Ignition 45 deg retarded.
Discussion
Using a timing light I see that my timing is exactly 45 degrees retarded, which is why it won't run properly.
I drove the car for 2 years during which all seemed OK. Then did a full body off, outrigger replacement job. So some 5 years on everything is back together. The engine does not tick over at the correct speed and it couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding untill it gets to 2200RPM. During the time the engine was out of the car. I never removed or touched the distributor so the ignition should not have changed. During the time the engine was out I did turn it upside down and rotated it a few times. I know that the timing mark is correct and looking at the position of the rotor it is 45 degrees out. So any ideas as to what could have changed ? Timing chain skipped a cog ? drive to distributor shifted ?. Looking at all the pics of the engine before taking everything apart, everything looks to be in the right place.
Any ideas greatfully received.
I could take the distributor out and put it back in, in the correct position but really want to understand why it is now different and exactly 45 degrees out.
I drove the car for 2 years during which all seemed OK. Then did a full body off, outrigger replacement job. So some 5 years on everything is back together. The engine does not tick over at the correct speed and it couldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding untill it gets to 2200RPM. During the time the engine was out of the car. I never removed or touched the distributor so the ignition should not have changed. During the time the engine was out I did turn it upside down and rotated it a few times. I know that the timing mark is correct and looking at the position of the rotor it is 45 degrees out. So any ideas as to what could have changed ? Timing chain skipped a cog ? drive to distributor shifted ?. Looking at all the pics of the engine before taking everything apart, everything looks to be in the right place.
Any ideas greatfully received.
I could take the distributor out and put it back in, in the correct position but really want to understand why it is now different and exactly 45 degrees out.
Do i read it right that you havent touched the engine, rebuild wise.
If that is the case and the distributor hasnt been removed / touched, then i would say it is impossible for the timing to alter.
If the timing is out you have no choice other than to set it all up correctly. Go for 28 btdc with vac advance disconnected.
maybe you have moved it in the 5yrs and just forgot.
If that is the case and the distributor hasnt been removed / touched, then i would say it is impossible for the timing to alter.
If the timing is out you have no choice other than to set it all up correctly. Go for 28 btdc with vac advance disconnected.
maybe you have moved it in the 5yrs and just forgot.
Hedgehopper said:
Could it be that the distributor clamp plate is not tight enough and that you have knocked or lent on the distributor whilst replacing the bodyshell? Try turning the distributor body by hand to see if it is clamped up properly.
Its tight and the distributor won't move.OK this doesn't sound true. The timing can't be 45deg out if you say the rotor is 45deg out .. the rotor is cam driven and spins at half engine speed so if the rotor is 45deg out the timing (measured in crank degrees) must 90 deg out.
45deg of crank timing out would be 22.5deg at the rotor arm..
45deg of crank timing out would be 22.5deg at the rotor arm..
The engine is 8 cylinders, so the distributor rotates 360 degrees meaning each individual spark lead is 45 degrees from the previous one.
Are you sure you are testing using No1 lead for your timimg light ? or have you accidentally put the gun on number 8 lead which is exactly 45 degrees out of whack with No1 lead.
Sitting in the drivers seat the cylinders are as follows:
Left bank from the front 1,3,5,7
Right Bank from the front 2,4,6,8
Firing order is 1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2
Are you sure you are testing using No1 lead for your timimg light ? or have you accidentally put the gun on number 8 lead which is exactly 45 degrees out of whack with No1 lead.
Sitting in the drivers seat the cylinders are as follows:
Left bank from the front 1,3,5,7
Right Bank from the front 2,4,6,8
Firing order is 1,8,4,3,6,5,7,2
spitfire4v8 said:
OK this doesn't sound true. The timing can't be 45deg out if you say the rotor is 45deg out .. the rotor is cam driven and spins at half engine speed so if the rotor is 45deg out the timing (measured in crank degrees) must 90 deg out. 45deg of crank timing out would be 22.5deg at the rotor arm..
Sorry yes, with the crank at TDC the rotor is pointing between plugs so not 45 degrees out. So as you say its 22.5 Degrees out. Next thing to check is the timing of the cam. I am assuming that as the crank approaches TDC on cylinder 1 then the exhaust valve should be closing, at TDC valves closed and just after TDC the inlet valve should start to open.
blazeaway, that still wouldn't account for the anomoly. the 8 firing events are spread over 2 engine rotations so 720deg. 720/8 is 90 deg so putting the timing light onto lead 8 would mean the timing was 90 deg of crank degrees out. sounds like something has moved to shift the rotor and dizzy trigger 22.5deg out. So what the op needs to find is something that has 16 teeth/divisions in a 360deg circle.
Over to you OP
But whatever you find won't be good news i bet.
Over to you OP
But whatever you find won't be good news i bet.- unless the dizzy has just been knocked after all.
honest too 
Quick play with the car today. Re checked TDC and found that it was not the mark that I thought it was, and there was a mark on the damper with a T. So using this the timing is 6 deg retarded, so its 14 deg out. So it could be that the distributor got knocked when removing the engine etc.
I can't twist the distributor, its not loose. I can see the clamp nut but with the power steering pump in place I can't see an easy way to loosen it so that I can rotate the distributor to its correct position, any ideas ??
I can't twist the distributor, its not loose. I can see the clamp nut but with the power steering pump in place I can't see an easy way to loosen it so that I can rotate the distributor to its correct position, any ideas ??
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