PAS Fubar

[gruffalo]

OK so PAS seems to have thrown a wobbly, haven't looked at the reason yet but I am thinking if it is the pump then I will go electric.

What pump should I buy and what are peoples experience of electric PAS on a Cerbera.

[grahamn]

My PAS failed a couple of times, woodruff key both times. Had it changed a couple of years ago, and had no problems with it since. One advantage is the PAS comes on with the ignition so easy to manoeuvre the car without the engine on.

[gruffalo]

Has it effected the feel or feed back through the syeering at all.

How is your head?

[ridds]

Had mine fitted for 6 years now, great modification. The steering with the engine off is VERY useful.

Some say that the feel is a little lighter but tbh I think it's fine. My PAS never worked off the engine pump and so I never really got used to the 'feel' of my car before the EPAS but I certainly wouldn't complain about feedback or weight.

The one thing I would recommend is fitting a cooler though. My fluid gets very hot on long drives and makes the system become week. Not good for the rack or pump either.

[jamieduff1981]

Mine has electric PAS. Don't like it at all. Infact, I'm seriously considering just disconnecting it electrically. I'd rather not have it than have what it is at the moment.

I don't know how the hydraulic compares because it was changed before I bought it, but when I eventually remove the body for chassis refurbishment, I intend to convert it back to proper hydraulic PAS.

The negatives are:

Steering weight varies with engine RPM
Lights go dim when steering

The postives are:

Something about a woodruff key


IMHO electric power steering is crap and should never have been invented.

2p supplied.

[ridds]

jamieduff1981 said:

Mine has electric PAS. Don't like it at all. Infact, I'm seriously considering just disconnecting it electrically. I'd rather not have it than have what it is at the moment.

I don't know how the hydraulic compares because it was changed before I bought it, but when I eventually remove the body for chassis refurbishment, I intend to convert it back to proper hydraulic PAS.

The negatives are:

Steering weight varies with engine RPM
Lights go dim when steering

The postives are:

Something about a woodruff key


IMHO electric power steering is crap and should never have been invented.

2p supplied.

Sounds like your system has issues tbh as my lights don't go dim when I steer. How is it wired? Does it have a separate relay controlled feed from the battery? What system is it? Corsa Electric steering column or Electro Hydraulic?

Mine is a 106/Saxo Electro Hydraulic pump and can't fault it tbh

[jamieduff1981]

I dunno - it's apparently whatever was fitted to the Sagaris but I find that hard to believe - or at least the way it's wired up. Having said that, having seen the previous mechanic's handiwork on the drivetrain there's a reasonable chance it's just been done wrong.

I'll have a look into it. If there's a way of wiring it so it works properly then I may be in less of a hurry to get rid.

In fairness, the battery wasn't in a great state of charge initially but after a good refill with fresh electricity it doesn't seem quite so bad, although it's definately aggrevated by the Cerbera's alternator which doesn't really get going until near 1200rpm or so (roughly / still settling in with it). It's most noticeable parking it. Depending on whether you're on the power or not the car behaves like it does or doesn't have PAS. My wife commented on it immediately she tried to reverse into our driveway.

[grahamn]

gruffalo said:

How is your head?

Got home ok, now need to get it to Matt's for a strip down and see what the damage is.

[anonymous-user]

ridds said:

jamieduff1981 said:

Mine has electric PAS. Don't like it at all. Infact, I'm seriously considering just disconnecting it electrically. I'd rather not have it than have what it is at the moment.

I don't know how the hydraulic compares because it was changed before I bought it, but when I eventually remove the body for chassis refurbishment, I intend to convert it back to proper hydraulic PAS.

The negatives are:

Steering weight varies with engine RPM
Lights go dim when steering

The postives are:

Something about a woodruff key


IMHO electric power steering is crap and should never have been invented.

2p supplied.

Sounds like your system has issues tbh as my lights don't go dim when I steer. How is it wired? Does it have a separate relay controlled feed from the battery? What system is it? Corsa Electric steering column or Electro Hydraulic?

Mine is a 106/Saxo Electro Hydraulic pump and can't fault it tbh

I only test drove a couple of mechanical PAS Cerbs, so comparing the Citroen PAS in mine is a little tenuous, but in comparison to my 3 Series, at speed (70-90), it does feel too light. I dont notice much difference from low speed to high speed feel or "weightiness" (if thats the word), which is a little disconcerting. It's something Ive discussed briefly with APM and will be looking at as mine slowly goes back together.

[gruffalo]

thanks for the feed back chaps, looks like the Saxo pump is the way forward, and just found a place that sells them for £170 inc a 2 year warantee, a lot cheaper than taking the engine out and fixing the original pump.

[ridds]

jamieduff1981 said:

I dunno - it's apparently whatever was fitted to the Sagaris but I find that hard to believe - or at least the way it's wired up. Having said that, having seen the previous mechanic's handiwork on the drivetrain there's a reasonable chance it's just been done wrong.

I'll have a look into it. If there's a way of wiring it so it works properly then I may be in less of a hurry to get rid.

In fairness, the battery wasn't in a great state of charge initially but after a good refill with fresh electricity it doesn't seem quite so bad, although it's definately aggrevated by the Cerbera's alternator which doesn't really get going until near 1200rpm or so (roughly / still settling in with it). It's most noticeable parking it. Depending on whether you're on the power or not the car behaves like it does or doesn't have PAS. My wife commented on it immediately she tried to reverse into our driveway.

tbh that does sound like a bad install. You would really struggle to tell the difference on mine from a standard one.

[ridds]

gruffalo said:

thanks for the feed back chaps, looks like the Saxo pump is the way forward, and just found a place that sells them for £170 inc a 2 year warantee, a lot cheaper than taking the engine out and fixing the original pump.

Or get one off ebay for £59

ebay

Even comes with the reservoir if you can't be bothered to plumb it into the original pot.

[gruffalo]

ridds said:

gruffalo said:

thanks for the feed back chaps, looks like the Saxo pump is the way forward, and just found a place that sells them for £170 inc a 2 year warantee, a lot cheaper than taking the engine out and fixing the original pump.

Or get one off ebay for £59

ebay

Even comes with the reservoir if you can't be bothered to plumb it into the original pot.

I saw that one but thought I would go for a remanufactured one in the interests of reliability.

[gerradiuk]

i wonder if the one from a fiat Stilo/punto would fit as they have the city/sport function. My old Stilo is quite nicely weighted & is a breeze to park on city.

[ridds]

Depends how it's wired in. Better do some swatting up on CAN as it may use that to communicate. Then you'll probably need the ECUs etc. Could however just be a voltage switch.