Range Rover Classic engine swap
Discussion
Good afternoon, well the time has come to sort out the water loss on my 93 Vouge SE, it could be the heads I guess, but £1000 for that goes towards an engine rebuild or swap. Any one here know who could do an LS-1/3 engine swap for me, maybe better than going down the old Rover V8 path, any thoughts?
Mark
Mark
Markh said:
Good afternoon, well the time has come to sort out the water loss on my 93 Vouge SE, it could be the heads I guess, but £1000 for that goes towards an engine rebuild or swap. Any one here know who could do an LS-1/3 engine swap for me, maybe better than going down the old Rover V8 path, any thoughts?
Mark
What's wrong with your current engine? RV8's are cheap and plentiful used, no need to spend silly money fixing them.Mark
What sort of budget are you looking at? An LSx swap is perfectly possible and been done lots of times before, but it still a pretty major project and there's no off the shelf kit.
Also going from 182hp to 430hp+ is quite a major jump, so you'll have to consider replacing the chocolate Rover axles, maybe the gearbox and transfer box as well as looking at serious suspension and brake upgrades. This is all ££££ even if you can do the work yourself.
A nice running cammed RV8 won't make anywhere near the HP, but will be a lot easier, cheaper and more cost affective.
300bhp/ton said:
What's wrong with your current engine? RV8's are cheap and plentiful used, no need to spend silly money fixing them.
What sort of budget are you looking at? An LSx swap is perfectly possible and been done lots of times before, but it still a pretty major project and there's no off the shelf kit.
Also going from 182hp to 430hp+ is quite a major jump, so you'll have to consider replacing the chocolate Rover axles, maybe the gearbox and transfer box as well as looking at serious suspension and brake upgrades. This is all ££££ even if you can do the work yourself.
A nice running cammed RV8 won't make anywhere near the HP, but will be a lot easier, cheaper and more cost affective.
as previously stated, engine is using water, have had 3 combustion tests done showing no gas leak, so not sure what the hell is the problem, smart money is saying linner problemWhat sort of budget are you looking at? An LSx swap is perfectly possible and been done lots of times before, but it still a pretty major project and there's no off the shelf kit.
Also going from 182hp to 430hp+ is quite a major jump, so you'll have to consider replacing the chocolate Rover axles, maybe the gearbox and transfer box as well as looking at serious suspension and brake upgrades. This is all ££££ even if you can do the work yourself.
A nice running cammed RV8 won't make anywhere near the HP, but will be a lot easier, cheaper and more cost affective.
Mark
a Chevy swap is eminently feasable - but with the following proviso - It will cost about 10 grand. You need all sorts of adaptors and a seriously good engineer to do it
How do I know this? see picture of my overfinch discovery - which I have just rebuilt and stroked to 6.3 litres.
This cost me 5k in all - but you can buy a ZZ350 crate engine for this figure also from partsworld performance.
Plus uprated gearbox/torque converter - another 2k.(Ashcroft stage 2)
You then need to factor in brakes, exhaust, suspension mods, bespoke engine mounts, adaptor boss and plate, another 2k - so 9k plus about 1k for sundry works - modifying aircon system, heater etc, fitting electric fans).
Your best option is to buy a top-hat-linered 3.9 block from Turner Engineering with a Kent H180 torque cam and a full stainless exhaust system from Rimmers - total cost 3.5k including Vat.
If you are running injection you should add a Mark Adams tornado chip and a k&n filter(£450) - will give you about 240 hp and 275lbs of torque
I have just done this to my mint discovery 3.9 which had a slipped liner on no 5 cylinder.
a Chevy swap is eminently feasable - but with the following proviso - It will cost about 10 grand. You need all sorts of adaptors and a seriously good engineer to do it
How do I know this? see picture of my overfinch discovery - which I have just rebuilt and stroked to 6.3 litres.
This cost me 5k in all - but you can buy a ZZ350 crate engine for this figure also from partsworld performance.
Plus uprated gearbox/torque converter - another 2k.(Ashcroft stage 2)
You then need to factor in brakes, exhaust, suspension mods, bespoke engine mounts, adaptor boss and plate, another 2k - so 9k plus about 1k for sundry works - modifying aircon system, heater etc, fitting electric fans).
Your best option is to buy a top-hat-linered 3.9 block from Turner Engineering with a Kent H180 torque cam and a full stainless exhaust system from Rimmers - total cost 3.5k including Vat.
If you are running injection you should add a Mark Adams tornado chip and a k&n filter(£450) - will give you about 240 hp and 275lbs of torque
I have just done this to my mint discovery 3.9 which had a slipped liner on no 5 cylinder.
Edited by vjj on Monday 1st October 08:48
Edited by vjj on Monday 1st October 09:33
Markh said:
as previously stated, engine is using water, have had 3 combustion tests done showing no gas leak, so not sure what the hell is the problem, smart money is saying linner problem
A water leak could be a dodgy hose, leaky heater matrix or a hole in a rad that doesn't open up until a certain temperature is reached among many other possibilities.That said, 3.9's are cheap. Pick one up off ebay for £500, slap some V8D heads on it and a nice cam, upgrade to Megesquirt fuel injection and slap some good tubular exhaust manifolds on it.
Will it match a Chevy LSx, hell no! But it'll run a million times better than a stock 3.9 does and be a cheaper option all round.
Other possibilities could include slapping a nitrous kit on the above for those occasions when you want more poke.
Look into a supercharger conversion or a custom twin turbo one using turbo's off a Subaru Impreza.
You could just go straight for a 4.6, while some have had issues, many haven't.
Real Steel and other places used to sell a stroker kit, so you could take a 3.5 out to 4.3 litres of a 3.9 out to 4.8 litres.
Upping the power significantly might mean doing other drivetrain mods too, although with sub 300hp you could probably run the stock Rover axles, at least until you break them and then upgrade at that point.
Another alternative is the BMW M52 2.8i.
It was fitted to defenders in South Africa and uses the same R380 gearbox bellhousing and input shaft as the manual P38 Range Rover. Voila! A cheap and easy conversion. Oh and you will need to drop your final drive ratios in the transfer box too. Again cheap to do just keep your eyes open for a defender 1.4:1 transfer box in the usual places.
This setup will also work for the S50 M3 motors too, both the 3.0 (circa 300hp)& the 3.2 evo (circa 320hp which is one i am currently persuing) share the same stud pattern to mate against the bellhousing.
Only one thing left to do, get measuring to make sure it all fits nicely once its bolted together and dropped in to the engine bay.
It was fitted to defenders in South Africa and uses the same R380 gearbox bellhousing and input shaft as the manual P38 Range Rover. Voila! A cheap and easy conversion. Oh and you will need to drop your final drive ratios in the transfer box too. Again cheap to do just keep your eyes open for a defender 1.4:1 transfer box in the usual places.
This setup will also work for the S50 M3 motors too, both the 3.0 (circa 300hp)& the 3.2 evo (circa 320hp which is one i am currently persuing) share the same stud pattern to mate against the bellhousing.
Only one thing left to do, get measuring to make sure it all fits nicely once its bolted together and dropped in to the engine bay.
300bhp/ton said:
Markh said:
as previously stated, engine is using water, have had 3 combustion tests done showing no gas leak, so not sure what the hell is the problem, smart money is saying linner problem
A water leak could be a dodgy hose, leaky heater matrix or a hole in a rad that doesn't open up until a certain temperature is reached among many other possibilities.That said, 3.9's are cheap. Pick one up off ebay for £500, slap some V8D heads on it and a nice cam, upgrade to Megesquirt fuel injection and slap some good tubular exhaust manifolds on it.
Will it match a Chevy LSx, hell no! But it'll run a million times better than a stock 3.9 does and be a cheaper option all round.
Other possibilities could include slapping a nitrous kit on the above for those occasions when you want more poke.
Look into a supercharger conversion or a custom twin turbo one using turbo's off a Subaru Impreza.
You could just go straight for a 4.6, while some have had issues, many haven't.
Real Steel and other places used to sell a stroker kit, so you could take a 3.5 out to 4.3 litres of a 3.9 out to 4.8 litres.
Upping the power significantly might mean doing other drivetrain mods too, although with sub 300hp you could probably run the stock Rover axles, at least until you break them and then upgrade at that point.
St John Smythe said:
My money would be on a leaking heater matrix too. Happened to my old classic.
Many thanks guys, have had a new rad fitted last month, had fingers crossed it would be the main problem but no, still using water (although a lot less) will get the heater matrix checked out. the engine feels so strong, is quiet and uses no oil at all, so would be a shame to bin it if not necessary Mark - if your heater is the problem and your engine is fine - and I assume you are running an injected 3.9 or 4.2 with hotwire (lucas 14CUX) - then I would still recommend the fitment of the tornado - you have to advance the timing a bit(instructions are with it) - I paid my local TVR garage an hour's labour to do it to be safe.
The differnence is marked - you have a slightly higher idle at 875-900 rpm so drive take-up is much smoother and the engine gets much more fuel when accellerating(when you need it) and uses much less fuel when you are cruising.
You save about 10-15% fuel overall and you have at least the same power and torque gains.
It also tells the engine not to fire until a couple of revolutions from cold so you have oil pressure when it does fire and the engine warms up much quicker because the ecu doesn't carry out its checks until the engine is warm.
All in all it's great.
The differnence is marked - you have a slightly higher idle at 875-900 rpm so drive take-up is much smoother and the engine gets much more fuel when accellerating(when you need it) and uses much less fuel when you are cruising.
You save about 10-15% fuel overall and you have at least the same power and torque gains.
It also tells the engine not to fire until a couple of revolutions from cold so you have oil pressure when it does fire and the engine warms up much quicker because the ecu doesn't carry out its checks until the engine is warm.
All in all it's great.
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