Running Tempriture
Discussion
What does yours run at? And how long does it take to get there?
If i end up hitting a motorway from cold it will get up to 60 degrees and stay there.
If i then stop, it will get up to 90 before the fans kick it, re-join the motorway and it will then sit just under 90.
I put a new thermostat and coolant in it a couple weeks ago, and all fluids seem stable with no air in them.
60 seems a little on the cool side to me, is there any chance of engine damage if i keep on running like this?
If i end up hitting a motorway from cold it will get up to 60 degrees and stay there.
If i then stop, it will get up to 90 before the fans kick it, re-join the motorway and it will then sit just under 90.
I put a new thermostat and coolant in it a couple weeks ago, and all fluids seem stable with no air in them.
60 seems a little on the cool side to me, is there any chance of engine damage if i keep on running like this?
If I drop onto a dual carriageway from cold the car will get to just north of 70 degrees and stay there until I hit traffic where it rises to 90. Once the temperature gets to a few degrees above 90 the fans kick in and drop it back to just under 90. If I drive onto the usual selection of A and B roads with traffic it gets to 90.
Once fully warm it stays at 90, or just over, and is kept there by the fans regardless of traffic, throttle abuse and stop start driving.
Once fully warm it stays at 90, or just over, and is kept there by the fans regardless of traffic, throttle abuse and stop start driving.
This has been discussed recently:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=118...
Basically, TVR decided not to use the existing temperature sender and plumbed their own in. Unfortunately, the TVR sender sits in a bit of a dead spot with poor water circulation, which means it often doesn't accurately show the temperature of the water flowing through the block.
The ECU doesn't use this temperature sender; instead it uses a sender next to the one that would have provided the temperature gauge reading had TVR left it alone. So at least the fuel mixture is chosen on the basis of an accurate engine temperature.
Some people advocate the "Range Rover mod", whereby you use the other sender instead. This is reported to give much quicker and more stable readings, but I'm not 100% convinced: the problem highlighted in the thread I've linked to is that the Range Rover sender only seems to give sensible readings up to about 85 degrees - beyond that, it doesn't respond in the same linear fashion. To me, that poses too much of a question mark over whether the Range Rover sender would warn you of an engine that's about to boil.
If there were a way of swapping the senders, such that the thermistor in the TVR sender sits in the same location as the Range Rover one, then I'd do it in a heartbeat. But I assume that's not possible, otherwise surely someone would have done it?
I've still got the standard TVR sender, and I also see similar behaviour (though it's not usually as low as 60). On a cold winter morning, it will often not get above about 70 to 80 unless I stop for a while, in which case it'll go up to 90 and the fans kick in shortly thereafter. In fact, as the engine is warming up I often notice the fans kicking in when the gauge is still down at about 70 or so - I oftern wonder if this is the moment the thermostat is opening for the first time, and a blast of hot water goes past the otter switch.
I never normally see anything above about 95. Mind you, it should be noted that mine has aircon, so there is an additional heat exchanger between the engine and the outside world. This will tend to raise the under-bonnet temperature slightly and reduce the chilling effect that causes the TVR gauge to under-read.
It should also be noted that the above is all purely hypothetical because my car is still stuck in a Parisian junk-yard at the moment.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=118...
Basically, TVR decided not to use the existing temperature sender and plumbed their own in. Unfortunately, the TVR sender sits in a bit of a dead spot with poor water circulation, which means it often doesn't accurately show the temperature of the water flowing through the block.
The ECU doesn't use this temperature sender; instead it uses a sender next to the one that would have provided the temperature gauge reading had TVR left it alone. So at least the fuel mixture is chosen on the basis of an accurate engine temperature.
Some people advocate the "Range Rover mod", whereby you use the other sender instead. This is reported to give much quicker and more stable readings, but I'm not 100% convinced: the problem highlighted in the thread I've linked to is that the Range Rover sender only seems to give sensible readings up to about 85 degrees - beyond that, it doesn't respond in the same linear fashion. To me, that poses too much of a question mark over whether the Range Rover sender would warn you of an engine that's about to boil.
If there were a way of swapping the senders, such that the thermistor in the TVR sender sits in the same location as the Range Rover one, then I'd do it in a heartbeat. But I assume that's not possible, otherwise surely someone would have done it?
I've still got the standard TVR sender, and I also see similar behaviour (though it's not usually as low as 60). On a cold winter morning, it will often not get above about 70 to 80 unless I stop for a while, in which case it'll go up to 90 and the fans kick in shortly thereafter. In fact, as the engine is warming up I often notice the fans kicking in when the gauge is still down at about 70 or so - I oftern wonder if this is the moment the thermostat is opening for the first time, and a blast of hot water goes past the otter switch.
I never normally see anything above about 95. Mind you, it should be noted that mine has aircon, so there is an additional heat exchanger between the engine and the outside world. This will tend to raise the under-bonnet temperature slightly and reduce the chilling effect that causes the TVR gauge to under-read.
It should also be noted that the above is all purely hypothetical because my car is still stuck in a Parisian junk-yard at the moment.
Edited by Dr Mike Oxgreen on Monday 13th August 15:15
I agree with Dr Mike - with the exception that mine actually does go down to between 70 and 75 if I get back on the motorway after getting up to 90 in traffic. It never goes above about 92 in any circs. Fans cut in around 90. Just been into Cambridge and back - heard the fans in the multi-storey.
what sort of temperature do you think it takes to do any damage?
mine got really hot this weekend, reading over 100 on gauge (which is a new gauge and sender). it seems the fans aren't working i have to use the manual switch, i'm just leaving them on constantly and temp settles to about 85'C?
mine got really hot this weekend, reading over 100 on gauge (which is a new gauge and sender). it seems the fans aren't working i have to use the manual switch, i'm just leaving them on constantly and temp settles to about 85'C?
I had the same concerns with my 450, with a low ambient temp, mine would only reach about 65 but would be warmer if sitting ticking over or left and restarted but still produced a toastie heater. Changed the stat, flushed and new coolant and hoses, still ran the same, checked with a laser thermometer but its difficult to get a good reading just after driving. I dont worry about it now, during this last hot spell it will cruise at 70/80mph and with an ambient of 25 to 27 degrees the gauge will read around the 80 mark, as the ambient drops, say a late evening summer drive the gauge acts accordingly and drops. In standing traffic the temp rises to 90 and the fans kick in, recently I was waiting in convoy at the Poole meeting with a gauge reading over 100 but with no ill effects.
I think sometimes we can get too tied up with the odities of TVR's, mine can return over 30 mph on a run so cant be running too rich thro low engine temp enrichment , so long as it doesnt overheat or lose water Im a happy bunny
HTH
Richard
I think sometimes we can get too tied up with the odities of TVR's, mine can return over 30 mph on a run so cant be running too rich thro low engine temp enrichment , so long as it doesnt overheat or lose water Im a happy bunny
HTH
Richard
After my confident post earlier, I had a shock this evening (20 degrees, cloudy). My route home was 45 miles.
15 miles up the dual carriageway A11 and the temp was around 85. Up the slip road at Newmarket, hit a five minute queue.
Looked at the temp gauge as I got to the front of the queue, it read 120!!!
I carried on and over the next 15 miles at 50-60 it cooled to about 95, then I stopped to shop for 20 minutes.
Rest of the way home it was 80-90.
Fans were cutting in as normal at 90. What's going on???
15 miles up the dual carriageway A11 and the temp was around 85. Up the slip road at Newmarket, hit a five minute queue.
Looked at the temp gauge as I got to the front of the queue, it read 120!!!
I carried on and over the next 15 miles at 50-60 it cooled to about 95, then I stopped to shop for 20 minutes.
Rest of the way home it was 80-90.
Fans were cutting in as normal at 90. What's going on???
120? Yikes!
Never seen mine over 95, its a constant low running temperature that i was concerned about, bore wash and oil not getting hot enough to do its thing.. etc...
As for 120 on the temp gauge, maby your fans weren't cutting in for a bit? Or perhaps you have a sticky thermostat?
I get the feeling that perhaps the first thing to eliminate would be the dodgy temp gauge and retro fit a digital one?
Never seen mine over 95, its a constant low running temperature that i was concerned about, bore wash and oil not getting hot enough to do its thing.. etc...
As for 120 on the temp gauge, maby your fans weren't cutting in for a bit? Or perhaps you have a sticky thermostat?
I get the feeling that perhaps the first thing to eliminate would be the dodgy temp gauge and retro fit a digital one?
I think we should be realistic about the usefulness of the dash gauges. When familiar with the car, you know what their normal behaviour is like (which for the coolant temp gauge is pretty much as per the above posts); when there is a sudden change from those normal patterns, you know it's time to take action. The absolute numbers don't really matter; what matters is that when the coolant temp gauge normally doesn't go above 90, you don't let it go up to 120 before switching off the engine and investigating!
If you have a problem that needs investigating, you'd stick a temperature probe in the 'right' place and take the readings from that while running the engine...
If you have a problem that needs investigating, you'd stick a temperature probe in the 'right' place and take the readings from that while running the engine...
Well, in your case it must've been a fluke of some sort as I can't for the life of me imagine the temp reaching those heights until long after a James Bondesque smoke screen had started to appear from under the bonnet, nor the engine running any good after the event - but it does need investigating PDQ!
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