Articulated lorries delivering to a stupid place
Discussion
Near to where I work there is a small builders merchants, access to this place is terrible and there is only one way in, one way out (for lorries at least). When an artic delivers to this site it causes absolute mayhem, some lorries drive to the site and reverse out to the nearest turning spot (150-200m back along the main road and then turn on a nasty bend/junction in the middle of the road) others reverse in and drive out, both are as bad as each other for other road users. Below is a map:
The green shows the start of the Builders yard, the red is the area the lorries normally turn. approx 200m past the builders yard is a sharp bend with a railway bridge that they are not allowed to travel under (see last picture).
Last Thursday I came in to work 07:05am and there he is, a big red artic smack bang in the middle of the road reversing, I patiently wait watching him trying to reverse this lorry down the main road & despite being perfectly straight, hes twisting and turning and appears to be making a right pigs ear of it*, although in his defense it was dark (and he did have his hazards on, you can do what ever the f*** you want as long as your hazards are on right?), eventually he came to the bend and here he really ran into trouble, after numerous attempts he then gets round, I assume hes as fed up as me and decides to just park the lorry poorly (miles off the kerb) and flash me past, as I was late for work I accepted the offer and mounted the high(ish) kerb to get past. I was one of 3 cars that then passed him and as we did I noticed there was another 5 cars the other side whom I assume had had to reverse back with the truck until he was eventually happy he had got to his destination. Heres the corner that he struggled with:
07:05am this Thursday I come round the corner, "F***", there he is and he's already in the road, the Berlingo in front of me to my surprise attempts to go round him, hang on hes on the kerb, we can pass on the left handside - I'm delighted by this and promptly follow Mr Berlingo, then its revealed that the Berlingo is visiting "Clive Sinclair Motors", the Berlingo indicates and waits, after 20 or 30 secs Mr Berlingo gets out of the van and says something to the truck driver, the lorry starts moving, I think to myself "thats OK, he will just move back 15-20 yards to expose the gate", did he f***, here he goes, Mr Snake Reverser himself has been awoken and is attempting to reverse his truck all the way down the road again. This time he makes a bigger balls up of it, 15 minutes it took him to get 150m or so before he came to a stop, again I had to mount the kerb when he eventually did decide he had arrived (thank god for the hazards or I would have been p****d). This time there were 6 or 7 cars held up by him.
I appreciate lorries have to make deliveries, however, how this builders merchants ever got planning is beyond me. In today's Health & Safety mad world is it really acceptable to reverse a 50 foot lorry 150 metres down a public highway, in the dark alongside a pavement and round a blind bend? On top of that, when the lorries do turn they cause even more aggro, the turning spot "cuts off" 10 or more businesses and causes a severe risk to members of the public that frequently walk around this area. I have seen 20+ cars held up for 10-15 minutes by lorries turning at this location, obviously at peek times it can make the situation 10 times worse.
Also, when the lorries do arrive at their destination, they are parked on the main road and unloaded from this location, they then have a forklift unload the truck which again totally blocks the road for 2-3 minutes each time, assume the lorry is carrying 29 pallets that means the road is intermittently blocked for an hour or so.
I am fed up of these lorries, I don't think I should have to wait for them, I don't blame the haulage firms or the drivers, more the builders merchants, If you look at the photo above you can see that the yard could be adjusted to accept lorries, basically open the big yellow gates, unload and create enough space for the lorry to maneuver around the building inside the yard perimeter (a church) and then exit through one of two entrance/exits they have to the yard.
On top of all this, you then get lorry drivers that know best and think the railway bridge signs are under estimating their actual clearance
:
Should I write to the council about the inconvenience and H&S risk these things cause? I'm guessing a letter to the builders merchants would be put straight into the shredder. Any advice/comments would be appreciated.
/rantover
* I have not driven artics to comment how easy they are to reverse straight, I have driven articulated dump trucks and know that if there is a slight "kink" in the articulation, both mirrors are pretty much useless, which this guy must be the entire time hes reversing going by his snake impression
The green shows the start of the Builders yard, the red is the area the lorries normally turn. approx 200m past the builders yard is a sharp bend with a railway bridge that they are not allowed to travel under (see last picture).
Last Thursday I came in to work 07:05am and there he is, a big red artic smack bang in the middle of the road reversing, I patiently wait watching him trying to reverse this lorry down the main road & despite being perfectly straight, hes twisting and turning and appears to be making a right pigs ear of it*, although in his defense it was dark (and he did have his hazards on, you can do what ever the f*** you want as long as your hazards are on right?), eventually he came to the bend and here he really ran into trouble, after numerous attempts he then gets round, I assume hes as fed up as me and decides to just park the lorry poorly (miles off the kerb) and flash me past, as I was late for work I accepted the offer and mounted the high(ish) kerb to get past. I was one of 3 cars that then passed him and as we did I noticed there was another 5 cars the other side whom I assume had had to reverse back with the truck until he was eventually happy he had got to his destination. Heres the corner that he struggled with:
07:05am this Thursday I come round the corner, "F***", there he is and he's already in the road, the Berlingo in front of me to my surprise attempts to go round him, hang on hes on the kerb, we can pass on the left handside - I'm delighted by this and promptly follow Mr Berlingo, then its revealed that the Berlingo is visiting "Clive Sinclair Motors", the Berlingo indicates and waits, after 20 or 30 secs Mr Berlingo gets out of the van and says something to the truck driver, the lorry starts moving, I think to myself "thats OK, he will just move back 15-20 yards to expose the gate", did he f***, here he goes, Mr Snake Reverser himself has been awoken and is attempting to reverse his truck all the way down the road again. This time he makes a bigger balls up of it, 15 minutes it took him to get 150m or so before he came to a stop, again I had to mount the kerb when he eventually did decide he had arrived (thank god for the hazards or I would have been p****d). This time there were 6 or 7 cars held up by him.
I appreciate lorries have to make deliveries, however, how this builders merchants ever got planning is beyond me. In today's Health & Safety mad world is it really acceptable to reverse a 50 foot lorry 150 metres down a public highway, in the dark alongside a pavement and round a blind bend? On top of that, when the lorries do turn they cause even more aggro, the turning spot "cuts off" 10 or more businesses and causes a severe risk to members of the public that frequently walk around this area. I have seen 20+ cars held up for 10-15 minutes by lorries turning at this location, obviously at peek times it can make the situation 10 times worse.
Also, when the lorries do arrive at their destination, they are parked on the main road and unloaded from this location, they then have a forklift unload the truck which again totally blocks the road for 2-3 minutes each time, assume the lorry is carrying 29 pallets that means the road is intermittently blocked for an hour or so.
I am fed up of these lorries, I don't think I should have to wait for them, I don't blame the haulage firms or the drivers, more the builders merchants, If you look at the photo above you can see that the yard could be adjusted to accept lorries, basically open the big yellow gates, unload and create enough space for the lorry to maneuver around the building inside the yard perimeter (a church) and then exit through one of two entrance/exits they have to the yard.
On top of all this, you then get lorry drivers that know best and think the railway bridge signs are under estimating their actual clearance
: Should I write to the council about the inconvenience and H&S risk these things cause? I'm guessing a letter to the builders merchants would be put straight into the shredder. Any advice/comments would be appreciated.
/rantover
* I have not driven artics to comment how easy they are to reverse straight, I have driven articulated dump trucks and know that if there is a slight "kink" in the articulation, both mirrors are pretty much useless, which this guy must be the entire time hes reversing going by his snake impression
"Clive Sinclair Motors"....that rocks! He's fallen a loooong way.
You should probably contact the council/environmental health/highways department...that's what they're there for. Keep a diary of the issues with evidence and see what they can do.
You should probably contact the council/environmental health/highways department...that's what they're there for. Keep a diary of the issues with evidence and see what they can do.
Edited by WheresMyCar on Thursday 13th December 09:12
Tuvra said:
[i]* I have not driven artics to comment how easy they are to reverse straight,
Extremely easy compared with most other things. The longer the distance from the pivot to the axle, the easier it is. TO be fair it's not very often you see one being reversed badly, in a dangerous place yes, but they don't normally wiggle down the road.He must be a fairly new driver (if its the same one) as all the other drivers I know wouldn't wiggle the truck when reverseing (sp?) we have simialr places that we deliver to with less clearence on each side and dont have a problem getting in and out the bridges do actually underestimate the height slightly in order to account for inacurracies in the measurement as we had a bridge near our firm that said 14ft but our truck that was supposedly 14ft 2 would fit underneath (vosa supplied the vehicle height)
Himself said:
Extremely easy compared with most other things. The longer the distance from the pivot to the axle, the easier it is. TO be fair it's not very often you see one being reversed badly, in a dangerous place yes, but they don't normally wiggle down the road.
With a regular box trailer you can never see whats directly behind, so an artic will often meander when reversing in a straight line so that the driver can keep an eye on what's directly behind. May not be what the OP is referring to though.West4x4 said:
Whats the alternative? Shut the builder yard down? make them move?
Or just be a bit more patient maybe leave a little earlier and miss him?
How about opening up the entrance/exit to allow the vehicles to turn within the builders yard? (as suggested in the OP)Or just be a bit more patient maybe leave a little earlier and miss him?
Provide a spotter to assist the drivers in maneouvreing away from the premises?
Specify a maximum vehicle size to their suppliers? (We used to run a book business from my parents' farm and were clear with all suppliers that we couldn't accomodate anything over about 15 tons)
Move the business to a more appropriate location?
Would there be any conditions placed on the planning permission regarding vehicles and access? (assuming permission has been granted)
williredale said:
Is that Neath? I've been stuck there behind a lorry as well!
oldcynic said:
How about opening up the entrance/exit to allow the vehicles to turn within the builders yard? (as suggested in the OP)
Provide a spotter to assist the drivers in maneouvreing away from the premises?
Specify a maximum vehicle size to their suppliers? (We used to run a book business from my parents' farm and were clear with all suppliers that we couldn't accomodate anything over about 15 tons)
Move the business to a more appropriate location?
Would there be any conditions placed on the planning permission regarding vehicles and access? (assuming permission has been granted)
Exactly, saying I should be more patient is rediculous, what should I do, add 20-30 minutes on to my day because Pravis Terkins are taking delivery of paving slabs? Not only is it annoying, the past two Thursdays its been damn right dangerous, the lorry concerned is a curtain sider and to be fair he probably hasn't got a clue whats behind him or to the side of him, it is after all 7am and pitch black, this causes (IMO) an unacceptable level of Risk which could be controlled very easily by allowing the Lorry to enter, turn, unload and leave all within the yard.Provide a spotter to assist the drivers in maneouvreing away from the premises?
Specify a maximum vehicle size to their suppliers? (We used to run a book business from my parents' farm and were clear with all suppliers that we couldn't accomodate anything over about 15 tons)
Move the business to a more appropriate location?
Would there be any conditions placed on the planning permission regarding vehicles and access? (assuming permission has been granted)
I assume the floor space is valuable storage so they find it acceptable to use the public highway as a turning/unloading/reversing area. All whilst causing absolute mayhem.
Looking on street view I can't get a proper picture but it doesn't look 200m to me.
Having said that I don't think it's a bad manoeuvre to have to do. We have similar!
The best way to do it is to back down from the main road (good side reverse) then follow it down the wall side. I could go from coming up to that junction to being outside the gates in under 2 minutes.
Maybe they just send incompetent drivers?
Moving on... You can screw an artic round in less space than its full length. So you'd need at least 16 meters diameter of free space.
Best way to me is to get rid of the entrance/exit gates being seperate and make it one big gate. Stacks of room to get it round then.
Having said that I don't think it's a bad manoeuvre to have to do. We have similar!
The best way to do it is to back down from the main road (good side reverse) then follow it down the wall side. I could go from coming up to that junction to being outside the gates in under 2 minutes.
Maybe they just send incompetent drivers?
Moving on... You can screw an artic round in less space than its full length. So you'd need at least 16 meters diameter of free space.
Best way to me is to get rid of the entrance/exit gates being seperate and make it one big gate. Stacks of room to get it round then.
heebeegeetee said:
Rovinghawk said:
Why should OP have to change his way of doing things due to someone else's problems?
Same reason that possibly every single one of us sets our schedule to avoiding the worst of the traffic?RH
Rovinghawk said:
Their business model shouldn't include MoPs having to wait for them.
RH
Where do you draw the line?RH
When one of their delivery trucks is cruising down a SC at 40mph, MoP's are waiting behind it!
There's nothing wrong with what they have going on.. Problem is the drivers.
No reason why it should hold anyone up for more than 2 minutes.
I'm sure even the OP would be ok with that?
Tuvra said:
I am fed up of these lorries, I don't think I should have to wait for them,
Sums up your post. The road is a short one on an industrial estate, can't you just go up the other end?
The disturbance happened at 0705, which I would guess is intentionally early so as to inconvenience the fewest people.
Rovinghawk said:
My point is this: remove the problem rather than having to work around it. If TP have to use the public highway as a manoeuvring area then they are doing something wrong. Their business model shouldn't include MoPs having to wait for them.
RH
Well, we all have to wait for considerable lengths of time when we're all out and about at peak times, and you'll be contributing your bit to the delays we all have to suffer, but presumably it's ok for you to delay people but not for anyone else.RH
Certainly that the's the mindset of millions of car drivers out there.
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