997 GT3 - its got me! Arrghh
Discussion
Hi guys
Brief intro bear with me... 28 years old, until last year never had any car worth more than 3k and nothing properly fast. My dream car is / was an e46 M3 and last year after years of saving I finally achieved the dream and bought my M3 CS: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I originally was going to use the M3 as a daily drive but the CS does feel pretty special and almost too special to pootle to and from work so I have ended up using it as a weekend car.
I have always absolutely loved Porsches. More so than Ferrari or Aston Martin I dont know what it is I have always had a real thing for them.
Earlier this year I took the CS to VMAX Carbon - what an experience. I was lucky enough to get a passenger ride in a 997 Porsche GT3. The guys name was Tom (top bloke but I hate you
) and his car was literally my perfect car. It was a Black 997 GT3 with full Akrapovic exhaust system with Clubsport package (I think apologies if incorrect). It absolutely blew me away. The way it went round the corners on the way back from the run was truly astonishing. The handling, the noise, the handling and of course the handling 
It has left a lasting impression on me and has changed my future car aspirations.
Before VMAX I was always looking to move from the CS to an e60 M5. Really just because of that engine and I do love my //M cars. However for me having had the CS for 9 months personally going heavier is not the way to go. The CS with 1/4 tank of fuel with just me feels fantastic, sharp and really potent. Stick a full tank and two extra people in and it feels completely different, blunted I suppose. Weight is king not power!
So as a result now I have my heart absolutely set on a 997 GT3.
A few questions of which your answers will hopefully talk me out of ruining my life chasing a 70k supercar! (Thanks Tom)
1. The CS is a very capable car on 'real' roads. The GT3 made the CS feel pretty soft but on the roads with lots of bumps and the CS copes fantastically well and gets the power down whilst giving you complete confidence. What is the GT3 like on normal roads?
2. The CS is a real license loser. It just is asking to be driven and just doesn't feel right driving around at slow speeds (very subjective I know). Does the GT3 feel 'special' driving around at normal speeds?
3. Are there any alternatives? How do Caterhams compare or Atoms? I'm not really bothered about comfort, MPG or running costs to an extent as it will be a weekend car. Reliability is important to me though.
4. Is the RS worth the extra? Personally I think the GT3 looks much better than the RS. Are there any must have GT3 extras?
5. I have reasonably wide shoulders and was slightly too wide for the bucket seats on Tom's car. What are the standard seats like? I absolutely love and must have the 'hugged' bucket seat feel.
Just any other thoughts / experiences / advice would be great. Anyone's thoughts who has come from an M3 (particularly CS) would also be much appreciated.
Tom if your on here I have posted a couple of photos of your car hope you don't mind. Thanks again for the passenger ride it was absolutely epic
Sorry for the long post.
Cheers
James
Brief intro bear with me... 28 years old, until last year never had any car worth more than 3k and nothing properly fast. My dream car is / was an e46 M3 and last year after years of saving I finally achieved the dream and bought my M3 CS: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I originally was going to use the M3 as a daily drive but the CS does feel pretty special and almost too special to pootle to and from work so I have ended up using it as a weekend car.
I have always absolutely loved Porsches. More so than Ferrari or Aston Martin I dont know what it is I have always had a real thing for them.
Earlier this year I took the CS to VMAX Carbon - what an experience. I was lucky enough to get a passenger ride in a 997 Porsche GT3. The guys name was Tom (top bloke but I hate you
) and his car was literally my perfect car. It was a Black 997 GT3 with full Akrapovic exhaust system with Clubsport package (I think apologies if incorrect). It absolutely blew me away. The way it went round the corners on the way back from the run was truly astonishing. The handling, the noise, the handling and of course the handling It has left a lasting impression on me and has changed my future car aspirations.Before VMAX I was always looking to move from the CS to an e60 M5. Really just because of that engine and I do love my //M cars. However for me having had the CS for 9 months personally going heavier is not the way to go. The CS with 1/4 tank of fuel with just me feels fantastic, sharp and really potent. Stick a full tank and two extra people in and it feels completely different, blunted I suppose. Weight is king not power!
So as a result now I have my heart absolutely set on a 997 GT3.
A few questions of which your answers will hopefully talk me out of ruining my life chasing a 70k supercar! (Thanks Tom)
1. The CS is a very capable car on 'real' roads. The GT3 made the CS feel pretty soft but on the roads with lots of bumps and the CS copes fantastically well and gets the power down whilst giving you complete confidence. What is the GT3 like on normal roads?
2. The CS is a real license loser. It just is asking to be driven and just doesn't feel right driving around at slow speeds (very subjective I know). Does the GT3 feel 'special' driving around at normal speeds?
3. Are there any alternatives? How do Caterhams compare or Atoms? I'm not really bothered about comfort, MPG or running costs to an extent as it will be a weekend car. Reliability is important to me though.
4. Is the RS worth the extra? Personally I think the GT3 looks much better than the RS. Are there any must have GT3 extras?
5. I have reasonably wide shoulders and was slightly too wide for the bucket seats on Tom's car. What are the standard seats like? I absolutely love and must have the 'hugged' bucket seat feel.
Just any other thoughts / experiences / advice would be great. Anyone's thoughts who has come from an M3 (particularly CS) would also be much appreciated.
Tom if your on here I have posted a couple of photos of your car hope you don't mind. Thanks again for the passenger ride it was absolutely epic
Sorry for the long post.
Cheers
James
Now I'm thinking I need to get an akrapovic !
Look at the choice!
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=gt3+rs+3.8+akrapo...
Look at the choice!
http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=gt3+rs+3.8+akrapo...
3. You cant really compare a GT3 to a caterham. A caterham is like slipping on a glove, its like theres no car there ... no sense of inertia, no car to grapple with, braking is instant, agility through tight sections is off the scale ... It is an experience that is visceral and vivid in a way that no other regular tintop can get close to. They are very easy to drive and a hell of a lot of fun but not as rewarding or technical as a good GT3, very different driving styles.
Every petrolhead should do BOTH at some point imo. They are both up there as two of the greatest motoring experiences out there.
Every petrolhead should do BOTH at some point imo. They are both up there as two of the greatest motoring experiences out there.
..I went CS to 997GT3... after 2 years developing the M3 for track work, keep going and get the '7.3', they really are a special car, with strong residuals.., not a relaxing daily driver IMO, unless you like a challenge..! as a weekender + hoon car, excellent..
Run a 2/4/S/TT as a daily they are perfect for the job and can clear speed bumps and car park ramps..
Run a 2/4/S/TT as a daily they are perfect for the job and can clear speed bumps and car park ramps..
justin220 said:
Have you thought about an Exige V6?
If you want a part track part fast road car then this is the one IMO. It will set a new standard in combining both duties and will be pretty much peerless for performing both roles so well.I would love to try one on cct when they come out and i cant wait to see what sort of times they can managed. The elise based chassis is very very quick and with a lomger wheelbase, a stonking power to weight they should be up with RS 3.8, 458 sort of times.
jackal said:
justin220 said:
Have you thought about an Exige V6?
If you want a part track part fast road car then this is the one IMO. It will set a new standard in combining both duties and will be pretty much peerless for performing both roles so well.I would love to try one on cct when they come out and i cant wait to see what sort of times they can managed. The elise based chassis is very very quick and with a lomger wheelbase, a stonking power to weight they should be up with RS 3.8, 458 sort of times.
You might as well put £25K on the BBQ..
Edited by RatBoy M3CSL on Sunday 16th September 11:08
HI, WENT FROM M3 E46 TO GT3 997 ALTHOUGH HAD 996 GT3 AS WELL. WEIGHT IS THE KEY AS YOU INDICATED
4TH GEAR 997 152MPH
4TH GEAR 996 GT3 144MPH BOTH CARS TO QUICK FOR THE ROAD PLUS ROADS ARE FULL OF CYCLISTS,HORSES OTHER ROAD USERS AS YOUR FULLY AWARE.TRY A DECENT 996 GT3 CLUB SPORT SAME JOB AS 997 BETTER RESISUALS PLUS WILL BE A CLASSIC OF THE FUTURE
4TH GEAR 997 152MPH
4TH GEAR 996 GT3 144MPH BOTH CARS TO QUICK FOR THE ROAD PLUS ROADS ARE FULL OF CYCLISTS,HORSES OTHER ROAD USERS AS YOUR FULLY AWARE.TRY A DECENT 996 GT3 CLUB SPORT SAME JOB AS 997 BETTER RESISUALS PLUS WILL BE A CLASSIC OF THE FUTURE
I went from a series of M cars (E39/E63) to a 997.1 RS. In reality nothing to choose between a GT3 and and an RS in performance terms for the Gen.1 cars - I just preferred the look of the RS. Probably the big item to think about is ceramice brakes. I personally prefer steels but many prefer ceramics. The gen 1 cars have no stability control.
The gen 2 3.8 litre cars are more differentiated between the GT3 and the RS,with the latter having a bit more power but a lot more downforce. I have both a gen.1 and a gen 2 RS and the latter is notably more sticky at highe speeds,definitely a better car than the normal GT3. In this case the front lifts are handy to avoid replacing the splitter from abrasion.
The gen 2 3.8 litre cars are more differentiated between the GT3 and the RS,with the latter having a bit more power but a lot more downforce. I have both a gen.1 and a gen 2 RS and the latter is notably more sticky at highe speeds,definitely a better car than the normal GT3. In this case the front lifts are handy to avoid replacing the splitter from abrasion.
RatBoy M3CSL said:
jackal said:
justin220 said:
Have you thought about an Exige V6?
If you want a part track part fast road car then this is the one IMO. It will set a new standard in combining both duties and will be pretty much peerless for performing both roles so well.I would love to try one on cct when they come out and i cant wait to see what sort of times they can managed. The elise based chassis is very very quick and with a lomger wheelbase, a stonking power to weight they should be up with RS 3.8, 458 sort of times.
You might as well put £25K on the BBQ..
Edited by RatBoy M3CSL on Sunday 16th September 11:08
Don't imagine a 997 gt3.1 is some sort of bank vault though. If you play at say 55k you've lost 10 grand the moment you turn the key. There is a fair markup in these cars. They haven't bottomed yet either.
Edited by jackal on Sunday 16th September 12:21
davidbht said:
HI, WENT FROM M3 E46 TO GT3 997 ALTHOUGH HAD 996 GT3 AS WELL. WEIGHT IS THE KEY AS YOU INDICATED
4TH GEAR 997 152MPH
4TH GEAR 996 GT3 144MPH BOTH CARS TO QUICK FOR THE ROAD PLUS ROADS ARE FULL OF CYCLISTS,HORSES OTHER ROAD USERS AS YOUR FULLY AWARE.TRY A DECENT 996 GT3 CLUB SPORT SAME JOB AS 997 BETTER RESISUALS PLUS WILL BE A CLASSIC OF THE FUTURE
Why are you shouting? 4TH GEAR 997 152MPH
4TH GEAR 996 GT3 144MPH BOTH CARS TO QUICK FOR THE ROAD PLUS ROADS ARE FULL OF CYCLISTS,HORSES OTHER ROAD USERS AS YOUR FULLY AWARE.TRY A DECENT 996 GT3 CLUB SPORT SAME JOB AS 997 BETTER RESISUALS PLUS WILL BE A CLASSIC OF THE FUTURE
jackal said:
Don't imagine a 997 gt3.1 is some sort of bank vault though. If you play at say 55k you've lost 10 grand the moment you turn the key. There is a fair markup in these cars. They haven't bottomed yet either.
True enough, but box clever (as I have on two occasions with Gen 1 997 GT3s, once back in 2007-8 and again earlier this year) back in 2007-8 I took a hit equivalent to two rear tyres, this time I took more of hit than last, but still nothing like £10K (not even close to half that figure I'm glad to say) !OP. IMHO, no they don't feel special at "normal" speeds. They're require driving well above the NSL to come alive. This was a major contributory factor in me selling mine and heading back to a 996 GT3 (as others have recommended)
Personally I found the CF Carrera GT seat to be without a doubt the most uncomfortable seats I've ever had the misfortune to sit in (but I'll put that down to being a freakish shape and getting old ! !)
I'd find a car with a pair of these in, (or the "comfort" seat as they're far more comfortable :
jackal said:
RatBoy M3CSL said:
jackal said:
justin220 said:
Have you thought about an Exige V6?
If you want a part track part fast road car then this is the one IMO. It will set a new standard in combining both duties and will be pretty much peerless for performing both roles so well.I would love to try one on cct when they come out and i cant wait to see what sort of times they can managed. The elise based chassis is very very quick and with a lomger wheelbase, a stonking power to weight they should be up with RS 3.8, 458 sort of times.
You might as well put £25K on the BBQ..
Edited by RatBoy M3CSL on Sunday 16th September 11:08
Don't imagine a 997 gt3.1 is some sort of bank vault though. If you play at say 55k you've lost 10 grand the moment you turn the key. There is a fair markup in these cars. They haven't bottomed yet either.
Edited by jackal on Sunday 16th September 12:21
I bought mine in the winter, drove it home in the snow, ran it for 18 months, and sold it for £2.5K more than I paid for it @ Easter ... but you do need to buy it right, privately and for cash..!
I'll comment on the Caterham vs Atom.
A Caterham is quick, properly quick, even with an old Ford crossflow giving 130BHP it'll still do 0-60 in 5.5 secs. However there's a lot of poorly executed bits on the car that will mean maintenance and niggly things constantly going wrong with it. Most of teh more recent examples have had Rover engines in that require assorted faffing to sort out head gaskets, though it's not as bad as in a heavy Rover car. The handling is great however the amount of grip near the limit, especially in the wet is poor. There's not enough weight over the real wheels to keep traction when trying to make progress, however they're ridiculously easy to drive sideways.
The Atom is a much better engineered car, far better put together with some real thought put into how it's all integrated. It is also frighteningly quick. The supercharged version is 0-60 in 2.9s. That means you get to shout ARRGGHHHHH from a standstill to breaking the speed limit. It also means it's more difficult to drive near the limit but still not too twitchy. Weight over the rear wheels means it's much less tail happy than a Caterham and the extra width means that they can be used by fat people too.
Forget practicality, they're properly uncomfortable for a long drive, I'm still recovering from last weekend when I drove for around 12 hours.
But so much fun. Every drive seems like an event. Not that quick on the road in practice, they become more uncomfortable over about 90 leptons, need regular fuel stops and at every last one you'll spend at least ten minutes chatting with other people about the car.
A Caterham is quick, properly quick, even with an old Ford crossflow giving 130BHP it'll still do 0-60 in 5.5 secs. However there's a lot of poorly executed bits on the car that will mean maintenance and niggly things constantly going wrong with it. Most of teh more recent examples have had Rover engines in that require assorted faffing to sort out head gaskets, though it's not as bad as in a heavy Rover car. The handling is great however the amount of grip near the limit, especially in the wet is poor. There's not enough weight over the real wheels to keep traction when trying to make progress, however they're ridiculously easy to drive sideways.
The Atom is a much better engineered car, far better put together with some real thought put into how it's all integrated. It is also frighteningly quick. The supercharged version is 0-60 in 2.9s. That means you get to shout ARRGGHHHHH from a standstill to breaking the speed limit. It also means it's more difficult to drive near the limit but still not too twitchy. Weight over the rear wheels means it's much less tail happy than a Caterham and the extra width means that they can be used by fat people too.
Forget practicality, they're properly uncomfortable for a long drive, I'm still recovering from last weekend when I drove for around 12 hours.
But so much fun. Every drive seems like an event. Not that quick on the road in practice, they become more uncomfortable over about 90 leptons, need regular fuel stops and at every last one you'll spend at least ten minutes chatting with other people about the car.
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff