Proposals from ABI for improved driver training
Discussion
Given the hoops that you need to jump through to get a motorbike test these days it seems odd how little the car test has evolved over the last 20 years.
I'd love to see more focus on teaching to drive rather than to pass a test. Motorway and other post-test training seems long overdue judging by the poor understanding of actual road rules.
Spending some money on getting people to drive in the left lane would massively increase the capacity of motorways - without any road building.
Right - I'm now off back to the real world
I'd love to see more focus on teaching to drive rather than to pass a test. Motorway and other post-test training seems long overdue judging by the poor understanding of actual road rules.
Spending some money on getting people to drive in the left lane would massively increase the capacity of motorways - without any road building.
Right - I'm now off back to the real world
I passed within 3 months of turning 17 without any previous driving experience and got 1 minor on my test. I've been driving for 3 years without issue. I don't mean to sound stuck up, just stating fact. We aren't all idiots and terrible drivers. To punish those who are capable and sensible with such restrictions is a little harsh imo.
mattball said:
I passed within 3 months of turning 17 without any previous driving experience and got 1 minor on my test. I've been driving for 3 years without issue. I don't mean to sound stuck up, just stating fact. We aren't all idiots and terrible drivers. To punish those who are capable and sensible with such restrictions is a little harsh imo.
Fantastic that you've survived 3 years without an accident but, and apologies if this sounds a bit harsh Mattball, how have you learnt about driving?In 3 months, even with quite a few lessons you haven't had much time to learn more than the absolute basics. That's all the basic test covers.
GadgeS3C said:
I'd love to see more focus on teaching to drive rather than to pass a test. Motorway and other post-test training seems long overdue judging by the poor understanding of actual road rules.
I couldn't agree more.When I passed my test, I found it rather strange I was allowed to drive on a motorway without any kind of practice or training other than verbal. I was lucky to find an instructor who taught me how to 'drive' and not just focus on the test, took a few different instructors to find him like.
I looked at pass plus, but the cost of it far exceeded the discount of insurance that would have given.
Why would the average Joe pay for something that isn't a legal requirement, laws need to be changed to allow learners on motorways and include it in the curriculum.
Although the ABI proposals are sensible, I think we need to focus on the quality of young drivers and not just limit their exposure to the roads.
I have a private pilot's licence, proverbially described as "a licence to learn". Other clichées abound, such as "You start with a full back of luck and an empty bag of experience. The aim is to fill the bag of experience before you empty the bag of luck". In recreational flying, you learn from mistakes, and usually only kill yourself and maybe one or two others if you stuff it up. The roads are more crowded than the sky. Driving is easier and safer than flying, but passing the test is also a bit of a licence to learn..
GadgeS3C said:
Fantastic that you've survived 3 years without an accident but, and apologies if this sounds a bit harsh Mattball, how have you learnt about driving?
In 3 months, even with quite a few lessons you haven't had much time to learn more than the absolute basics. That's all the basic test covers.
I did the pass plus course which really should be included on the actual test. You're so used to pottering around at 30 and occasionally getting up to 60, then you get on a dual carriageway and people can be coming up behind you at 80/90, so doing that certainly helped.In 3 months, even with quite a few lessons you haven't had much time to learn more than the absolute basics. That's all the basic test covers.
I was also insured on my parents car for those 3 months so whenever I could get them in the car I would go out. Actually driving the car became second nature. All I had to worry about in the test was not doing anything 'wrong'.
Then when I was finally let loose I picked up things pretty quickly. Finding a safe environment such as an old airfield lets you test your limits and apply them. Biggest things I kept in mind were to give myself lots of space and to slowly build up to things rather than expect to be able to handle all situations straight away.
1-year of bad instruction could be worse than a 2-week intensive course which is well instructed.
This could cock things up for my girlfriend who failed her test in March and her theory test has since expired. She drives regularly on L plates with her dad so she is quite a competant driver. She now not only has to sit a theory test and a practical test again but could end up having to sit 12 months of tuition which isn't required*
This could cock things up for my girlfriend who failed her test in March and her theory test has since expired. She drives regularly on L plates with her dad so she is quite a competant driver. She now not only has to sit a theory test and a practical test again but could end up having to sit 12 months of tuition which isn't required*
- in my opinion...
mattball said:
I did the pass plus course which really should be included on the actual test. You're so used to pottering around at 30 and occasionally getting up to 60, then you get on a dual carriageway and people can be coming up behind you at 80/90, so doing that certainly helped.
I was also insured on my parents car for those 3 months so whenever I could get them in the car I would go out. Actually driving the car became second nature. All I had to worry about in the test was not doing anything 'wrong'.
Then when I was finally let loose I picked up things pretty quickly. Finding a safe environment such as an old airfield lets you test your limits and apply them. Biggest things I kept in mind were to give myself lots of space and to slowly build up to things rather than expect to be able to handle all situations straight away.
Mattball - thanks - I'd ducked expecting a less "positive" response. This is PH I was also insured on my parents car for those 3 months so whenever I could get them in the car I would go out. Actually driving the car became second nature. All I had to worry about in the test was not doing anything 'wrong'.
Then when I was finally let loose I picked up things pretty quickly. Finding a safe environment such as an old airfield lets you test your limits and apply them. Biggest things I kept in mind were to give myself lots of space and to slowly build up to things rather than expect to be able to handle all situations straight away.
You've nicely proven to me that you're the sort of driver that is capable of learning all on their own. I agree it's rough to be penalised for the idiots out there but I suspect someone as keen and sensible as you is in a small minority.
It's the rest I'm worried about that see a car as just something to get around, they do seem to believe they can "handle all situation straight away"...
Breadvan72 said:
I have a private pilot's licence, proverbially described as "a licence to learn". Other clichées abound, such as "You start with a full back of luck and an empty bag of experience. The aim is to fill the bag of experience before you empty the bag of luck". In recreational flying, you learn from mistakes, and usually only kill yourself and maybe one or two others if you stuff it up. The roads are more crowded than the sky. Driving is easier and safer than flying, but passing the test is also a bit of a licence to learn..
Aha - one of the 20 minuters nosittap said:
GadgeS3C said:
I'd love to see more focus on teaching to drive rather than to pass a test. Motorway and other post-test training seems long overdue judging by the poor understanding of actual road rules.
I couldn't agree more.When I passed my test, I found it rather strange I was allowed to drive on a motorway without any kind of practice or training other than verbal. I was lucky to find an instructor who taught me how to 'drive' and not just focus on the test, took a few different instructors to find him like.
I looked at pass plus, but the cost of it far exceeded the discount of insurance that would have given.
Why would the average Joe pay for something that isn't a legal requirement, laws need to be changed to allow learners on motorways and include it in the curriculum.
Although the ABI proposals are sensible, I think we need to focus on the quality of young drivers and not just limit their exposure to the roads.
Also, how would a night time ban work? What if someone leaves in good time but has a breakdown or gets caught in traffic?
GadgeS3C said:
Breadvan72 said:
I have a private pilot's licence, proverbially described as "a licence to learn". Other clichées abound, such as "You start with a full back of luck and an empty bag of experience. The aim is to fill the bag of experience before you empty the bag of luck". In recreational flying, you learn from mistakes, and usually only kill yourself and maybe one or two others if you stuff it up. The roads are more crowded than the sky. Driving is easier and safer than flying, but passing the test is also a bit of a licence to learn..
Aha - one of the 20 minuters As the saying goes: "NOTAM yer solos" .
For those of you who listened to Radio 4 this morning and heard the discussion "Today", Edmund King (President of the AA) highlighted initiatives and Clubs such as the Under 17 Car Club - www.under17-carclub.co.uk. I'm an ex-Member and there are many others on this site - teaching young people from age 11/12 up to 17, means that many ex-Members are very good, competent drivers before they hit the roads for real. We conducted a Survey in 2006 and are just finishing another of our ex-Members for the past 6 years to showcase the benefits the Club has.
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