fun provided it isn't a bigg willy/HP contest which is the Max power way
TaS
tasmania said:
Correct ref RR's. They vary. Only true test is on a VCA approved engine dyno. - Silly dosh!
My test is on feel. Had many Wedges and always felt stock 400's felt weedie - prefered the feel of a stock 350 (all about size & power to weight)- IMHO of course.
When selling the 420 SEAC I had several(3) ex-Griff 500 owners have a go in it(one bought it). They all thought the engine performance and pick up was staggeringly good and blitzed their 500's. I guess it could be the Standard fit stage 4 heads ( a few SEAC's had them) and the standard wild cam.
What's it all mean? Figures are all well and good but it's about weather the car feels good to the driver - IMHO - Having said that a day at the Dyno for Wedges would be fun provided it isn't a bigg willy/HP contest which is the Max power way
TaS
Tas.
Everybody knows us wedge owners have small willys.
:Gassing Station | Wedges | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff