Speed camera facts from ROSPA
Discussion
Quick question - Where does the data come from which gives the amount of speeding motorists prior to the installation of scameras?
I challenge the wording that installation of a camera reduced casualties by x%.
There was a crash on the A23 recently which claimed 6 lives. The high number of casualties appears to me (a relatively untrained individual) to be down to bad luck in in relation to the angle of collision. If a camera is installed and no-one crashes next year, there will be a claim that this has saved six lives - obviously not true.
Steve
I challenge the wording that installation of a camera reduced casualties by x%.
There was a crash on the A23 recently which claimed 6 lives. The high number of casualties appears to me (a relatively untrained individual) to be down to bad luck in in relation to the angle of collision. If a camera is installed and no-one crashes next year, there will be a claim that this has saved six lives - obviously not true.
Steve
towman said:
........The high number of casualties appears to me (a relatively untrained individual) to be down to bad luck in in relation to the angle of collision. If a camera is installed and no-one crashes next year, there will be a claim that this has saved six lives - obviously not true.
Steve
Yes, this is what Paul Smith (SafeSpeed.org) terms "regression to mean", an argument which no-one has yet been able to flaw.
It is interesting to note the number of times the phrase "at speed camera sites" was used within the article, yet not once did it comment on the national picture, which we all know to be worsening.
Streetcop said:
Central Fixed Penalty Offices..
Street
St
how can I get this data?
Errr. Are they in la-la land or what?
I am always amused at how the left hand never knows what the right hand is doing.
The grass roots membership of RoSPA's RoADA do not believe this crap. Nor do the grass roots membership of the IAM.
So why central office seems to want to churn out the same old shit is beyond me.
Still. Change comes from the inside...and I'm an infiltrator...
I am always amused at how the left hand never knows what the right hand is doing.
The grass roots membership of RoSPA's RoADA do not believe this crap. Nor do the grass roots membership of the IAM.
So why central office seems to want to churn out the same old shit is beyond me.
Still. Change comes from the inside...and I'm an infiltrator...
Don said:
Errr. Are they in la-la land or what?
I am always amused at how the left hand never knows what the right hand is doing.
The grass roots membership of RoSPA's RoADA do not believe this crap. Nor do the grass roots membership of the IAM.
So why central office seems to want to churn out the same old shit is beyond me.
Still. Change comes from the inside...and I'm an infiltrator...
As a body - they have to be politically correct - lieber Don. AA, RAC, IAM - all the same. Most members disagree with scams and know this is statisticallly flawed garbage, but those botty-lickers think there is some kind of "K" in the offing if they tug forelocks and bow to Herr Tone and crone....
Basically it is rewrite of scam prat stuff and it has been available for past year to my knowledge on the website .... But perhaps I ought to send you something to place in the water filtering machine you are infiltratin' here... the one which induces seeing the St Paul syndrome of seeing the light and the truth .......
Jeez, this sort of s
t really winds me up. Virtually every stat they use is a regurgitation of Pratnership or governmet propagander that relies on ignoring regression to the mean. The other facts (about speeds) are irrelevant to road safety and are easily explained by the fact that motorists do not wish to get points on their license.
I reckon it's time we campaigned for points to be taken out of the speeding punishment. If money was the only issue they'd find speeding increased hugely without changing the acident rate.
t really winds me up. Virtually every stat they use is a regurgitation of Pratnership or governmet propagander that relies on ignoring regression to the mean. The other facts (about speeds) are irrelevant to road safety and are easily explained by the fact that motorists do not wish to get points on their license. I reckon it's time we campaigned for points to be taken out of the speeding punishment. If money was the only issue they'd find speeding increased hugely without changing the acident rate.
If we took points out of the speeding punishment what punishment would it be? The truth is most people who can afford a car can afford a £100 fine....It would be ridiculous to say there is no link between speed and accidents, but what ROSPA seems to do is essentially provide the media and government with more ammunition against the motoring lobby! The idea that their campaign is entirely about road safety is pretty laughable isnt it?
Um, should of put this in the first one - a few more thoughts!
If the justification of cameras is upon life saving grounds - within 30 mph zones and 40 zones reductions make a difference - the idea that the faster a ton of metal hits you, the more it hurts.
BUT
With so many cameras, especially up near me in Greater Mancs, on A-Roads, annd Mobile lasers on national speed limited roads and motorways, whats the actual percentage of cameras in 30/40 zones as opposed to high speed roads? Certainly the accident-death ratio must be lower on Motorways isnt it? And whats the percentage revenue of these cameras? i'd bet its far higher than those around ''accident blackspots'' in built up areas...?
If the justification of cameras is upon life saving grounds - within 30 mph zones and 40 zones reductions make a difference - the idea that the faster a ton of metal hits you, the more it hurts.
BUT
With so many cameras, especially up near me in Greater Mancs, on A-Roads, annd Mobile lasers on national speed limited roads and motorways, whats the actual percentage of cameras in 30/40 zones as opposed to high speed roads? Certainly the accident-death ratio must be lower on Motorways isnt it? And whats the percentage revenue of these cameras? i'd bet its far higher than those around ''accident blackspots'' in built up areas...?
RickApple said:
Um, should of put this in the first one - a few more thoughts!
If the justification of cameras is upon life saving grounds - within 30 mph zones and 40 zones reductions make a difference - the idea that the faster a ton of metal hits you, the more it hurts.
BUT
With so many cameras, especially up near me in Greater Mancs, on A-Roads, annd Mobile lasers on national speed limited roads and motorways, whats the actual percentage of cameras in 30/40 zones as opposed to high speed roads? Certainly the accident-death ratio must be lower on Motorways isnt it? And whats the percentage revenue of these cameras? i'd bet its far higher than those around ''accident blackspots'' in built up areas...?
You are so right mate.
I am sure that there ARE more accidents in 30 mph posted limits, SO WHY ARE'NT THERE MANY (ANY) CAMERAS IN THESE AREA'S. They are largely on motorways and A roads where, by THEIR own admission there are far fewer accidents. We all know why the cameras are in these locations dont we!! I and many others would'nt have so much of an issue with cameras if they were in built up areas etc, and less of them on motorways and A roads.
Yes, the recent government propaganda repackaged.
I think that's because the Scamera Partnerships are only responsible for what happens at their camera sites. The police
are responsible for the rest of the road network.
>> Edited by Peter Ward on Friday 3rd September 10:22
supraman2954 said:
It is interesting to note the number of times the phrase "at speed camera sites" was used within the article, yet not once did it comment on the national picture, which we all know to be worsening.
I think that's because the Scamera Partnerships are only responsible for what happens at their camera sites. The police
are responsible for the rest of the road network. >> Edited by Peter Ward on Friday 3rd September 10:22
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