TVR - need advice on sellng car with duff engine
Discussion
I am presently the owner of a P-Reg 4.2 Cerbera which has an excellent body (36k service 400 miles ago) and an engine diagnosed as beyond repair; the crankshaft has split into three, cracking the block and generally wrecking all the pistons and rods in the process. What makes this particularly irritating is that the vehicle was up for sale with an independent dealer when the engine blew. Both the TVR dealership where the vehicle has always been serviced and TVR Blackpool have been of absolutely no help on the matter and so I thought I would try TVR enthusiasts for some advice on the course of action that I should take. Firstly am I better trying to sell the car ‘as is’, that is effectively without an engine or should I try to get a second-hand or reconditioned engine (if these are available). If I take the first course what sort of return will I get; if I take the second am I throwing good money after bad in that I may not recover any outgoings when I come to sell the vehicle or that I end up with another duff engine. Presumably when I come clean about the history of the vehicle most buyers will lose interest. Finally, if anybody has had a similar experience, could they say whether am I likely to have any sort of claim against either the dealer selling the vehicle or the dealership who recently carried out the service? Any advice would be appreciated as I have been ripped off at every turn to date and now simply don’t trust advice coming from those in the industry. MartinTayl@aol.com
Get competent legal advice - it seems to me that there must be an argument about fitness for purpose (even on a P reg) with that mileage.
Problem is the counter argument is likely to be that it was abused (whether this is true or not).
Only hope might be a metallurgical analysis if this could show a flaw in the original casting. Then you might be able to make a case.
Problem is the counter argument is likely to be that it was abused (whether this is true or not).
Only hope might be a metallurgical analysis if this could show a flaw in the original casting. Then you might be able to make a case.
I can't believe the engine is so 
ed after only 36,000 miles. That is quite distressing. well only help that i can offer is that i would buy if it were up for sale with the engine fault at the right price. Its really a case of
1. take legal action
2. cost the repair and the loss of value from the broken engine and see if its worth while
3. sell it as is
alot depends on your mechanical knowledge, most of the engine sounds salviageable and RPI engineering might be able to sort out a new block and apropriate parts if you wanted to repair it.
1. take legal action
2. cost the repair and the loss of value from the broken engine and see if its worth while
3. sell it as is
alot depends on your mechanical knowledge, most of the engine sounds salviageable and RPI engineering might be able to sort out a new block and apropriate parts if you wanted to repair it.
Was it in the custody of the dealer when it blew up? If so there is an obvious possibility that they or one of their customers destroyed the engine through misuse, and I think it would be extremely difficult for them to disprove it. From their point of view it might be sensible to repair/replace the engine themselves (not necessarily for free, but perhaps not for full market price) in order to avoid being landed with a much larger cost of having some other company do the work, plus legal expenses, if you successfully brought a case against them.
If replacing the engine, I suggest a putting a brand new in.
Not a recon one, or one out of smashed up one. Buyers will be a lot more re assured of a new one.
My mechanic had a similar sceinario with an Astra Coupe (my old one)... and oppted for the new engine even with over 110k on the clock. I know different type of car but the principle is the same.
Not a recon one, or one out of smashed up one. Buyers will be a lot more re assured of a new one.
My mechanic had a similar sceinario with an Astra Coupe (my old one)... and oppted for the new engine even with over 110k on the clock. I know different type of car but the principle is the same.
MartinT said:
What makes this particularly irritating is that the vehicle was up for sale with an independent dealer when the engine blew.
Martin, you have my sympathies.
First thing - can we have a bit more info on the above statement... was it in their posession at the time? Were they/a prospective buyer out test-driving it at the time? Had you entered into any kind of formal contract with them over the sale of the car?
If the answer to any of the above (or any number of other similar questions) is "yes", I'd get legal advice immediately.
If you get nowhere with that (and I'd pursue it for as long as possible, as it's unlikely to be the kind of thing anyone'd want to admit to liability on), then regarding selling it... the first thing I'd do would be to work out:
1. The cost of having a new engine fitted and what you'd then be able to sell it for
2. The cost of having a S/H engine fitted and what you'd then be able to sell it for
Then I'd advertise it at the somwhere around the "value fixed" - "cost of fix" price, to see if you can get equivalent money without any of the hassle.
Didn't BigBazza smash his Cerbie and write off the body - IIRC he said the engine was pretty much intactBoosted Ls1 said:
What would the appx value of this car be minus an engine?
Hard to judge, as it's not exactly a commonly occuring thing. If I were in that position, and had exhausted all other opportunities, I'd say that £12k would initially convince me to part with it, going down to £10k after a few months if I'd still not sold it... £3-4k could probably source a second hand engine given time, so any less and you might as well deal with the hassle of getting it all running again.
J_S_G said:
What would the appx value of this car be minus an engine?
Hard to judge, as it's not exactly a commonly occuring thing. If I were in that position, and had exhausted all other opportunities, I'd say that £12k would initially convince me to part with it, going down to £10k after a few months if I'd still not sold it... £3-4k could probably source a second hand engine given time, so any less and you might as well deal with the hassle of getting it all running again.
I think you are roughly right. With an engine it is worth maybe £20K max on a private sale. A dealer would probably offer £15K. (hurts)
To sort it you are looking at time + money + hassle.
I would put this value at around 10K.
My guess is that unless you get lucky with a keen private buyer then the buyer for a car without an engine will be trade or sport and they will offer under £10K, maybe well under.
FWIW - I'd get an engine rebuild quote first, someone like Topcats would be the place to start IMHO.
I suspect that under 10K without an engine could be a very real possibility (I admit that this is based on nothing but pessimism..), however you may find that the rebuild costs say 5-7K (optimistic I know, probably nearer 10K), then you just have to remind yourself what you've actually got ... a car worth 20K with a brand new engine. A new engine isn't the same as trying to sell a car with bad accident damage, so I don't see that there should be a stigma.
How did the damage occour ?
I suspect that under 10K without an engine could be a very real possibility (I admit that this is based on nothing but pessimism..), however you may find that the rebuild costs say 5-7K (optimistic I know, probably nearer 10K), then you just have to remind yourself what you've actually got ... a car worth 20K with a brand new engine. A new engine isn't the same as trying to sell a car with bad accident damage, so I don't see that there should be a stigma.
How did the damage occour ?
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