Speedlite with studio lighting question

[XKjimmy]

Hi all,

I have recently purchased the Elinchrom 400/400 D-Lite 4 RX Softbox Kit, It comes with their 'Skyport' for wireless triggering.

I also have a Canon 430 EXii speedlite, I would like to use this as a hair light or to light up the background. Is there any way I can get this to trigger with the two strobes?

Many thanks

James.

[Simpo Two]

Can it be set to 'slave', ie simply fire when it sees another flash? If not maybe use that as the master and the Elinchroms should slave to it.

[MartinP]

The 430 can't be set to slave, but you can get optical slave triggers for speedlights for not too much money. I'm not familiar with the Skyport system, but you could check if there is a wireless receiver available for speedlights, that would be a lot more expensive though.

[XKjimmy]

Many thanks guys.

Had a look at the 'optical slave trigger' idea, Found this on Amazon that looks promising, should do the job.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Maxsima-Optical-trigger-Fl...

[LongQ]

I thought the 430Ex II could be used as a remotely triggered unit but may be wrong.

However if you are using Skyports you should be able to get a receiver (Skyport Universal kit or just a receiver) to use with it. Check out the connections to get the right cable arrangement though. Despite a number of options I find I didn't have the right set of connectors to use a Skyport with my 580EX II when I looked at it the other day. It's a matter of hacing the right male/female end for the Speedlite's PC socket and the correct size jack plug/adapter for the Skyport. All my cables and connectors have been purchased with the intention of using with old Metz guns. So wrong ends on the PC cables. Ebay if you are happy to look at 'used' kit. Not sure if the older Skyports are totally compatible with the newer ones it those are what you have with your lighting kit. I guess they should be unless new fancy features have been introduced. If I was in the market I would call call the guys at The Flash Centre to find out if there were any quirks to be aware of.

Skyports work well with speedlites btw. You might want a grid/snoot on the 430 for hightlight use.

[XKjimmy]

Many thanks for that LongQ

Good link that to the flash centre,

Looking at that link http://www.theflashcentre.com/skyport-universal-re... could be what I'm after then, I think there is a transmitter that comes with the D lite 4 kit hopefully.
Had a look on my 430EXii and there doesn't seem to be a PC shot, its blanked out
I may give the flash centre a ring, see if there is a hot shoe adaptor that can go from the Skyport reciever to the 430exii maybe.

I'll look on the site for a grid or snoot too

Cheers

James.

[Simpo Two]

Once you get into studio lighting I think Speedlights are too small and too complicated. Why not get a little Elinchrom to go with the other two?

www.wexphotographic.com/buy-elinchrom-d-lite-one-r...

[LongQ]

XKjimmy said:

Many thanks for that LongQ

Good link that to the flash centre,

Looking at that link http://www.theflashcentre.com/skyport-universal-re... could be what I'm after then, I think there is a transmitter that comes with the D lite 4 kit hopefully.
Had a look on my 430EXii and there doesn't seem to be a PC shot, its blanked out
I may give the flash centre a ring, see if there is a hot shoe adaptor that can go from the Skyport reciever to the 430exii maybe.

I'll look on the site for a grid or snoot too

Cheers

James.

Hi James,

I think the "Speed" version is the model that replaced mine. Looks similar but they added a few tweaks iirc.

You should be able to get a suitable foot based attachment if required - think I have one in the kit somewhere for that very reason though I don't recall ever using it.

I'll check the 430 II documentation and compare to 580 II. I would be surprised if they removed all forms of external control but then you just never can tell. I guess studying the latest Pocket Wizard devices will tell us how Canon are likly to think in the future.

I've always found TFC very helpful and friendly. I mostly talk to the people in Brum since they are closest to me be all I have met at Focus on Imaging over the years have been great.

[LongQ]

LongQ said:

XKjimmy said:

Many thanks for that LongQ

Good link that to the flash centre,

Looking at that link http://www.theflashcentre.com/skyport-universal-re... could be what I'm after then, I think there is a transmitter that comes with the D lite 4 kit hopefully.
Had a look on my 430EXii and there doesn't seem to be a PC shot, its blanked out
I may give the flash centre a ring, see if there is a hot shoe adaptor that can go from the Skyport reciever to the 430exii maybe.

I'll look on the site for a grid or snoot too

Cheers

James.

Hi James,

I think the "Speed" version is the model that replaced mine. Looks similar but they added a few tweaks iirc.

You should be able to get a suitable foot based attachment if required - think I have one in the kit somewhere for that very reason though I don't recall ever using it.

I'll check the 430 II documentation and compare to 580 II. I would be surprised if they removed all forms of external control but then you just never can tell. I guess studying the latest Pocket Wizard devices will tell us how Canon are likly to think in the future.

I've always found TFC very helpful and friendly. I mostly talk to the people in Brum since they are closest to me be all I have met at Focus on Imaging over the years have been great.

OK, looks like Canon expect everyone to want to use ETTL so provide the OC3 cable for off-camera use - which doesn't get you too far forward. You should be able to a dummy mount for the flash foot as you suggested. The one I have is for camera mounting with snother device piggy backed on it and a PC socket for firing an external device (or via an external device). To be honest if anyone makes on with a jack socket and a jack to jack cable is available that would be better. Beware jack sizes. Typical camera remote sockets are smaller jacks than the Skyport receivers use so an adapter may be required unless you can locate a suitable cable. The same may be true for foot mount adapters as well, though the ones I have seen so far have all been PC sockets.


ETA: Search for Kaiser for the adapter

1303 provides a foot adapter with both mounting foot and screw thread in the base (good for light stands/tripod mounting) and a 3.5MM jack plug for direct connection to the Skyport receiver.

Alternatives with PC sockets are available and a little cheaper.

Edited by LongQ on Thursday 13th December 13:47

[XKjimmy]

Simpo Two said:

Once you get into studio lighting I think Speedlights are too small and too complicated. Why not get a little Elinchrom to go with the other two?

www.wexphotographic.com/buy-elinchrom-d-lite-one-r...

Hi Simpo,
Couid well be the best option that in the long run, certainly something I would like to get into. Good price that too, doesn't seem much more than the skyport receiver.

[XKjimmy]

Many thanks for the info LongQ, very informative that : ) Certainly a bit to think about with the different sized jacks. Thanks for the info on that adaptor too, I'll look into that. With the flash centre, I think I'll give the ones in Birmingham a ring too as they are close to me.

[Simpo Two]

XKjimmy said:

Couid well be the best option that in the long run, certainly something I would like to get into. Good price that too, doesn't seem much more than the skyport receiver.

Yep. In essence, stop faffing about with strap-on widgets and man up

[LongQ]

Simpo Two said:

XKjimmy said:

Couid well be the best option that in the long run, certainly something I would like to get into. Good price that too, doesn't seem much more than the skyport receiver.

Yep. In essence, stop faffing about with strap-on widgets and man up

Hehe. Forget creativity and flexibility and buckle down to the treadmill.]

Simpo may be right. Providing you have the power and connections to drive it. Strobist viagra. Your call.

[Simpo Two]

LongQ said:

Hehe. Forget creativity and flexibility and buckle down to the treadmill.

Studio lighting gives unlimited creativity, and much more power. Can you put a 4' octabox or beauty dish or honeycomb or gobo on a flashgun?

LongQ said:

Providing you have the power and connections to drive it. Strobist viagra. Your call.

All you need is a mains socket; they slave from each other. Studio lighting can be intimidating at first but really, it's only limited by your imagination and bits of cardboard

[XKjimmy]

Both are very tempting, before I bought the Elinchrom 400 D-lite kit I was considering having a studio set up using Speedlites, 580 EXiis or the new 600 that I could take on location too. under their own power.

I have a room planned out for the studio shots, should be enough room. Got my fold out back drop delivered today, the strobes should be here tomorrow, looking forward to having a play

[LongQ]

I think it makes sense to use pukka studio lighting kit when you expect to have a studio that is large enough and permanent enough to justify that approach.

Back in analogue and B&W days my father has some mostly smallish lights with modifiers of sorts to undertake occasional portrait shoots and so on. All good fun and mostly incandescent bulbs back then.

This was an impermanent set of kit so a room could be converted to a studio when required. All mains powered of course.

Today one would want to use strobes and work in colour. Add portability on to that and the potential for operating in a very small area with the lights in close (much heat produced on the old days so not ideal to work in close) and the flash vs studio consideration changes a little, especially if mobility is a potential part of the mix.

If one follows something like the Strobist blog - basically a mobile studio challenge rather than fixed studio so it mixes up portable studio lighting and sets of flash guns - it's clear that there is a case for both types of equipment depending on needs and circumstances. (Notably whether there is power available for lighting the area required.)

If you have a dedicated room, the space in it and need the power and control then the studio based system would be the way to go if mobility is a very secondary need.

If you need temporary deployment, portability, lack space and donpt really need a lot of light output on a regualr basis then investment in camera oriented flash units for use off camera might suit well. Having both couls be ideal - the lighting knowledge will be complementary between systems even if the mether of working is a little different.

[XKjimmy]

I have a recently spare room at my flat, Im planning to put the lighting and the back drop all in there

In an ideal world, I would have liked to be able to pick them up and take them on location work too. They could be ok as they are quite small units with carry cases, powering them could be an issue on location though.

I may try and combine those and speed lites in the future maybe.

[LongQ]

XKjimmy said:

I have a recently spare room at my flat, Im planning to put the lighting and the back drop all in there

In an ideal world, I would have liked to be able to pick them up and take them on location work too. They could be ok as they are quite small units with carry cases, powering them could be an issue on location though.

I may try and combine those and speed lites in the future maybe.

I think you would need something like the Elinchrom Ranger system for regular on location outdoor work. Or indoor if power supply was not a given. Iirc Mark Mullen can offer some opinions on that option.

They come with a fairly hefty battery system - and a fairly hefty price to go with it.

You can get some chunky "designed for flash use" battery systems. Expensive of course but useful when there are no options. I rented one for a weekend once. Although my original plan didn't work out and the weather made a mess of plan B the batteries proved their value by allowing me to re-charge stuff on the move in a way that I could not have managed readily using a car invertor and when there was not enough time overnight back home to recharge everything before heading off for day 2.

But they are expensive and take some justify to rent let alone purchase!

[Simpo Two]

If the OP wants to operate where there's no mains then Speedlights would be the better way to go I think, as Rangers etc are VERY expensive. But there's a limit to what 4xAA batteries can do, and the light source is much smaller if you're thinking about shadows.

How long/well would a 12V car battery with inverter work I wonder?

[markmullen]

I've just bought my own set of Quadra Rangers having used them a lot before on magazine shoots through work with pro car photographers, they're so good I decided I needed my own set.

Whilst expensive they offer power and flexibility with modifiers which you don't get with a handful of speedlites. The two head kit that I've got comes in its own briefcase with two heads, two batteries and a pack which powers both heads, and a charger. The heads have Skyport receivers built in and the hotshoe transmitter gives up to 100m range. From the transmitter you can turn the LED modelling light on or off and even adjust the power of the heads. If you're shooting teathered you can get Elinchrom software to control the lights from your laptop, whether that be just the quadra rangers or other equipped Elinchrom lights. There is even an iPod app to control them! They've got an optical slave which can even be taught to ignore redeye pre-flash so you can use an existing speedlite as fill flash.

The Flash Centre hire the kit out, IMO well worth trying them, whilst they're not cheap if you look at the price of a set of high end speedlites and associated triggering system (whether the manufacturers own trigger or with pocket wizard etc) you'll not be fAr away from a set of much more powerful and flexible lights.