Weight training advice
Discussion
Right, its a new year and I want to properly put effort into the gym. I have been going to the gym for the past few years but never seemed to advance anywhere and this last year I ended up just sort of floating about. Spending an hour and half in the gym and just cobbling together random exercises. I want to change that, especially since I have access to probably the best gym I am ever going to have access to and for a bargain price (£20 a month!, some of you will have seen my image of PowerBase at Lboro Uni. That is where I go).
Now I don't think its a lack of exercises. The two links below, should they work, will show you exercises useful for swimmers of freestyle and backstroke. I am a swimmer myself and I enjoy sprints. To that end my goal is to improve general strength, core strength, explosive power and muscle endurance and bulk up slightly from low 70 kg (my natural weight) past the mid-high 70's (where I seem to get stuck) and into the low-mid 80's kg. Would also like to be able to do 3 sets of 10 wide grip pull ups (from fully extended to the top). At the moment I can do about 3 x 5. I am probably in-between ectomorphic and mesomorphic so I find it hard to gain, but easy to lose and I am not the strongest either, exasperated by long limbs.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bww7vkjigmdinrj/Weight%2...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/butiyei9ph3ojoi/corestre...
Now I have the exercises and I know where to find more! However, its stringing it all together in a way that works. There are many different ways to do these exercises beyond the standard 3 x 12 reps. I have recently been introduced drop sets (heavy weight till it hurts, swap to lighter weight and continue, swap when it hurts to even lighter weight etc etc) but they are not to be done all the time.
At the moment I try to go to the gym at least 2 times a week, but I know I should push for 3. I also try to about 60-90 minutes where 20-30minutes will be a core strength routine (different exercises every time, though I always get a set of planks in there) and then the rest will try to fit in some upper, some lower body work and some kind of plyometric/explosive exercise.
It is a bit of a rush if I am honest and I never get round to doing all that I want. Though I do try to make each session different so I am not just doing the same exercises at the same time, every time. I guess I shouldn't be doing it that way, but if I do one day upper, one day lower with core on both and a bit of plyo on both it feels like I am not doing enough.
Could anyone give me any help on bungling together a routine (from those exercises, 3 times a week) that I can get round and feel like I am actually working toward something. I guess having a log book and writing things down is the first step ( I dont do this currently). Also would it be beneficial to start taking some kind of basic supplement? bearing in mind I am not after body building!
Now I don't think its a lack of exercises. The two links below, should they work, will show you exercises useful for swimmers of freestyle and backstroke. I am a swimmer myself and I enjoy sprints. To that end my goal is to improve general strength, core strength, explosive power and muscle endurance and bulk up slightly from low 70 kg (my natural weight) past the mid-high 70's (where I seem to get stuck) and into the low-mid 80's kg. Would also like to be able to do 3 sets of 10 wide grip pull ups (from fully extended to the top). At the moment I can do about 3 x 5. I am probably in-between ectomorphic and mesomorphic so I find it hard to gain, but easy to lose and I am not the strongest either, exasperated by long limbs.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bww7vkjigmdinrj/Weight%2...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/butiyei9ph3ojoi/corestre...
Now I have the exercises and I know where to find more! However, its stringing it all together in a way that works. There are many different ways to do these exercises beyond the standard 3 x 12 reps. I have recently been introduced drop sets (heavy weight till it hurts, swap to lighter weight and continue, swap when it hurts to even lighter weight etc etc) but they are not to be done all the time.
At the moment I try to go to the gym at least 2 times a week, but I know I should push for 3. I also try to about 60-90 minutes where 20-30minutes will be a core strength routine (different exercises every time, though I always get a set of planks in there) and then the rest will try to fit in some upper, some lower body work and some kind of plyometric/explosive exercise.
It is a bit of a rush if I am honest and I never get round to doing all that I want. Though I do try to make each session different so I am not just doing the same exercises at the same time, every time. I guess I shouldn't be doing it that way, but if I do one day upper, one day lower with core on both and a bit of plyo on both it feels like I am not doing enough.
Could anyone give me any help on bungling together a routine (from those exercises, 3 times a week) that I can get round and feel like I am actually working toward something. I guess having a log book and writing things down is the first step ( I dont do this currently). Also would it be beneficial to start taking some kind of basic supplement? bearing in mind I am not after body building!
Hate to see a post getting no replies, but I can see why. This is not a short answer. Thinking of a routine and putting it in a thread post is a bit time consuming to say the least.
Does the gym have PT's there? Speak to them.
Ultimately what you need is a defined goal(s), a plan on how to get there and some routines with progression and overload.
You also need to properly discover your somatotype. This happens mostly by trial and error, so you need routines that work all parts of the spectrum that you can try over the next year or so (yes, it can take this long or longer).
Whereabouts in the midlands are you?
Does the gym have PT's there? Speak to them.
Ultimately what you need is a defined goal(s), a plan on how to get there and some routines with progression and overload.
You also need to properly discover your somatotype. This happens mostly by trial and error, so you need routines that work all parts of the spectrum that you can try over the next year or so (yes, it can take this long or longer).
Whereabouts in the midlands are you?
If you're struggling to determine what exercise to do that is sports specific then it would be recommended to get a PT for a couple of sessions. This allows you the opportunity to discuss what your needs/goals are.
Failing that buy some issues of Muscle & Fitness to pick up the core exercises to incorporate into your routine. Before each gym session, I have a clear goal and know beforehand 4 core exercises I want to do. As soon as I'm in the gym, 10mins warmup jog, stretches and then bang out the weights and get out of the gym ASAP.
I would compact the sessions to about an hour and make it intense as possible. 3/4 times a week would be more than enough. You already do a lot of swimming so you won't have to do too much cardio.
Failing that buy some issues of Muscle & Fitness to pick up the core exercises to incorporate into your routine. Before each gym session, I have a clear goal and know beforehand 4 core exercises I want to do. As soon as I'm in the gym, 10mins warmup jog, stretches and then bang out the weights and get out of the gym ASAP.
I would compact the sessions to about an hour and make it intense as possible. 3/4 times a week would be more than enough. You already do a lot of swimming so you won't have to do too much cardio.
There are guys in the gym on hand... Unsure as to whether they are PT's though. I may ask one of the guys who actually used to be a swimmer himself. He has completely transformed though as he went to the world of body building and he is indeed massive. Not sure he is trained with any sort of qualification, I think he just reads up and is self taught but he obviously knows whats what.
I do tend to ignore PT's though... A lot of them seem to spend more time waffling about that doing much useful and the last guy I asked about weight training for swimming had zero answers...he just didn't know.
I bought a note pad today and so I am going to write sets before I go to the gym. Will take on the advice about keeping it to an hour, but more intense. I have read a few times now that spending long periods in the gym isn't always useful. Indeed the intensity and short rest periods should add more of an endurance element. After all with swimming its about holding your body streamlined and keeping the stroke strong and powerful over long periods.
Will aim for 3 sessions a week. Core in each session (I do try to make most exercises have a core element as well so that the core is working all the time) and probably still keep a mixture of upper and lower body exercises for each. Though I will focus on a particular area for each session. Still need to shoehorn in some plyo exercises though, although to start with it should be about building fundamental strength before developing explosive power so I can worry about working those in later.
Will go find my 1 rep maxes on the next visit and then work from there. I guess (following Jason Lezaks example on bodybuilding.com...which I have tried before but found that it was rather samey doing the same exercises over and over) that I should set rep targets (increasing reps) for a few weeks before increasing weights?
Failing that I may just go find a PT who knows what he is talking about.
I do tend to ignore PT's though... A lot of them seem to spend more time waffling about that doing much useful and the last guy I asked about weight training for swimming had zero answers...he just didn't know.
I bought a note pad today and so I am going to write sets before I go to the gym. Will take on the advice about keeping it to an hour, but more intense. I have read a few times now that spending long periods in the gym isn't always useful. Indeed the intensity and short rest periods should add more of an endurance element. After all with swimming its about holding your body streamlined and keeping the stroke strong and powerful over long periods.
Will aim for 3 sessions a week. Core in each session (I do try to make most exercises have a core element as well so that the core is working all the time) and probably still keep a mixture of upper and lower body exercises for each. Though I will focus on a particular area for each session. Still need to shoehorn in some plyo exercises though, although to start with it should be about building fundamental strength before developing explosive power so I can worry about working those in later.
Will go find my 1 rep maxes on the next visit and then work from there. I guess (following Jason Lezaks example on bodybuilding.com...which I have tried before but found that it was rather samey doing the same exercises over and over) that I should set rep targets (increasing reps) for a few weeks before increasing weights?
Failing that I may just go find a PT who knows what he is talking about.
Otispunkmeyer said:
Failing that I may just go find a PT who knows what he is talking about.
Pffft. Good luck with that!There are tonnes of proven/established strength training routines on the net - stronglifts, starting strength, doggcrapp, texas method, boring but big, wendler 531........ do some reading, pick one, stick to it for a few months, if you dont like it try another one
pilchardthecat said:
Pffft. Good luck with that!
There are tonnes of proven/established strength training routines on the net - stronglifts, starting strength, doggcrapp, texas method, boring but big, wendler 531........ do some reading, pick one, stick to it for a few months, if you dont like it try another one
There are tonnes of proven/established strength training routines on the net - stronglifts, starting strength, doggcrapp, texas method, boring but big, wendler 531........ do some reading, pick one, stick to it for a few months, if you dont like it try another one
What he said. 
king-bosu-ball ..... heavy barbell squats and deadlifts. Ignore everyone, lift heavy things.
As per what the other guys said, compound exercises are your best friend. Deadlifts, straight leg deadlifts, squats (bar behind shoulder), hack squats, front squats (which allows you to get lower to work your quads), Bulgarian split squats (a 8ASTID one to do but brilliant at developing, strengthening your lower body aswell as getting your core involved with stabilization).
Power cleans, barbell overhead presses, bench press, wide grip pull ups, push ups and medicine ball jack knife are some core exercises I incorporate into my routine but to keep things interesting, I change my routines regularly to keep my body guessing.
Skipping and plyometrics box jumps with dumbells are also great for footspeed and explosiveness. I often combine this with all together on leg days towards the end just to kill my legs.
I normally only spend 20 mins on my abs once a week as most of the compounds will recruit your core/abs anyway. The healthy eating and cardio will take care of fat stripping.
Power cleans, barbell overhead presses, bench press, wide grip pull ups, push ups and medicine ball jack knife are some core exercises I incorporate into my routine but to keep things interesting, I change my routines regularly to keep my body guessing.
Skipping and plyometrics box jumps with dumbells are also great for footspeed and explosiveness. I often combine this with all together on leg days towards the end just to kill my legs.
I normally only spend 20 mins on my abs once a week as most of the compounds will recruit your core/abs anyway. The healthy eating and cardio will take care of fat stripping.
Excellent stuff guys
Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
amare32 said:
As per what the other guys said, compound exercises are your best friend. Deadlifts, straight leg deadlifts, squats (bar behind shoulder), hack squats, front squats (which allows you to get lower to work your quads), Bulgarian split squats (a 8ASTID one to do but brilliant at developing, strengthening your lower body aswell as getting your core involved with stabilization).
Power cleans, barbell overhead presses, bench press, wide grip pull ups, push ups and medicine ball jack knife are some core exercises I incorporate into my routine but to keep things interesting, I change my routines regularly to keep my body guessing.
Skipping and plyometrics box jumps with dumbells are also great for footspeed and explosiveness. I often combine this with all together on leg days towards the end just to kill my legs.
I normally only spend 20 mins on my abs once a week as most of the compounds will recruit your core/abs anyway. The healthy eating and cardio will take care of fat stripping.
Thanks. Some core ones i like are the posterior chain, the plank (on gym ball and feet on one of those squishy discs...proper unsettling, especially when I tried it on a cruise ship once), and something similar to Jack knife's but as you roll the ball back out, you lift a leg off the ball, tuck the knee to the chest then rotate 90 deg so it passed under you. A set of 3 x 10 of these (5 each side) I find pretty hard.Power cleans, barbell overhead presses, bench press, wide grip pull ups, push ups and medicine ball jack knife are some core exercises I incorporate into my routine but to keep things interesting, I change my routines regularly to keep my body guessing.
Skipping and plyometrics box jumps with dumbells are also great for footspeed and explosiveness. I often combine this with all together on leg days towards the end just to kill my legs.
I normally only spend 20 mins on my abs once a week as most of the compounds will recruit your core/abs anyway. The healthy eating and cardio will take care of fat stripping.
Love doing box jumps... I seem to have quite springy legs. Though when you wear one of those lead vests it becomes massively harder!
Otispunkmeyer said:
Excellent stuff guys
Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
Front squats target the quads more, but are otherwise inferior in every way. They are also thought to put too much stress on the knees. Proper back squats hit the quads plus the glutes, hams, hips, back and core. Google "Mark Rippetoe squat technique" his videos helped me enormously - i could barely get my legs parallel, now i can get to about 20-30 degrees below.Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
pilchardthecat said:
Otispunkmeyer said:
Excellent stuff guys
Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
Front squats target the quads more, but are otherwise inferior in every way. They are also thought to put too much stress on the knees. Proper back squats hit the quads plus the glutes, hams, hips, back and core. Google "Mark Rippetoe squat technique" his videos helped me enormously - i could barely get my legs parallel, now i can get to about 20-30 degrees below.Seems that a general thought is that sticking to, I guess, the basic/simple/core exercises (ignoring the fancy stuff like upside down kettle bell fisting) is a good direction to go for general strength conditioning.
I did mean to ask what the difference is between doing a barbell squat with the bar across the top of your back/shoulders and doing one with the bar bell across the top of your biceps was. Is it just that it works the top of your legs more?
Still this is what I hate about weight lifting. Its exactly as ambiguous, wishy wash and sprinkled with smart sounding bull squirt as cooking recipes are. Everyone's got their own ideas of what the ingredients are, how much there should be and how it should be mixed. Its then garnished with a load of pseudo-science rubbish as way of making it sound better.
Is there anywhere or anyone who just explains, straight and honest, good wholesome techniques or range of movements for lifting weights for simple, general strength?
Otispunkmeyer said:
Is there anywhere or anyone who just explains, straight and honest, good wholesome techniques or range of movements for lifting weights for simple, general strength?
Loads of people! And each says something slightly different- but that's part of the learning process. What one person says is the right way, may not work for you. Do the movements, see what works for you. They're not hard to pick up TBH.Suck it and see.
I agree, I usually watch one of these helpful videos and then get straight at it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_oLhHQIrQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN_oLhHQIrQ
PTs aren't all bad, there are some in these pages I listen to when I ask questions. 
For the best answers Mark Ripptoe is as good as you can get/as they come. I love his instructional videos. They are ace. I also like Starting Strength.
There are other illustrious names;
Christian Thibaudeau
Bill Starr
Dan John
Jason Ferruggia
Tony Gentilcore
Eric Cressey
Mike Boyle
Mike Robertson
John Romaniello
Louie Simmons
Joseph Lightfoot
Ben Bruno
Alex Ferentinos
Ben Coomber
Ross Enamait.
Otispunkmeyer said:
Thanks. Some core ones i like are the posterior chain, the plank (on gym ball and feet on one of those squishy discs...proper unsettling, especially when I tried it on a cruise ship once), and something similar to Jack knife's but as you roll the ball back out, you lift a leg off the ball, tuck the knee to the chest then rotate 90 deg so it passed under you. A set of 3 x 10 of these (5 each side) I find pretty hard.
Love doing box jumps... I seem to have quite springy legs. Though when you wear one of those lead vests it becomes massively harder!
Fore core I like things like plank, jackknives. I have squat and deadlifted heavy, but I still think suspended (body under constant work) training is one of the best ways to work the 'core'. Walking planks, spiderman crawls, KB workouts, working that core for time as opposed to short massive weight exertions. Maybe using a suspension cord of some sort, powerhweel or deathcrawls over a field.Love doing box jumps... I seem to have quite springy legs. Though when you wear one of those lead vests it becomes massively harder!
Otispunkmeyer said:
...there seems to be lots of contention with what he says! Different schools of thought though so if it works for a particular person great! if not then try something else.
Is there anywhere or anyone who just explains, straight and honest, good wholesome techniques or range of movements for lifting weights for simple, general strength?
Maths is the only science where you get definitive answers.Is there anywhere or anyone who just explains, straight and honest, good wholesome techniques or range of movements for lifting weights for simple, general strength?
For the best answers Mark Ripptoe is as good as you can get/as they come. I love his instructional videos. They are ace. I also like Starting Strength.
There are other illustrious names;
Christian Thibaudeau
Bill Starr
Dan John
Jason Ferruggia
Tony Gentilcore
Eric Cressey
Mike Boyle
Mike Robertson
John Romaniello
Louie Simmons
Joseph Lightfoot
Ben Bruno
Alex Ferentinos
Ben Coomber
Ross Enamait.
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