Running Winter Tyres all year - how many miles?
Discussion
As the title really. Wondered if anyone on here who had run a set of winter tyres all year round could tell me what they were and how many miles they got out of them before they needed to be replaced?
I've got a set on and calculate it'll be cheaper to just run the winters all year and replace when needed than buy some more summers. I'm aware of the disadvantages of running them in the summer etc etc but am really only interested to know how they wore from people who've done this. I only do about 6k per annum and they're on a slow car lol. I don't need them to make a hairpin bend at 90mph on a sunny day in 38 degree heat.
I've got a set on and calculate it'll be cheaper to just run the winters all year and replace when needed than buy some more summers. I'm aware of the disadvantages of running them in the summer etc etc but am really only interested to know how they wore from people who've done this. I only do about 6k per annum and they're on a slow car lol. I don't need them to make a hairpin bend at 90mph on a sunny day in 38 degree heat.
I ran a set of winters from Southampton, through Italy to Yambol in Bulgaria last summer and they did alright. Grip levels were poor compared to a good summer tyre, but certainly no worse than a budget one; I think they lost about 1mm of tread in nearly 3000 miles at an average of about 35 degrees C.
I've got a set of winters (Linglong Winter Heros) on my MX5 and even with the welded diff and turbo it looks like I'll be getting a solid 10k miles out of the rears. With an open diff I'd expect twice that (welded diffs eat tyres).
Dry grip in summer is more than enough to keep up with traffic, handling is "amusing" and compared to the R1Rs I used last summer the tramlining has vanished entirely. The car is more fun with them, but I'll be getting some more suitable tyres for it now it has an MOT again.
Dry grip in summer is more than enough to keep up with traffic, handling is "amusing" and compared to the R1Rs I used last summer the tramlining has vanished entirely. The car is more fun with them, but I'll be getting some more suitable tyres for it now it has an MOT again.
Liquid Tuna said:
I only do about 6k per annum and they're on a slow car lol.
I put winter's (Michelin Alpin's) on wifey's Honda Jazz last year and have left them on.I drive the car quite a bit for local use (short trips don't suit my diesel auto Merc) and within the realms of what you'd normally do in a Honda Jazz, they're absolutely fine and aren't showing any noticeable wear.
A number of people on the Merc forums run winter's year round and reckon they get better mileage out of them than summer tyres.
You can get pretty well regarded all season tyres now - Kleber Quadraxer, for example. Goodyear do one too, but I forget its name.
Ok thanks. I'd considered All Season tyres as an alternative, but I'm specifically interested in tyre grip in the snow. I'd guess the All season's wouldn't be anywhere near as good in the snow as winters, but I can't find anyone who's run both winters and all seasons and driven both in snow to be able to give an accurate assessment of how much worse the all seasons are (unless anyone on here has?). I only have experience of driving winters in the snow and they were nothing short of fantastic compared to summers, as you'd expect.
Having been impressed with their dry performance in warmer temperatures, I ended up running the Nokian WR D3s on the Caddy throughout the summer this year. Given it's heavy diesel lump up front and that it's frequently loaded in the back, the skinny 175 tyres have coped admirably losing about 3mm off the fronts and 1mm off the back tyres over a 12 month period. Granted, the leading edges of the sipes look a little rounded on the front tyres now, but I'd be surprised if their snow abilities were hampered overly by this.
Despite being sold as a winter tyre, the WR D3s do have "All Season Plus" written on their sidewalls - all season being a relative term, yet they're still one of the leading friction winter tyres in the snow.
When pushing on, I've found that introducing a small degree of steering lock prior to the turn in point "primes" the tyres ready for the corner and eliminates the slight feeling of vagueness on turn in that winter tyres generate. Through the turn they then feel nicely planted, if lacking on ultimate grip levels versus a summer tyre.
I've really not felt the need to change to summer tyres at all on it. If I was concerned about missing out on the nth percentage of performance in good driving conditions I just remind myself that I'd do better to just take out some of the
from the back of the van 
Despite being sold as a winter tyre, the WR D3s do have "All Season Plus" written on their sidewalls - all season being a relative term, yet they're still one of the leading friction winter tyres in the snow.
When pushing on, I've found that introducing a small degree of steering lock prior to the turn in point "primes" the tyres ready for the corner and eliminates the slight feeling of vagueness on turn in that winter tyres generate. Through the turn they then feel nicely planted, if lacking on ultimate grip levels versus a summer tyre.
I've really not felt the need to change to summer tyres at all on it. If I was concerned about missing out on the nth percentage of performance in good driving conditions I just remind myself that I'd do better to just take out some of the
from the back of the van Probably tough to make an accurate comparison anyway - you'd have to try both on the same car in the same conditions etc.
If winter tyres work OK for you then stay with them. I've noticed in the very heavy rain we've had over some recent days that our winter tyre'd car feels imperious even on noticeable surface water.
The snag I see is timing the replacements - you don't want to be going to winter with the tyres on their last legs. Where legally required, they don't even count as winter tyres once worn to 4mm (there's another set of treadwear indicators at 4mm).
If winter tyres work OK for you then stay with them. I've noticed in the very heavy rain we've had over some recent days that our winter tyre'd car feels imperious even on noticeable surface water.
The snag I see is timing the replacements - you don't want to be going to winter with the tyres on their last legs. Where legally required, they don't even count as winter tyres once worn to 4mm (there's another set of treadwear indicators at 4mm).
Captain Muppet said:
(Linglong Winter Heros)
Just had a PM about these asking about how they were in snow. They were good in snow, maybe as good as the Bridgestone and Toyo winters I've used on the same car. With these on my MX5 was happy at 30mph in 6 inches of new snow and was the default choice for winter transport (as it has a cage and dented body work aready).Mrs Muppet's Civic has a set on it's spare wheels for winter use.
I've no idea if they are good tyres, but they certainly don't seem to be bad at anything on either of our cars. They did take a bit of bedding in though - it was maybe a couple of hundred miles before they started to grip.
Captain Muppet said:
Captain Muppet said:
(Linglong Winter Heros)
Just had a PM about these asking about how they were in snow. They were good in snow, maybe as good as the Bridgestone and Toyo winters I've used on the same car. With these on my MX5 was happy at 30mph in 6 inches of new snow and was the default choice for winter transport (as it has a cage and dented body work aready).Mrs Muppet's Civic has a set on it's spare wheels for winter use.
I've no idea if they are good tyres, but they certainly don't seem to be bad at anything on either of our cars. They did take a bit of bedding in though - it was maybe a couple of hundred miles before they started to grip.
That certainly echos my experience with Fulda winter tyres, which are actually a pretty decent mid range brand.
jon- said:
Captain Muppet said:
Captain Muppet said:
(Linglong Winter Heros)
Just had a PM about these asking about how they were in snow. They were good in snow, maybe as good as the Bridgestone and Toyo winters I've used on the same car. With these on my MX5 was happy at 30mph in 6 inches of new snow and was the default choice for winter transport (as it has a cage and dented body work aready).Mrs Muppet's Civic has a set on it's spare wheels for winter use.
I've no idea if they are good tyres, but they certainly don't seem to be bad at anything on either of our cars. They did take a bit of bedding in though - it was maybe a couple of hundred miles before they started to grip.
That certainly echos my experience with Fulda winter tyres, which are actually a pretty decent mid range brand.
Until then they'll have to take my word for it that grip is OK in the wet, not as good as new Toyo T1Rs (which I liked in the wet and hated in the dry) but better than T1Rs with only a couple of mm of tread left (which I found hilariously short of wet grip, just before replacing them with the Linglongs).
It is entirely possible that I drive like a girl/carefully, which would entirely mask the dreadfulness of my tyres.
but they are down to the wear bars now. I've done about 20-25k on Dunlop Winter Sport M3's on my e46 320d. I ran them last winter, half of last summer and didn't bother changing them this year as two of my all seasons were rubbish (mismatched, slow punctures) and I haven't had spare cash to replace them.
They still have some left left, although rears are getting close to needed changed. I rotated them after their first winter but that was almost 20k ago! Fuel economy seems to be about the same. I run them at a relatively high pressure - usually at the full load spec regardless of load. My miles are probably 50-60% motorway and the rest A/B and town roads.
Handling is about inequivalent to semi-crap all seasons / 3 seasons. They can get a bit unsure feeling on wet, greasy roads but feel fine in standing water / drenched roads. But it still is nowhere near as good as proper tyres for warm(er) conditions.
But to be honest I wouldn't recommend it, unless you want an year forget about it and drive tyre and don't have the space for messing about with two sets of wheels (or won't keep the car long enough wear through two sets of tyres). If you can justify the cost of two sets of good quality tyres it is much better to have dedicated winter and summer tyres.
They still have some left left, although rears are getting close to needed changed. I rotated them after their first winter but that was almost 20k ago! Fuel economy seems to be about the same. I run them at a relatively high pressure - usually at the full load spec regardless of load. My miles are probably 50-60% motorway and the rest A/B and town roads.
Handling is about inequivalent to semi-crap all seasons / 3 seasons. They can get a bit unsure feeling on wet, greasy roads but feel fine in standing water / drenched roads. But it still is nowhere near as good as proper tyres for warm(er) conditions.
But to be honest I wouldn't recommend it, unless you want an year forget about it and drive tyre and don't have the space for messing about with two sets of wheels (or won't keep the car long enough wear through two sets of tyres). If you can justify the cost of two sets of good quality tyres it is much better to have dedicated winter and summer tyres.
Edited by clunkbox on Tuesday 28th August 17:28
Had Quatrac 3's fitted to my other half's Corsa and got about 18k miles out of the set. Have just changed them (at 2-3mm) ready for autum/winter.
Went for Hankook Optimo 4S's this time because I couldn't easily get hold of the Quatracs and the Optimo's seem to get as good reviews. I'd hope to get a little more mileage out of this set though.
All seasons are the perfect tyre for her circumstances as she lives in the country (commutes v.early in the morning across open moorland) so the roads are often covered in ice/snow during winter and running water/mud/cow st for the rest of the year.
Handling wise - I couldn't tell the differance when we first went to all seasons but then again it's an "ecoflex" diesel Corsa so not exactly pin sharp anyway. Braking feels very good in all conditions, and she never once complained about skidding or getting stuck during the last 2 winters.
Went for Hankook Optimo 4S's this time because I couldn't easily get hold of the Quatracs and the Optimo's seem to get as good reviews. I'd hope to get a little more mileage out of this set though.
All seasons are the perfect tyre for her circumstances as she lives in the country (commutes v.early in the morning across open moorland) so the roads are often covered in ice/snow during winter and running water/mud/cow s
t for the rest of the year. Handling wise - I couldn't tell the differance when we first went to all seasons but then again it's an "ecoflex" diesel Corsa so not exactly pin sharp anyway. Braking feels very good in all conditions, and she never once complained about skidding or getting stuck during the last 2 winters.
Edited by swanny71 on Tuesday 28th August 17:52
jon- said:
Goodyear Vector 4Seaons. There's also the Bridgestone A001 and Vredestein Quatrac 3.
Many people reporting good mileage from their winters on tyrereviews, the decision for me would be whether I'd be happy with the potential sub standard grip.
Add the Kleber Quadraxers to that list.Many people reporting good mileage from their winters on tyrereviews, the decision for me would be whether I'd be happy with the potential sub standard grip.
Currently the OHs Volvo V70 is running 17" Quadraxers - these were the winter tyres from her old Merc which have already done two winters and were fitted to her "new" Volvo in April. They give no drama whatsoever, and in fact because the weather has been so bad (a perma-deluge in Lancashire) the superior wet weather performance actually makes them very good sense. Tread is looking ok but come mid November I'll put the less worn rears onto the front. Should get another year from them then, no problem, and have the best traction for the coming winter.
Got the Goodyear Vector 4 Season things o my C1 VTR+ runabout - they're *miles* better than the awful plastic Michelin eco-ditchfinders it came with (replaced within days of getting the car); it is a total hoot to drive, very grippy. Wear is not really visible, but then again the car weighs about as much as a pea.
ETA: to the poster above - IMO the quality "all-season" tyres listed above make better sense than a dedicated full-winter tyre. Technology has come a long way and I've yet to get stuck or have a skid on the hilly roads round here. Pulling to a stop from speed on packed snow is the weirdest thing; a lifetime of expecting to simply whiz frictionlessly onwards, or end up on fire, upside down in a ditch crying for my mum, to simply pull up feels quite odd.
Edited by Dog Star on Tuesday 28th August 19:27
My wife had Avon Ice Touring on her diesel A6 for a winter and I didn't get around to changing them (as her summers were worn) so she used them all summer and the following winter.
Covered approx 20k and they were down to 4mm.
She drives fairly slowly.
When I drove the car the only issue I noticed was they'd squeal easier on hard cornering indicating less grip but they weren't a problem and I drive quickly (albeit it a 130 diesel Audi is not exactly a supercar)
Covered approx 20k and they were down to 4mm.
She drives fairly slowly.
When I drove the car the only issue I noticed was they'd squeal easier on hard cornering indicating less grip but they weren't a problem and I drive quickly (albeit it a 130 diesel Audi is not exactly a supercar)
Liquid Tuna said:
I'd considered All Season tyres as an alternative, but I'm specifically interested in tyre grip in the snow. I'd guess the All season's wouldn't be anywhere near as good in the snow as winters
All seasons are my tyres of choice in england, since our temperature hardly ever gets into the range were summers are really called for. I do spend some time in greece, and when its 40 degrees all summer they are the tyres you want. Last winter the all seasons did a decent job of the snow, way better than summers would. I only ever used proper snows in switzerland and its compulsory there so we didn't really have the chance to compare directly.
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