Apply for anoher job? You're fired.

[eldar]

My daughter in law had the temerity to apply for a better job with another, non competitive employer. Her current employer found out, and fired her on the spot for that reason. She has worked there for a couple of years, seemingly no problems.

Is looking for a better job a firing offence?

[hornetrider]

No.

[crazy about cars]

Too many variables. Surely there must be more to the story?

[pmjg66]

hornetrider said:

No.

+1

[SystemParanoia]

constructive dismissal?

she's got a few bob comming her way im thinking £££££££££ ker-ching!

[eldar]

crazy about cars said:

Too many variables. Surely there must be more to the story?

Possible. But no unexpected incidents, no previous bad feelings, no warnings or the like. The boss - small company - is a bit of a 'character', and has possibly reacted badly to disloyalty. Presumably she can expect the dismissal to be in writing, with reasons?

[Hoofy]

eldar said:

small company

Whodda thunk it.

[2 sMoKiN bArReLs]

Probably. Nobody wants a disloyal employee. (not the politically correct answer, but in practice the most logical)

[crazy about cars]

eldar said:

Possible. But no unexpected incidents, no previous bad feelings, no warnings or the like. The boss - small company - is a bit of a 'character', and has possibly reacted badly to disloyalty. Presumably she can expect the dismissal to be in writing, with reasons?

There lies the key...

[hyperblue]

Ker-ching! Employer has not followed statutory procedure, get down to an employment tribunal and let them know how many zeros she wants on the cheque. Rather stupid actions by the employer.

[Spitfire2]

SystemParanoia said:

constructive dismissal?

she's got a few bob comming her way im thinking £££££££££ ker-ching!

Actual dismissal.

[AJS-]

Did she take time off to attend interviews as sick days, outside meetings or doctors appointments? Could be considered misconduct, but even so I doubt that would in itself be enough for instant dismissal.

[Jonnas]

Spitfire2 said:

Actual dismissal.

Unfair dismissal.....

[WhereamI]

Unless there is more to the story the employee has been unfairly dismissed and wrongfully dismissed. Unfairly because applying for another job is not an offence for which you can be dismissed and wrongfully because appropriate process would not appear to have been followed.

The next step is to get advice, if she is in a union (which I guess she isn't) the union will help her. If she is not then either a solicitor or she could try ACAS (08457 474747) would be the next best step.

[anonymous-user]

The previous poster does not understand the difference between unfair dismissal and wrongful dismissal. Wrongful dismissal is a dismissal in breach of contract and has noting to do with procedure. An unfair procedure may render a dismissal unfair.

If the facts are as stated by the OP, the dismissal was unfair (a statutory claim), and also wrongful (a common law claim). Summary dismissal is wrongful, absent gross misconduct.

I would ignore ACAS and well meant but ill informed internet advice, and obtain real legal advice instead.

[Deva Link]

WhereamI said:

The next step is to get advice....

Surely her next step should be to get the other job?

[Hoofy]

Sounds like the kind of boss you don't want to be working for.

[WhereamI]

Breadvan72 said:

The previous poster does not understand the difference between unfair dismissal and wrongful dismissal. Wrongful dismissal is a dismissal in breach of contract and has noting to do with procedure. An unfair procedure may render a dismissal unfair.

I'm not trying to argue with someone who I know is much better qualified in this area than I, but generally the contract will lay out a disciplinary procedure and so failure to follow that procedure is a breach of contract and so is wrongful dismissal. Is that not correct or am I missing something?

Breadvan72 said:

If the facts are as stated by the OP, the dismissal was unfair (a statutory claim), and also wrongful (a common law claim). Summary dismissal is wrongful, absent gross misconduct.

Which I think is largely what I said

Breadvan72 said:

I would ignore ACAS and well meant but ill informed internet advice, and obtain real legal advice instead.

Breadvan is a barrister who, I believe, specialises in employment law. Obviously someone hugely knowledgeable on the legal implications of this. My experience is more at the front end of the process with people who, like your daughter in law, has just had something happen to them and is working out what to do.

Who to turn to for advice depends to some extent on the outcome that you want. ACAS are focussed on conciliation and arbitration, in other words they will try to resolve the problem with a view to getting her job back. They will probably call the employer and talk to them, pointing out the error of the employer's ways to them and she is, arguably, more likely to get her job back through that route and the service is free. If that doesn't work then a solicitor is the way forwards to start the tribunal process and/or negotiation of a settlement or some sort.

If she doesn't want reinstatement then going straight to a solicitor makes sense, that is not to say that a solicitor wouldn't negotiate with the employer but the approach is one of exerting your legal rights as opposed to the ACAS approach of conciliation.

So to summarise - my advice is if she wants her job back try ACAS and if that fails get a solicitor who specialises in employment, if reinstatement isn't what she wants go straight to a solicitor.

[anonymous-user]

Reinstatement is obtained in fewer than one per cent of unfair dismissal claims.

ACAS can assist in settling a claim, but are not legal advisers.

A disciplinary procedure is not always contractual. The breach of contract here is dismissal without notice. Contract law does not focus on the manner of dismissal, that being the preserve of statutory employment law.

[WhereamI]

Breadvan72 said:

Reinstatement is obtained in fewer than one per cent of unfair dismissal claims.

ACAS can assist in settling a claim, but are not legal advisers.

Breadvan you are, perhaps unwittingly, supporting my point. If it becomes an unfair dismissal claim then reinstatement is unlikely to be the outcome. If reinstatement is what she wants then filing an unfair dismissal claim immediately is unlikely to give her that, better to try ACAS which is an arbitration and conciliation service, it's aim is to help two parties come to a mutually agreeable solution, and they may be able to negotiate reinstatement. If it fails then she can still go to a solicitor and be no worse off.

So I stand by what I said, if she wants her job back try ACAS, if she doesn't then go straight to a solicitor.