Posh wine in Lidl

[dazco]

I know nothing whatsoever about wine but I was very surprised to see a chateauneuf du pape in Lidl today.

Just under £12. I am a Lidl fan, and I know they put quality out at a budget, but I thought this wine really was top notch..

What's going on?

[Mobile Chicane]

IMHO, Lidl wine is patchy.

Two which punch above their weight are the 'Cimarosa' South African Merlot at £4.49 (a steal), and the £7.49 Chablis.

Don't bother with the rest.

[otolith]

It's just a controlled name for wine from a particular French region - no guarantee of quality, I've had some pretty ropey ones.

[Pete Franklin]

Well in my experience cndp has never delivered for the price. I guess its a bit like champagne in that the lowest price offerings are never that good, as the wine is expensive to make and the extra money goes into the care of production, blending, etc. Cndp is traditionally a rustic wine and its the name that sells it. I wouldnt expect anything special from a 12 quid bottle but please do prove me wrong.

Edited by Pete Franklin on Saturday 5th January 23:20

[dazco]

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

[dazco]

And on the subject of reds, I bought some of Aldi's award winning Toro Loco wine for £3'59 and subjected my wine drinking chums to a tasting. They said it was outrageously good for the price and many could not believe the price. These are not 'wine people' just people who like a glass now and then.

It will be the house red when my cafe bar opens

[Pete Franklin]

dazco said:

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

Chablis is a region. It has a premium due to heritage like st emilion, sndp, champagne, etc its just chardonnay from a renowned region

[dazco]

Pete Franklin said:

dazco said:

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

Chablis is a region. It has a premium due to heritage like st emilion, sndp, champagne, etc its just chardonnay from a renowned region

thanks, so a any grape can be grown in any region?

anyone saying they only drink chablis is a bit of a knob?

[whoami]

dazco said:

Pete Franklin said:

dazco said:

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

Chablis is a region. It has a premium due to heritage like st emilion, sndp, champagne, etc its just chardonnay from a renowned region

thanks, so a any grape can be grown in any region?

anyone saying they only drink chablis is a bit of a knob?

Chablis is a region, not a grape variety.

[dazco]

whoami said:

dazco said:

Pete Franklin said:

dazco said:

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

Chablis is a region. It has a premium due to heritage like st emilion, sndp, champagne, etc its just chardonnay from a renowned region

thanks, so a any grape can be grown in any region?

anyone saying they only drink chablis is a bit of a knob?

Chablis is a region, not a grape variety.

yeah Pete Franklin said

[whoami]

dazco said:

whoami said:

dazco said:

Pete Franklin said:

dazco said:

Thanks for the information chaps.

Incidentally, I noticed a Chablis was mentioned. I have noticed this always seems to be more expensive than other white wines, is there a reason for this or am I wrong?

Chablis is a region. It has a premium due to heritage like st emilion, sndp, champagne, etc its just chardonnay from a renowned region

thanks, so a any grape can be grown in any region?

anyone saying they only drink chablis is a bit of a knob?

Chablis is a region, not a grape variety.

yeah Pete Franklin said

Ah, so he he did.

Sorry; at least we agreed.

[LooneyTunes]

dazco said:

anyone saying they only drink chablis is a bit of a knob?

As a region, there's quite a bit of diversity between vineyards and producers (some of whom produce some stunning wines). I could see someone seeing it as a fairly "safe" option but there's no way I could limit myself to a chablis only white diet.

The "area under vine" in Chablis increased a lot over the past few decades - effectively they increased the size of the approved area - so there's a lot more wine being produced there with, sadly, a fair bit of this isn't great and is sold due to demand for the name...

Out of interest, did the bottle of cndp happen to mention the producer (for me it's this that sells it, rather than the fact that it is cndp)? Cndp pricing has shot up in the past few years (in spite of there being only one properly ropey vintage in the past 15 years or so) and it's always interesting to see who is selling to the supermarkets.

[LooneyTunes]

dazco said:

It will be the house red when my cafe bar opens

You've mentioned house wines for this venture a couple of times - don't take this the wrong way, but I'd be really careful about re-selling wines from supermarkets.

In many cases the label will say something along the lines of "selected and bottled for Sainsco". If you're selling full bottles then I'd put money on someone spotting that, being curious and finding out (or remembering from their own shopping) your purchase price, and then making waves about margins (which, even if reasonable, can still sound high to Joe Public).

Personally, I'd probably try to find a local wine merchant that can sell you something a little more obscure, but still capable of meeting your margin needs (given where you are, I'd probably have a chat with the guys at Byrnes over in Clitheroe - one of the best wine shops in the NW in terms of range and staff knowledge).

There are also various "trade only" labels that come in at similar price points that customers won't find when they're doing their weekly shop.

Just thought I'd mention it and obviously, irrespective of which way you decide to go, wish you the very best for the venture!

[condor]

Lidl had the Chateauneuf du Pape, the Chablis, a Prosecco and a 10 year Tawny Port chosen by a team of 4 master of wines last September.

Article here

http://www.decanter.com/news/wine-news/530474/lidl...

[LooneyTunes]

condor said:

Lidl had the Chateauneuf du Pape, the Chablis, a Prosecco and a 10 year Tawny Port chosen by a team of 4 master of wines last September.

Article here

http://www.decanter.com/news/wine-news/530474/lidl...

Interesting.

What's more interesting, well to me anyway, is this flyer http://www.lidl-pageflip.com/fsicache/pdf/England/... that implies in a footnote that they're using Parker's/TWA's scale (which only really awards from 50 possible points but, in practice these days seems to run from 85-100) but with significantly different interpretations of what the scores mean (see here for TWA's https://www.erobertparker.com/info/legend.asp)

Still, as a relative comparison within the range, I suppose it's of some use to consumers.

[Hoover.]

LooneyTunes said:

dazco said:

It will be the house red when my cafe bar opens

You've mentioned house wines for this venture a couple of times - don't take this the wrong way, but I'd be really careful about re-selling wines from supermarkets.

In many cases the label will say something along the lines of "selected and bottled for Sainsco". If you're selling full bottles then I'd put money on someone spotting that, being curious and finding out (or remembering from their own shopping) your purchase price, and then making waves about margins (which, even if reasonable, can still sound high to Joe Public).

Totally agree with this, also even if the name isn't on the bottle I've sometimes been out and recognised wines by the lable as on special on Sainsco... this also puts my back up....... I like to feel that I'm getting something specially and from my local supermarket.... just my opinion

[dazco]

LooneyTunes said:

You've mentioned house wines for this venture a couple of times - don't take this the wrong way, but I'd be really careful about re-selling wines from supermarkets.

In many cases the label will say something along the lines of "selected and bottled for Sainsco". If you're selling full bottles then I'd put money on someone spotting that, being curious and finding out (or remembering from their own shopping) your purchase price, and then making waves about margins (which, even if reasonable, can still sound high to Joe Public).

Personally, I'd probably try to find a local wine merchant that can sell you something a little more obscure, but still capable of meeting your margin needs (given where you are, I'd probably have a chat with the guys at Byrnes over in Clitheroe - one of the best wine shops in the NW in terms of range and staff knowledge).

There are also various "trade only" labels that come in at similar price points that customers won't find when they're doing their weekly shop.

Just thought I'd mention it and obviously, irrespective of which way you decide to go, wish you the very best for the venture!

Thanks for the advice, and I will certainly consider it, I had thought about this myself and then decided to crack on with my plan.
I even looked at re-labelling any house wine I found. But I have decided to give my customers the benefit of the doubt that they are understanding enough to know that a profit needs to be made. I would rather give them some good wine for £12 than some ropey wine for £15, and if they challenge me I shall tell them that I considered the wine to be the best for my customers. Some may even thank me to introducing them to such a good value product.

I suppose I could issue the wine in a carafe, hmmm.


The other wine you may have heard me relate to is M&S champagne, I have bought 6 cases of this and intend to sell them at the same price the shop normally sells them for.

Thanks for the tip about Byrnes, I know it well, but I am no longer in the North West, I am in the wilds of the west coast of Scotland and basically have one wine supplier who will deliver.

[dazco]

Hoover. said:

LooneyTunes said:

dazco said:

It will be the house red when my cafe bar opens

You've mentioned house wines for this venture a couple of times - don't take this the wrong way, but I'd be really careful about re-selling wines from supermarkets.

In many cases the label will say something along the lines of "selected and bottled for Sainsco". If you're selling full bottles then I'd put money on someone spotting that, being curious and finding out (or remembering from their own shopping) your purchase price, and then making waves about margins (which, even if reasonable, can still sound high to Joe Public).

Totally agree with this, also even if the name isn't on the bottle I've sometimes been out and recognised wines by the lable as on special on Sainsco... this also puts my back up....... I like to feel that I'm getting something specially and from my local supermarket.... just my opinion

Can you explain your thoughts? Is it because you saw the price and did not like the mark up or because the sourcing was a little 'lazy'

[Hoover.]

It's a mixture of both to be honest.

fair enough if you are serving as house red or white in a caraf as no one is any the wiser.... so long as it's half decent.

But anything else, you've gone out for a meal you don't want what you can get at home, you want it to feel different, and your getting something special..... so yeah getting a supermarket wine I'd feel cheated.... and be that I've popped out for Sunady lunch, or decided to have a glass of red instead of a pint or a special meal.......

I even feel cheated when I go to gig/concert and get given a can instead of a pint on tap.....may be it's just me.

[escargot]

Hoover. said:

It's a mixture of both to be honest.

fair enough if you are serving as house red or white in a caraf as no one is any the wiser.... so long as it's half decent.

But anything else, you've gone out for a meal you don't want what you can get at home, you want it to feel different, and your getting something special..... so yeah getting a supermarket wine I'd feel cheated.... and be that I've popped out for Sunady lunch, or decided to have a glass of red instead of a pint or a special meal.......

I even feel cheated when I go to gig/concert and get given a can instead of a pint on tap.....may be it's just me.

I'm the same to be honest. I remember going for a meal and the girl I was with wanted a bottle of rosé. The restaurant had ran out so the waiter popped over to the offy and picked up a £5 bottle of Jacobs creek or somesuch. I was a little peed off when they charged £15 for it, although conversely, also very happy they'd gone out of their way to satisfy a regular customer.