Fuel tanks removal.
Discussion
My 1987 280i has been sitting in my garage for at least five years, and I am SLOWLY working on getting it running. I have done much of the upholstery and some of the electrics.
There is that distinctive old petrol smell from a few fuel lines around the plenum. I want to start by cleaning the tanks, replacing fuel lines at the back. Then flush some clean petrol through to a new filter. Does this sound like a plan?
My main question is . . What is the easiest way to remove the tanks?
Wilf.
There is that distinctive old petrol smell from a few fuel lines around the plenum. I want to start by cleaning the tanks, replacing fuel lines at the back. Then flush some clean petrol through to a new filter. Does this sound like a plan?
My main question is . . What is the easiest way to remove the tanks?
Wilf.
Wedg1e said:
Either lift the bodyshell or strip the rear suspension off.
Agree..On mine the passenger side..(RHD) came out with a bit of wiggling but the drivers side was totally inaccessible and so the rear suspension and exhaust system had to come off..Do you have a leak from the tank?..I have had more leaks on the filler neck hose..The hose size is an awkward one too and the type of hose is a bit particular..ZigaThanks Ian and Mark. That is what I suspected. (but not what I wanted to hear!)
No, I do not believe I have a leak; there sometimes was a slight smell, but I assumed it was the hoses. I can get hold of the right size and type of hoses.
Is there a way to flush the tanks thoroughly in place? Especially the second one (without a filler) Maybe I will just run some fresh petrol with nasty chemicals through.
Wilf.
No, I do not believe I have a leak; there sometimes was a slight smell, but I assumed it was the hoses. I can get hold of the right size and type of hoses.
Is there a way to flush the tanks thoroughly in place? Especially the second one (without a filler) Maybe I will just run some fresh petrol with nasty chemicals through.
Wilf.
Hi Mate..I would first check for leaks..Even around the welded seams that attach the inlet and breather collars/tubes to the tank..And do that on all points of fixings..Check condition of hoses..Check the rollover valve,The smell could be the breather pipe to atmosphere..It could be the filler neck pipe...There are things you can buy to flush fuel tanks in sitchu but i wouldnt recommend it..Check the condition of the fuel in a jar..Pre-filter if poss..You might be able to fit a cleanable fuel filer pre-pump but will have to check..If you suspect that the fuel tanks are going rusty then its removal time..
If you have a swirlpot that should have a mesh filter pre-pump but they can fail and the swirlpot can rust!!..Can you smell it in any particular area?..People have used malt vinegar in tanks, Obviously with it removed, The vinegar is left to soak inside the tank for a couple of days..They use bottle brushes were they can and then flush with petrol, There are other products but no sure what to suggest...If they are having to come out then maybe look at getting them cleaned and then plastic lined/coated..Ziga
If you have a swirlpot that should have a mesh filter pre-pump but they can fail and the swirlpot can rust!!..Can you smell it in any particular area?..People have used malt vinegar in tanks, Obviously with it removed, The vinegar is left to soak inside the tank for a couple of days..They use bottle brushes were they can and then flush with petrol, There are other products but no sure what to suggest...If they are having to come out then maybe look at getting them cleaned and then plastic lined/coated..Ziga
Edited by mrzigazaga on Sunday 30th December 17:05
Can you actually get the right hand one out with the body on? I know I couldn't on my 200. I took the Opportunity to remove the tank when I had the trailing arms off a few years ago and I couldn't get it out. I reckon you'd have to cut a wee bit of the shell or lift it. If anyone has managed it please tell us how!
Tasmin200 said:
Can you actually get the right hand one out with the body on? I know I couldn't on my 200. I took the Opportunity to remove the tank when I had the trailing arms off a few years ago and I couldn't get it out. I reckon you'd have to cut a wee bit of the shell or lift it. If anyone has managed it please tell us how!
Hi Mate..My fuel tanks had to be removed when i first got the car to the ford garage, He did manage to remove the passenger side fuel tank without to much fuss...I know the exhaust was removed..It was a different story trying to get the drivers side out and that was the one that was rusty..Someone had already plasticized the passenger side..But had not done the drivers side due to it being a pig to get out...cheers..Zigamay sound obvious, but ...
On mine (82 2.8) I got some smells too -
I discovered the fuel return pipe near the tank had corroded/degraded to the point where it was leaking a few drops now and then, and also there was a PLASTIC T piece in the fuel supply (from each tank to the pump) which I assume was not original, which also was a bit wet.
Replaced pipes and T piece and now I just occasionally get a fuel smell when parked, from the breather pipe when tank(s) are full.
On mine (82 2.8) I got some smells too -
I discovered the fuel return pipe near the tank had corroded/degraded to the point where it was leaking a few drops now and then, and also there was a PLASTIC T piece in the fuel supply (from each tank to the pump) which I assume was not original, which also was a bit wet.
Replaced pipes and T piece and now I just occasionally get a fuel smell when parked, from the breather pipe when tank(s) are full.
Thanks, everybody - I think!
I was hoping there was a magic solution. I always believed the smells were from the filler hose (which was a bit loose, or the vent. At worst the hoses to the swirl pot. Now I am in the mood to change these, but don't want to waste time if the tanks are full of grunge, or what ever has found its way in during its 26 year life. Tomorrow I will get underneath and see what I see.
I wanted to be methodical - first check the filler pipe, then the tanks, then work my way forward making sure each part is good. So far I have cranked the engine (with the ignition and fuel pump both off) making no attempt to get her running.
Tomorrow is another day - and the day after is another year. So I wish everybody reading this all the best for 2013.
Wilf.
I was hoping there was a magic solution. I always believed the smells were from the filler hose (which was a bit loose, or the vent. At worst the hoses to the swirl pot. Now I am in the mood to change these, but don't want to waste time if the tanks are full of grunge, or what ever has found its way in during its 26 year life. Tomorrow I will get underneath and see what I see.
I wanted to be methodical - first check the filler pipe, then the tanks, then work my way forward making sure each part is good. So far I have cranked the engine (with the ignition and fuel pump both off) making no attempt to get her running.
Tomorrow is another day - and the day after is another year. So I wish everybody reading this all the best for 2013.
Wilf.
I've woken up,wilf I took my tanks out on a 350i about 5 years ago,we had all the body mount bolts out which mean s sills off and access beneath carpets so seats out and seat belt bolts of course, lifted the body up and propped on some 4 x 2 timber using the 4" of lift height,rear suspension was off along with the diff as well,all pipes disconnected and removed a piece of blanking fibreglass against tank in week arch but it came right out in the end, Also remember cutting 1/2" pipe spigot to get tank past chassis tube then rewelde it slightly shorter once out. I redid the seams of the tank which were surprisingly soldered on sparkly clean steel after thinking initially they were welded or silver soldered,but cleaning to a shine then some heat and self cleaning flux and solder job was done. Obviously ensure tanks are safe from existing petrol fumes by using an inert gas for example to purge whilst applying flame. Wooly.
Maybe the first port of call would be to change the bulkhead fuel filter, Tip out the remaining petrol inside it into a jar to see if there are any particles in it..The worst thing you can do is start the car with rust in the fuel..It will get into the metering head..WUR..Lines and injectors and then your job becomes bigger!..Even though there is a small filter inside the metering unit it also can fail due to corrosion and the plunger can stick if left for long periods of time without being used..If you are getting a fuel smell near the plenum then it could be the injector hose under the plenum ..You can just about get to them all without taking off the plenum..Replace the seals if you do remove the injectors..
Also check all the plastic fuel lines coming from the fuel metering unit, These can rupture and replacing them can be a nightmare..Dont use any other type of fuel hose..They can be repaired off the car..I did one of mine that was leaking badly..I used a piece from a secondhand spare one that i obtained from a ford garage..And then heat welded it in place with a soldering iron..Dont remove it from the banjo fitting as they are heat pressed on and its a bit fiddly trying to get them to fit properly..They can be re-designed with copper pipes..(I believe they are copper)..going from the metering head and then into the plastic pipes to the injectors..Hope this helps..Happy new year..Ziga
Also check all the plastic fuel lines coming from the fuel metering unit, These can rupture and replacing them can be a nightmare..Dont use any other type of fuel hose..They can be repaired off the car..I did one of mine that was leaking badly..I used a piece from a secondhand spare one that i obtained from a ford garage..And then heat welded it in place with a soldering iron..Dont remove it from the banjo fitting as they are heat pressed on and its a bit fiddly trying to get them to fit properly..They can be re-designed with copper pipes..(I believe they are copper)..going from the metering head and then into the plastic pipes to the injectors..Hope this helps..Happy new year..Ziga
Again, thanks everybody. Mark you're scaring me a bit! I have taken off the plenum and removed the six injectors. They all look good but I didn't test them. The seals also look good - where can I get new seals? All the lines look good, and hope to get away with just replacing the copper washers to seal all the banjos.
The bad petrol smell the other day was from disconnecting the cold start banjo at the plenum (the "7th injector") That was when I decided to work from the fuel tank forward, correcting whatever I found to be wrong. I thought that today would be the day, but I have to go to my boat first.
At least last night's partying was mild; somebody organized a block party so we can all get to know each other. I've already forgotten their names; I just know them by the cars they drive.
Wilf.
The bad petrol smell the other day was from disconnecting the cold start banjo at the plenum (the "7th injector") That was when I decided to work from the fuel tank forward, correcting whatever I found to be wrong. I thought that today would be the day, but I have to go to my boat first.
At least last night's partying was mild; somebody organized a block party so we can all get to know each other. I've already forgotten their names; I just know them by the cars they drive.
Wilf.
pasogrande said:
where can I get new seals? All the lines look good, and hope to get away with just replacing the copper washers to seal all the banjos.
Hi Wilf..Sorry i didnt mean to worry you..Its just that there are quite a few things that could be the culprit and i was trying to cover them all..The injector seals can be bought as a kit or they are included in a head gasket set for a MK3 2.8i ford capri..The copper washers for the banjos need to be a little softer than just copper washers..Im sure you can use alloy washers, I will call the guy that refurbs the metering heads tomorrow to see if he can send me some and i will forward them on to you..Cheers..Zigahttp://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=f...
PS:If you dont want the whole kit then i can obtain the seals at a cost of 5 GBP + postage.
wooly350i said:
That would smell, cork isnt it?
Yep, the original was cork, and it was falling apart. I replaced it with two home cut gaskets from a sheet of thick (1.5mm?) gasket paper. Hasn't leaked since ! NB. I agree with Zig, probably a good idea to get a new fuel filter - mine had the copper washers included with it.
Edited by RCK974X on Tuesday 1st January 19:47
Edited by RCK974X on Tuesday 1st January 19:48
No worries !! - There's a lot of stuff like that which you can get from plumber's merchants, or a hydraulic hose specialist.
NZ has a big hydraulic/pipe company called NZed - they do all sorts of T pieces, washers, hydraulic fittings, etc. There's a lot of tractors and equipment around the farms !
NZ has a big hydraulic/pipe company called NZed - they do all sorts of T pieces, washers, hydraulic fittings, etc. There's a lot of tractors and equipment around the farms !
Apologies - I have not answered due to an emergency. I had to call an ambulance for my wife; she couldn't breath after what we thought was the 'flu.
I was under the car trying to remove all the petrol lines and stuff (except the tanks), covered in stinking old fuel, when she comes out and mutters something. I knew there is almost nothing that stops her talking so this had to be serious. Anyhow after a night at the hospital where they stuck so many IVs in her and did so many tests she is now home.
Thanks for all the suggestions and offers of help. I believe it is time to close this thread as I will not be removing the tanks at this time. I will shortly start a new thread on progress with the fuel system.
Mark, I will try to email you next week about the injector seals, etc.
Wilf.
I was under the car trying to remove all the petrol lines and stuff (except the tanks), covered in stinking old fuel, when she comes out and mutters something. I knew there is almost nothing that stops her talking so this had to be serious. Anyhow after a night at the hospital where they stuck so many IVs in her and did so many tests she is now home.
Thanks for all the suggestions and offers of help. I believe it is time to close this thread as I will not be removing the tanks at this time. I will shortly start a new thread on progress with the fuel system.
Mark, I will try to email you next week about the injector seals, etc.
Wilf.
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