Q Rings - Snake oil?

[BMWBen]

I test rode a boardman elite air today that just happened to have Q-Rings on it.
http://www.rotoruk.co.uk/qrings.html


The experience was... strange. It was definitely different, but I couldn't say whether it was better or worse. By the time I got to the end of the ride ( a single lap of richmond park) I'd kind of forgotten about them. Then getting back on my own bike felt a bit strange for a few miles.


I know that wiggo/other pro riders use a similar thing but it seems odd that they directly conflict with the principles of the Shimano Biopace system as reviewed positively by sheldon:

http://sheldonbrown.com/biopace.html

So what are the thoughts on them? Waste of money? Bad for you? Excellent and I should buy some?

[itsnotarace]

Some people swear by them but AFAIK the scientific jury is still out whether they offer any tangible benefit other than psychological

[BMWBen]

itsnotarace said:

Some people swear by them but AFAIK the scientific jury is still out whether they offer any tangible benefit other than psychological

Guy in the bike shop sure did! But then he would because he makes a tidy profit on them

[Magic919]

Wiggins uses osymetric rings, the next step up. Plenty of science on the Internet if you fancy a read. I'm tempted to try q rings.

Okgo on here uses them.

[GTDNB]

who remembers shimano bio-pace? i thought those were withdrawn because they caused knee injuries! edit - should have read the OP. derp

Edited by GTDNB on Tuesday 6th November 17:57

[donfisher]

I've still got biopace on my mountain bike.

[GTDNB]

donfisher said:

I've still got biopace on my mountain bike.

so, how are your knees? i did actually have problems with mine as a teenager and had to give up playing hockey as a result. can't remember what the proper diagnosis was in the end but it was put down to 'growing pains' by the first few doctors i went to. edit- it was Osgood Schlatters http://www.sportsinjuryclinic.net/sport-injuries/k...

[BMWBen]

GTDNB said:

who remembers shimano bio-pace? i thought those were withdrawn because they caused knee injuries!

Sheldon doesn't agree. And Sheldon is our messiah!

[anonymous-user]

BMWBen said:

I test rode a boardman elite air today that just happened to have Q-Rings on it.
http://www.rotoruk.co.uk/qrings.html


The experience was... strange. It was definitely different, but I couldn't say whether it was better or worse. By the time I got to the end of the ride ( a single lap of richmond park) I'd kind of forgotten about them. Then getting back on my own bike felt a bit strange for a few miles.


I know that wiggo/other pro riders use a similar thing but it seems odd that they directly conflict with the principles of the Shimano Biopace system as reviewed positively by sheldon:

http://sheldonbrown.com/biopace.html

So what are the thoughts on them? Waste of money? Bad for you? Excellent and I should buy some?

I'm pretty sure the wider diameter of biopace rings is at 90 degrees to the wider diameter of Q rings (ok, bad explanation, but the gist of it is that Q rings are set up so that at the most powerful point in your leg stroke, the ring is 1-2 teeth larger than its notional size, and at the least powerful point is it 1-2 teeth smaller. So a 50 tooth ring varies as it revolves from 51.5 teeth to 48.5 teeth. Biopace rings present the lower number of teeth to your most powerful point and the highest to your weakest point).

Objectively you will need a power meter and a well set up turbo trainer to convince yourself (or not) that they are empirically better than round rings.

More subjectively, I find it easier to hold a high cadence with them and they are less fatiguing on a long ride (4h+).

For the first month they will produce some unfamiliar aches in your legs. This is normal.

[yellowjack]

GTDNB said:

who remembers shimano bio-pace?

I remember having Shimano Bio-Pace chainrings on a Raleigh Record Sprint in the mid to late 1980's. The bike was second-hand, so may have been fitted as an after-market upgrade by the previous owner. I'm hoping that the bike is still at my parents house, so that I can get it back on the road again. Trouble is, my dad is such a hoarder that even if it is there, digging it out will take days, and probably require assistance.

[donfisher]

GTDNB said:

so, how are your knees? i did actually have problems with mine as a teenager and had to give up playing hockey as a result. can't remember what the proper diagnosis was in the end but it was put down to 'growing pains' by the first few doctors i went to. edit- it was Osgood Schlatters http://www.sportsinjuryclinic.net/sport-injuries/k...

Bit of a long story, I had a bike with Biopace from when I was about 12 - 15. I had knee problems at that time due to one leg growing faster than the other during quite a big period of growth. I was taken off contact sports – after rugby I could barely walk – no Skiing etc etc. Went to get it properly looked at and they reckoned it was a problem with swelling under the cap due to growing. The thing was, at no point when I was cycling on the bike with Biopace did I ever have any problems IIRC.

Now 20 or so years later I bought the exact same model of bike, again with Biopace. I’ve mainly used it for commuting 10 miles a day and for messing around locally on weekends. My knees have always been a bit creaky but never had any issues in two years. Recently though I joined The Club in a particularly painful incident on some cobbles, I also did a century, on the Biopace bike, probably without enough preparation and the knee from the incident has started to hurt again. But only when I'm using a different bike in my first month or so with SPDs. I’m hoping it’s a combination of other things (SPDs not yet adjusted correctly, cold weather, perhaps a bit of damage from smashing my knee on a cobble etc) rather than the Biopace which I suspect is a bit of a red herring.

Edited by donfisher on Wednesday 7th November 11:53

[okgo]

Probably snake oil.

I must say I've got a poorly knee at the minute, but I think that was just due to overuse the other day, but although you can notice the difference between the two ring types, I don't feel like they make me any faster.

[BMWBen]

okgo said:

Probably snake oil.

I must say I've got a poorly knee at the minute, but I think that was just due to overuse the other day, but although you can notice the difference between the two ring types, I don't feel like they make me any faster.

What I don't get is the what problem they're trying to solve is. I guess it kind of makes sense that you have less power at the top and bottom of the stroke, so you need an easier gear... But doesn't your body just naturally deal with that anyway by you know, not pushing as hard at the top and the bottom?

Unless you pedal at the perfect cadence for maximum power output for your body I don't see what difference it really makes.

I think what is needed is a double blind test using turbos :P

[BMWBen]

Not double blind but seems like a solid methodology...

http://www.cycling.org.au/?ID=42069

Snake oil, was the verdict

[Magic919]

Osymetric review here http://www.competitivecyclist.com/whats-new/the-cu...

There's suggestion that they perform better than the q rings.

[SixtySpeedTwin]

i had biopace on a mountain bike in the early 90s and it was banded as the next big thing.
i do remember not having a very smooth cadence on the road if the rpm got up a bit. off road i never really noticed the ovality.
i think if your reallly at thetop of your game and competing with peers then it might make a small improvement, but probably not for regular cycling mortals.