Authors: Advice on publishing a book, please?
Discussion
I have had it in mind to write a book, for a very long long time. Two actually, one for kids, one for bigger more growed up peoples.
The children's book I'd like to write this year. The adventures of a naughty house mouse.
It's my understanding and belief that, the author of any uncommissioned work, remains unrewarded and unknown, unless tremendous luck befalls him.
The success of J K Rolly Polly or whatever her name is, usually comes after 250 rejections. Is there anyone here with a wisp of experience, willing to outline the core of a successful publication? What percentage of time goes into polishing the wireframe model, the story itself, and the finding a publisher bit?
I'm very confident I will fail, it's my understanding that becoming a published author is as easy as becoming a famous actress. I knew plenty, they all went to drama school, had a vision etc, but it is only the select few minority who make more than a penny or two (ie do well) from their lifetime of efforts.
So yes. I'm completely prepared for failure, but I don't wish for it.
My naughty mouse learns to fly, and he can even (legitimately) turn invisible, plus he finds out in the end he isn't actually naughty, what can I do to ensure the best possible chance of him being published before I die?
The children's book I'd like to write this year. The adventures of a naughty house mouse.
It's my understanding and belief that, the author of any uncommissioned work, remains unrewarded and unknown, unless tremendous luck befalls him.
The success of J K Rolly Polly or whatever her name is, usually comes after 250 rejections. Is there anyone here with a wisp of experience, willing to outline the core of a successful publication? What percentage of time goes into polishing the wireframe model, the story itself, and the finding a publisher bit?
I'm very confident I will fail, it's my understanding that becoming a published author is as easy as becoming a famous actress. I knew plenty, they all went to drama school, had a vision etc, but it is only the select few minority who make more than a penny or two (ie do well) from their lifetime of efforts.
So yes. I'm completely prepared for failure, but I don't wish for it.
My naughty mouse learns to fly, and he can even (legitimately) turn invisible, plus he finds out in the end he isn't actually naughty, what can I do to ensure the best possible chance of him being published before I die?
www.lulu.com
It is so easy - my wife managed to write and publish a book about her obsession with radio, and got nearly 1000 people to buy it. ISBN, Amazon listings, all there. Good luck!
It is so easy - my wife managed to write and publish a book about her obsession with radio, and got nearly 1000 people to buy it. ISBN, Amazon listings, all there. Good luck!
Its now quite easy.
Kindle is your friend & is an easy route. You do need to proof read & get it done several times by friends etc. The review system is very useful. Send links to your download to various parties & hopefully good reviews follow. Builds the momentum.
A friend of mine published a childrens story last year via Kindle. He's now looking at 2 hard copy publishers after his second installment & his first book is being hard copy published now for release at Easter.
Its no Harry Potter but its selling quite well.
Kindle d/load cost is about £3.60 with author getting about 70% of that IIRC.
Kindle is your friend & is an easy route. You do need to proof read & get it done several times by friends etc. The review system is very useful. Send links to your download to various parties & hopefully good reviews follow. Builds the momentum.
A friend of mine published a childrens story last year via Kindle. He's now looking at 2 hard copy publishers after his second installment & his first book is being hard copy published now for release at Easter.
Its no Harry Potter but its selling quite well.
Kindle d/load cost is about £3.60 with author getting about 70% of that IIRC.
Many publishers don't accept manuscripts sent directly to them, and instead will only look at stuff sent in by an agent. If you want hard copies printed it will be worth tracking down a decent agent willing to represent you; a Google search should throw up quite a few results. Good luck!
Get a copy of the writer's and artist's yearbook (link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Childrens-Writers-Artists-... )
This has a fair bit of info about what publishers and agents are looking for.
Also, check out some blogs on agent websites. 2 examples are: Curtis Brown and Darley Anderson.
Proof, polish, then polish again. It is a very competitive market, but still open for new authors.
Best of luck
This has a fair bit of info about what publishers and agents are looking for.
Also, check out some blogs on agent websites. 2 examples are: Curtis Brown and Darley Anderson.
Proof, polish, then polish again. It is a very competitive market, but still open for new authors.
Best of luck
ofcorsa said:
I'm not sure the ebook route would work with a childrens book?
I'm clever with pencils sometimes, but not a proper artist. I'm prepared to put my neck on the block and even say - I don't think kindle accepts photos, I've not seen any in dozen kindle (phone) books I've downloaded. I'd love to try and illustrate my book but I'd be better off working with a proper illustrator. I'd like to get the book right, not just have a bash.I'm a creative and latterly thinking individual, enough I hope, not to need instruction on story construction... I may fall flat on my face, the experience will be positive I would hope, enjoyable anyway. But an author who has succeeded will have answers to questions I haven't even thought of. Is there a place to go, for this feedback and advice?
My questions were largely statistical, analysis.
I liked picture books as a kid. Do they sell doubly well?
A publisher might have this information.
Is there a log of accepted and rejected documents, I'd does penguin publish a figure which indicates why it declines books and the number of those submitted to those rejected?
I'm doing a very poor job of trying to explain, what I think i would like is, a proper chat with or 60 minute lecture upon the publishing process. I hear the comments about kindle and digital, and I'll reread them all, bit to my inexperienced eye, kindle books on amazon are a method and technology of amazon retailing another persons work, their only cost being the time it takes an employed quality control reader to analyse two pages at random.
Digital etc opens one up to the world, but it doesn't facilitate success, in an ultimate sense.
I'm 98% sure my book will never become what I would term successful.
I reserve 1% just in case
And another 1% to poke up the nasal passages of opponents I might meet on the way.
I suppose what I want is a few hours consultancy, how to ride your bicycle. Is there such a thing as a book writing consultant, who isn't motivated by the promise of a pound of flesh?
Two guys at work just published with Amazon - it's a teckie book, so will never sell thousands. The price for their book was something like £44 with them getting a royalty for each book of something like £30 between them.
It's sounds ideal - as the books are printed when ordered. So the Author(s) do not need to have hundreds of copies printed.
Seems like a great modern way.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/seller-account/mm-summary...
It's sounds ideal - as the books are printed when ordered. So the Author(s) do not need to have hundreds of copies printed.
Seems like a great modern way.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/seller-account/mm-summary...
Mobsta said:
I'm clever with pencils sometimes, but not a proper artist. I'm prepared to put my neck on the block and even say - I don't think kindle accepts photos, I've not seen any in dozen kindle (phone) books I've downloaded. I'd love to try and illustrate my book but I'd be better off working with a proper illustrator. I'd like to get the book right, not just have a bash.
A friend of mine wrote a couple of illustrated children's book some years ago, with drawings of the characters in. He consulted literary agents and professionals at the time and the advice he was given was that publishers wouldn't consider printing expensive picture books until the author was established in his own right. This was before the advent of ebooks. The original Kindle does display black and white photos albeit not brilliantly. The latest e-readers such as the Kindle Fire will have no problems with colour photos and given the popularity of tablets, e-books would appear to be the best way forward.
Best advice I can give is to write the book before worrying about how you get it published. I wish OP every success but don't fall into the trap of the two journalists at a party..one says "I'm writing a book " and the other replies "Yeah, neither am I" . I have two books in print and all I can say is stick at it and don't get too down when you get a rejection slip- keep trying !
coppice said:
I have two books in print and all I can say is stick at it and don't get too down when you get a rejection slip- keep trying !
I'd love to hear more about how you managed to get it in print - the first few chapters of my (completed) first manuscript are with a few agents now and I'm in that horrible waiting period before they accept / reject / ridicule.Simple- find publishers who do similar stuff and write to them with your manuscript. The hard bit is finding the right one and the even harder bit
is producing something which people want to read and therefore publisher can sell. Rejection doesn't necessarily mean you have written a crap book - just that the person who read it at publishers takes the view that not enough people will buy it
is producing something which people want to read and therefore publisher can sell. Rejection doesn't necessarily mean you have written a crap book - just that the person who read it at publishers takes the view that not enough people will buy it
I'd agree that writing the book is the first step.
I don't know much about kids books but I know that it's very hard to get published unless you're one of the following
1. Famous
2. Already published.
3. Have an agent.
4. Do it yourself.
I chose option 4. I set up a publishing company and used Lightning Source (the printers LuLu - who were mentioned earlier - use; they cost half the LuLu price). They'll get your book into the two main wholesalers; Bertrams or Gardners, who you have to be with for someone like Waterstones to take it. On the down side, you have to make sure you can sell your book for 40% of cover price and still make a profit because people like Waterstones want 40% and the wholesalers take 20%. On the upside, they won't take it if you're not in the wholesalers and without someone like Lightning behind you it's very hard to get in.
Make sure you know how many pages the average book in your target market comprises, that you know how much it costs and that you can print yours for 40% of whatever the usual publishing price is.
Do e-books but don't expect to get anywhere. The internet is full of book places inhabited exclusively by authors. Finding somebody who reads and doesn't write on line is about as likely as treading in unicorn pooh.
Once your book is out, make an AI sheet - google that - and try to get into some independent stores. Try to get into your local newspapers; where you live, where you grew up... blimey, where you once broke down. Try to get to book clubs, schools, libraries...
Matador are good if you want to print off say, 400 and try to place them yourself.
Oh and the golden rule... if you do it yourself, hire an editor. Seriously, that's the one thing you really need to pay for.
I hope those ideas help. Good luck!
Cheers
MTM
I don't know much about kids books but I know that it's very hard to get published unless you're one of the following
1. Famous
2. Already published.
3. Have an agent.
4. Do it yourself.
I chose option 4. I set up a publishing company and used Lightning Source (the printers LuLu - who were mentioned earlier - use; they cost half the LuLu price). They'll get your book into the two main wholesalers; Bertrams or Gardners, who you have to be with for someone like Waterstones to take it. On the down side, you have to make sure you can sell your book for 40% of cover price and still make a profit because people like Waterstones want 40% and the wholesalers take 20%. On the upside, they won't take it if you're not in the wholesalers and without someone like Lightning behind you it's very hard to get in.
Make sure you know how many pages the average book in your target market comprises, that you know how much it costs and that you can print yours for 40% of whatever the usual publishing price is.
Do e-books but don't expect to get anywhere. The internet is full of book places inhabited exclusively by authors. Finding somebody who reads and doesn't write on line is about as likely as treading in unicorn pooh.
Once your book is out, make an AI sheet - google that - and try to get into some independent stores. Try to get into your local newspapers; where you live, where you grew up... blimey, where you once broke down. Try to get to book clubs, schools, libraries...
Matador are good if you want to print off say, 400 and try to place them yourself.
Oh and the golden rule... if you do it yourself, hire an editor. Seriously, that's the one thing you really need to pay for.
I hope those ideas help. Good luck!
Cheers
MTM
Mobsta said:
I have had it in mind to write a book, for a very long long time. Two actually, one for kids, one for bigger more growed up peoples.
The children's book I'd like to write this year. The adventures of a naughty house mouse.
It's my understanding and belief that, the author of any uncommissioned work, remains unrewarded and unknown, unless tremendous luck befalls him.
The success of J K Rolly Polly or whatever her name is, usually comes after 250 rejections. Is there anyone here with a wisp of experience, willing to outline the core of a successful publication? What percentage of time goes into polishing the wireframe model, the story itself, and the finding a publisher bit?
I'm very confident I will fail, it's my understanding that becoming a published author is as easy as becoming a famous actress. I knew plenty, they all went to drama school, had a vision etc, but it is only the select few minority who make more than a penny or two (ie do well) from their lifetime of efforts.
So yes. I'm completely prepared for failure, but I don't wish for it.
My naughty mouse learns to fly, and he can even (legitimately) turn invisible, plus he finds out in the end he isn't actually naughty, what can I do to ensure the best possible chance of him being published before I die?
You may have seen in my 'Noah's Ark' thread that I've just had my book published, so I'll tell you what I can. Bear in mind that my publisher is tiny, fairly new and doesn't have the marketing or editing budget of the big boys.The children's book I'd like to write this year. The adventures of a naughty house mouse.
It's my understanding and belief that, the author of any uncommissioned work, remains unrewarded and unknown, unless tremendous luck befalls him.
The success of J K Rolly Polly or whatever her name is, usually comes after 250 rejections. Is there anyone here with a wisp of experience, willing to outline the core of a successful publication? What percentage of time goes into polishing the wireframe model, the story itself, and the finding a publisher bit?
I'm very confident I will fail, it's my understanding that becoming a published author is as easy as becoming a famous actress. I knew plenty, they all went to drama school, had a vision etc, but it is only the select few minority who make more than a penny or two (ie do well) from their lifetime of efforts.
So yes. I'm completely prepared for failure, but I don't wish for it.
My naughty mouse learns to fly, and he can even (legitimately) turn invisible, plus he finds out in the end he isn't actually naughty, what can I do to ensure the best possible chance of him being published before I die?
The market is so insanely competitive and publishers aren't willing to take risks. Unfortunately, unless you are a celebrity or writing the flavour of the month, finding a publisher is a long, heart-breaking task. But not impossible.
First thing's first; write your book. After that, leave it for a few months, then go through it, brutally. The editing process is far more time-consuming than the actual writing, and you will go through your work two or three times before ending up with something completely unlike the original. The fairy tale ideal of writing 'the end' and sending the manuscript to a publisher is just not true (any more).
It can even be worth hiring a professional editor to vet your work too. The amount of money you can spend will correlate to the intensity of the edit - as I have found with my small publisher, they could not justify the amount of time to edit to the level that is ideal. A big publisher will have editors that become very heavily involved with how the final book reads - some people reckon you can tell which editor has been at work with certain books.
Once you're satisfied, you need to get pitching. The Writers and Artists Yearbook lists all the mainstream agents and publishers, which it's worth pitching to even if the chances are slim. Send your manuscript EXACTLY as they ask for it - any different and it's in the bin. You are unlikely to hear back from most of the agents, but if you do get a personalised rejection - particularly if it contains editorial suggestions - be happy, because they will only do this if they think your work has promise.
Chances are you'll have exhausted all the mainstream avenues and so it'll be the turn of the smaller publishers. You can - unlike the big 'uns - approach them directly without an agent in most cases, but the same rules apply; do exactly as they require. Submission windows are usually small too, so check back every now and then so you don't miss them. You can find small publishers by googling, or by checking the publisher listing on similar books on amazon. DO NOT accept a contract with a publisher who asks you for fees.
This whole process can take months and it can take years. Listen to what the professionals say about your work, good or bad, and don't give up. Good luck!
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